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Michael Masi gets fired/replaced?

Discussion in 'F1' started by surfwolf, Dec 12, 2021.

  1. Bas

    Bas Three Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    A 1 lap "race" between 2 cars with 5 inbetween isn't really much of a "race" is it?

    Why are you not equally upset when Toto successfully lobbied Masi to NOT have a SC after Max pitted mid race when 2 cars retired on track and Mercedes stayed out?
     
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  3. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Rookie
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    How about this as a reasoned, logical explanation as opposed to the hysterical, conspiracy theory-fueled nonsense about favouring one driver over another:

    No cars unlapping themselves was obviously done to protect the safety of the marshals attending to the stricken car of Latifi. This is normal protocol at the beginning of a SC and the reason for this is pretty obvious. You may want to dispute this as being overly cautious but that’s what the procedure has always been since the SC was introduced.

    After Latifi’s car was removed and they assessed that they could get a restart done, they assessed that (following procedures) they could start cars unlapping themselves safely, per standard procedure. Having said this they obviously realized that having the whole field of lapped cars to unlap themselves may have affected the restart plan, and do to avoid another non-race finish like at Spa they just had the tightly bunched group of cars between P1 and P2 unlap themselves.

    All this was done with the pressure of millions of viewers watching and nevertheless pretty impressive how they managed this considering how the situation was evolving second by second.
     
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  4. ktu

    ktu F1 Rookie

    May 30, 2012
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    Pressure? I don't care if billions of viewers watching. The rule book is there to follow. If you follow the rules there should be no pressure. It's there in front of you, just follow. No matter how you look at it Masi screwed up. He had multople options to finish under green. He choose to break the rules.
     
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  5. william

    william F1 World Champ
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    If they were the positions of the 2 leaders prior to the interruption, I can't see why suddenly it wouldn't be a race when it resumes.

    It's that reshuffling that is odd. Why a race director has the right to reposition (some) cars in a race?

    I cannot get my head around that, and many people feel the same. If you artificially remove obstacles for one driver, you obviously penalise the other.

    After all, dealing with backmarkers is part and parcel of racing, is it not?

    OK, your pet driver won the race, we get that, but Masi has created a dangerous precedent that can decide the outcome of future races.

    The "error" cannot be corrected, but the culprit should be removed from his responsabilities.
     
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  6. william

    william F1 World Champ
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    LOL

    You are definitely clutching straw here!!

    Funny all the same ...
     
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  8. Bas

    Bas Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Like already discussed a million times now, you lot apparently wouldn't have had a problem if ALL cars could unlap, despite the results being absolutely identical, and no other driver has been impacted in a meaningful way.

    You are still absolutely fine with Toto manipulating Masi to NOT give a SC after Mercedes decided not to pit but Max did in the middle of the race. Riddle me that?
     
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  9. william

    william F1 World Champ
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    Had it been Vertappen deprived of a deserved win, his supporters would still create merry hell right now.

    But it happened to the hated Hamilton, so he deserves that treatment, and Masi is their hero.

    They cannot find enough excuse to justify that fix; it's really funny to read.
     
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  10. ktu

    ktu F1 Rookie

    May 30, 2012
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    And they say they're real F1 fans who cherish the F1 days before Netflix, but they support this farce! Lol
     
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  11. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    I think folks should always be given a second chance.
     
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  13. kraftwerk

    kraftwerk Two Time F1 World Champ

    May 12, 2007
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    You lost me at Masi did nothing wrong, so I read nothing further, as it would be pointless exercise.

    And you can assume the reason for that is I don't live in cloud cuckoo land, the numerous threads and posts on the subject of Masi tells me his decision making leaves a lot to be desired.

    However feel free to ignore that fact, and just blame it on all the die hard Ham fans, it makes no it odds to me.
     
  14. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
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    At the risk of getting all P&R here we are more than a month after the event and the same arguments are still being spouted and no-one is changing their view: its no different to who did win the last few US elections ?
     
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  15. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Veteran
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    Its over, no one died, get over it!!
     
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  16. william

    william F1 World Champ
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    With Hamilton keeping quiet, people are guessing his new hair style for 2022 ... :p

    The thing is, until the new cars presentations and the first tests, there is nothing to talk about! :(

    In a few weeks' time, we will have some people discussing the new liveries as if that was important. :oops:

    Then, there will be the speculations about Mercedes sandbagging after the officials tests. o_O

    In between, we may learn who's Masi's replacement. ;)
     
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  17. absostone

    absostone F1 Veteran
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    Well, one guy died inside.
     
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  18. ktu

    ktu F1 Rookie

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    Thats what I said after Max Silverstone crash.
     
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  19. Phil~

    Phil~ F1 Rookie

    Aug 25, 2013
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    Thank you for being honest.

    It would be indeed not be much of an exciting race, but according to established precedent and extent sporting regulations, it would be legal. It would satisfy all over riding conditions and regulations.

    What happened in Abu Dhabi is exactly as you described: Rules where changed or circumvented for optics, theater, the show, not sporting regulation in pursuit of safe and fair racing.

    Is this a fair assessment of your position?

    And as an aside, I agree with you that Toto complaining was one of the most annoying part of the entire debacle. That safety car lobby should have gotten him banned.
     
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  20. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    So this was ok in terms of rules and Spa was not LOL. F1 and the FIA - need to fix the rules. Spa was a joke, Yas was the avoidable joke just based on precedent. If Max would have lost the way LH did the outcry would have been WORSE LOL. Both Toto and Hubby Spice needed to just shut it. They agree now to do so. Should not have been allowed to begin with.
     
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  21. Bas

    Bas Three Time F1 World Champ

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    But again, we rotate back to the point where the FIA and teams collectively agreed to finish under green. This wouldn't be discussed by them unless the teams and the FIA expected to potentially make exceptions in order to finish green (otherwise they'd just finish green regardless).

    Unlapping is a very normal thing to happen. If all cars did unlap the Hamilton fans would still be screeching till the end of time that Lewis' championship was taken away. They don't care that the opportunity was taken away that Vettel could potentially have finished in 10th. The moment the cars where allowed to overtake, Masi became public enemy number 1 for them, whether it was one car or 10.

    Mercedes benefitted hugely from lobbying Masi/FIA in regards to the Red Bull front wing, the bizarre pitstop regulations, lobbying Masi to not have Safety Cars as it didn't suit them. The outrage is faked, because only now Hamilton supporters are standing on their hind legs demanding Masi to be sacked when previously they kept quiet or indeed kept arguing "rules is rules" whenever it suited them.

    FWIW, 3 of the cars in between Hamilton and Max where either Mercedes powered or Mercedes managed. Oh wouldn't it be super convenient for any of them to have a slow restart, allow Lewis to scamper away before the SC line is crossed and Max lagging behind 10 seconds.

    Mercedes is making a lot of noise because they tried to play it safe. This race the FIA listened to Mercedes' orders at least once (no idea if Mercedes was also involved in talking to FIA for the lap 1 track cut, but I have very little doubt that they then too did their very best to make clear that no penalty should be given). Whether they where cocky and expected the FIA to once again listen to Mercedes and finish under SC, or just didn't want to take the chance pitting Lewis in case they repeated Monaco 2021, we'll never know, but it's clear Mercedes messed up the strategy good and proper. They made it much worse for themselves by not pitting (yes, they had the gap), and Lewis later fully messed it up when he didn't anticipate Max's attack and didn't defend.

    Ever since then Mercedes and Lewis fans have been trying to take away Max's championship or the value of the championship.
     
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  22. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Rookie
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    Wow, yelling in bold, LOL. Must make SOME odds to you, don’t you think?

    Frankly, I care less about Max winning or Masi maybe losing his job—makes no difference to me. I do enjoy watching the HAM fans tearing their hair out though.

    What I can’t stand is coming to FChat and having to read inane, uninformed, wacky comments about a sudden conspiracy against a guy and team that did as they pleased for 8 years. Completely uninformed comments like regurgitating the Toto claim of 0.2 mm measured on wing DRS gap which is not even measured, but checked with a gauge that can even be forced through the gap and fail—per the rules!—and which in the case of the Merc just slid through; or that suddenly, there’s a plan to “engineer” a win for one guy when nobody knew who would pit or not for new tires. And even then some drivers showed how they were able to defend with old tires.

    And ultimately, the FIA defended Masi because he did nothing against the rules and Merc weren’t even able to appeal the outcome. Maybe the new guy will fire Masi to appease the whiners at Merc but, HAM fans, he still lost the 2021 championship. So get over it and get over yourselves.
     
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  23. surfwolf

    surfwolf Formula 3
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    Get over yourself! What a pompous erroneous opinion/statement......
    Your view is NOT correct, or important. Other than to YOU!
     
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  24. Terra

    Terra F1 Rookie
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    And, to boot, the situation of the lapped cars directly between Max and Sainz it being allowed to unlap, created a protective buffer for Max (i.e. meaning Max wouldn’t be under any pressure from Sainz on the restart). So LH had to worry about defending and Max didn’t. All thanks to Masi’s improvised actions.
     
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  25. Bas

    Bas Three Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    Sainz? The car that was nearly a second down in quali Sainz?

    To be fair, Lewis didn't worry about defending at all regardless.
     
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  26. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Rookie
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    Once again, the facts of the matter prove that I AM correct: Max won and the result stands. You also know I’m right and nothing you write can change the result and it’s making you crazy so you resort to personal insults.

    And, you’re right, doesn’t matter to me but it does matter to Max, HAM and, for some reason, all the HAM fans/apologists, ha-ha.

    To better understand why your perception of the situation is clearly at odds with reality, you need to understand where your bias originates. For example, you most likely bought into the Toto BS excuse that they failed the DRS gap test in Brazil by 0.2 mm and that poor Lulu was so hard done by that and more conspiracy BS, right?

    Did stop and think that, firstly, the test for the DRS gap is not an absolute measurement so whatever he said is completely irrelevant? Secondly, even if it was relevant, a rule is a rule—all the teams are acutely aware of this and have been for years—and here Toto believed that he was entitled enough to be granted a pass on a failed? So he did what he does best and deflect and play the poor victim card. Just like when HAM stated (and mispronounced) that the race was “manipAlated, man!” LOL. This is the BS spin you’re buying into because of your HAM bias.
     
  27. TonyL

    TonyL F1 Rookie

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    I would wager a fair sum that not one of the drivers you are all getting so irate about would buy you a beer in a empty pub. Why such vitriol on a forum thats supposed to be for F! fans

    Dont blow a head gasket over it.
     
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  28. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    But but the fashion some of the drivers wear.........keeps me up at night LOLLLLLLLLL :)

    Yep they care what about us 'fans'. Zero in the larger scheme..........overall.
     

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