I would say you are rather avoiding mine, by hiding behind some semantic here. What is your interest in exonerating Masi in this shenanigan?
Its in the report that a human error led to only a few cars being allowed to unlap, it also stats that the restart procedure wasnt done correctly in that the safety car came in same lap not the following lap. You either miss read the report, or are trying to get an emotional response by trolling... See super max couldnt beat my beautiful red Ferrari today.. Lets hope ge does better in the race and dont crash...
You haven't been reading my posts, have you? Be honest I do NOT exonerate Masi for his shenanigan on Lap One of Abu Dhabi, nor do i exonerate him for other shenanigans all season long. YOU mentioned "human error" in the FIA report (post #1768 , remember?), and I told you that there's no such phrase in the actual report. Since then, you've avoided MY questions ... and accused me of "beating around the bushes" But none of that matters ... Max Verstappen won his first WDC by passing Lewis Hamilton on a racetrack. Today, the FIA absolutely validated Verstappen's championship (that's a quote, from the report itself). All the rest is background noise
Here's the link, to the actual report itself: https://www.fia.com/2021-f1-abu-dhabi-grand-prix-report-world-motor-sport-council-19-march-2022 Show me the exact phrase "human error" ... maybe i missed it? Or maybe, I'm not the one "trolling"
I know i read it, and understood it. Did you? Read the fias stance on its report.. https://www.fia.com/news/fia-announces-world-motor-sport-council-decisions-25 They say it them selfs... The report focused solely on the facts surrounding these events, and determined the following key points: The safety car procedure was a central topic of discussion during the detailed analysis and clarification exercise, stemming from the application of this procedure at the 2021 Abu Dhabi GP, pursuant to Articles 48.12 and 48.13 of the Formula 1 Sporting Regulations. The Race Director called the safety car back into the pit lane without it having completed an additional lap as required by the Formula 1 Sporting Regulations (Article 48.12). It was apparent from the analysis that there could be different interpretations of Article 48.12 and Article 48.13 of the Formula 1 Sporting Regulations, and that this likely contributed to the applied procedure. It was also considered that the decisions regarding the Safety Car at the end of the 2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix likely took into account previous discussions that made clear the Formula 1 Stakeholders (FIA, Formula 1, Teams and Drivers) preference to end races under green flag racing conditions, rather than behind a safety car, when safe to do so. In combination with the objective to finish under green flag racing conditions applied throughout the 2021 season, the report finds that the Race Director was acting in good faith and to the best of his knowledge given the difficult circumstances, particularly acknowledging the significant time constraints for decisions to be made and the immense pressure being applied by the teams. The results of the 2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix and the FIA Formula One World Championship are valid, final and cannot now be changed. In accordance with the rules, Mercedes made a protest to the stewards after the race, seeking to change the race classification. The stewards dismissed the protest and Mercedes then had an opportunity to appeal that decision to the FIA International Court of Appeal, but did not do so. There are no other available mechanisms in the rules for amending the race classification. The process of identifying lapped cars has up until now been a manual one and human error lead to the fact that not all cars were allowed to un-lap themselves. Due to the fact that manual interventions generally carry a higher risk of human error, software has been developed that will, from now on, automate the communication of the list of cars that must un-lap themselves. In addition, the 2022 Formula 1 Sporting Regulations have been recently updated to clarify that “all” and not “any” cars must be permitted to un-lap themselves. This process of identifying lapped cars has been reviewed as part of the recommendations previously announced by the FIA President in his statement of 17 February 2022, which also includes the creation of FIA Remote Operations Centre, the integration of a new and extended team to run trackside operations as well as a review of the interactions between teams and Race Control during track running.
I said it once, I'll say it again 2021 World Champion* Max Verstappen *Human error found in the analysis of the FIA 2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix, new procedures put in place, and pace car unlapping rule clarified from 'any' to 'all' for the 2022 season.
Wow, you finally came out with it ! Was it that difficult? Why not mentioning the shenanigan of the last lap as well? Most people accepted 3 minutes after the chequered flag that Max Verstappen was World Champion, that was not an issue. It was a shock at first, but Max deserved his title; there was no demand to reverse the result. Now it's history. But the guy who created that chaos had to go, and you defended Masi for 3 months !!!
I didn't like what I saw at Abu Dhabi, but I won't follow you about the asterik on Max Verstappen's title. First, Max isn't guilty of anything and I don't see any benefit of adding stigma to his title. It would give a bad image for F1 to denigrate a champion, or to question the quality of his title. The main architect of this scandal and the only culprit in that sad story has been named and removed from his position: Masi is gone. For me that's closes the subject. PS: I am not one of Max' fan.
I'm just busting balls. Max is good for the sport. All said and done, I think he was a better driver than Ham in 2021 regardless of Masi. That's what I truly believe. I am just biased against him because I don't like his personality.
The FIA report itself makes no mention of "human error", and no mention of "broken rules": https://www.fia.com/2021-f1-abu-dhabi-grand-prix-report-world-motor-sport-council-19-march-2022 Also, the report itself clearly states: 31. It was apparent from the analysis that there could be different interpretations of Article 48.12 and/or Article 48.13, and that this likely contributed to some of the confusion surrounding the safety car unlapping procedure. Which contradicts any "notion" or "stance" that 48.12 was violated. Are there different versions of the report, or just different "interpretations" or "stances" on the same report?? All of my comments address the actual report itself, the language used and the words contained ... rather than a "stance" on the report. But as i've said, none of it matters Today, the FIA validated Max Verstappen as 2021 WDC (under 2021 rules) ... and these words can indeed be found in the report itself.
What are you talking about? I've complained about Masi turning a blind eye during Lap One of Abu Dhabi for months!!
You contribute rarely on this forum, but on this threat, you have spent months defending Masi tooth and nail for the last lap at Abu Dhabi. I wonder why. Trying to rub people the wrong way to get a reaction, emotional trolling?
I'll tell you why: rules were broken on the first lap, but no rules were broken on the last lap(s). Clear enough? If I were a "Masi fan", i would be defending his decision to allow Hamilton to gain a position off-track. But I have never once defended that decision.
Masi did plenty wrong, all season long ... including lap one of Abu Dhabi. Maybe that's why he was fired? Hamilton needed to be placated. Maybe that's why Masi was fired? Personnel changes are political window dressing. The real substance of the matter is to be found in rule changes ... no need to change rules, after all, if the "problem" was the Race Director breaking bad And sure enough ... safety car rules have been changed for 2022! That's why the FIA clearly and explicitly validated Verstappen as WDC for 2021 ... under the applicable rules at the time, naturally. All i'm saying, all i've been saying, is that I agree with stewards' ruling after the race, and i even agree with yesterday's FIA report ... the report itself, that is, where there's no mention of "broken" or "violated" rules, and no mention of "human error": https://www.fia.com/2021-f1-abu-dhabi-grand-prix-report-world-motor-sport-council-19-march-2022 Verstappen won his first WDC by passing Hamilton on a racetrack. Verstappen's championship was just "validated" (quote) by the FIA. We have new rules for 2022. I'm totally satisfied Goodnight guys. I won't post any more in this thread. The Hamilton fans are more than welcome to have the last word
Max could not pass Lewis on the track without Masi's help. Max did not win the championship, it was the combination of Masi and Max working together that put the Red Bull car ahead of the MB. Lewis couldn't come in for new tires as Masi would have let the race finish under yellow and Max wins. If Lewis doesn't come in for tires, Masi waits until Max gets new tires and then only lets the cars between Max and Lewis unlap themselves. Max wins either way because Masi thought it would be fun not to let the 108 million fans that tuned in to see the first 8 time world champion crowned in the history of F1. Masi thought it would be fun to create some Netflix style fake drama and change history. Masi got sacked so the FIA can claw back a little legitimacy for their sport and the fans can feel like something got done even though the correct action would have been to admit that Max could not win that race without the FIA's Director of Racing putting the official FIA's thumb on the scale for Max. Life reduced to a Meme. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Drop mic. End of. (Although to be fair to Max, he did win the most races and lead the most laps in the season, so is most definitely a worthy WDC)
Without Masi Lewis would not even be in the position to battle for the championship that last race. Even the last race the counter of beneficial calls is 2-1 for Hamilton with the “no action” after he passed Verstappen by cutting the corner and the “no safetycar” call after Toto’s demand. Besides, the FIA and Masi had multiple possibilities to prevent Lewis from staying in the race. The illegal rear wing from Brazil, the third warning after blocking Mazepin. Overtaking at the outside of the track. Slowing down behind max without a reason. If they really wanted Max to win, don’t you thing they would played it a little more safe than aiming for Max to be able to overtake Lewis in his faster car in the very last lap?
I don’t know what planet you are on. It’s not hard. We all know Masi messed up multiple times in the season with pros and cons for lots of drivers - not just Max and Lewis. But he saved his most ridiculous mistake for the end of the last race with the eyes of the entire world upon him. He blew it.
The FIA is actually confusing us. Your link is to the "executive summary of the report", is not the full report - it's an exec summary. Similarly, the link to the official announcement of the executive summary, states "The following is a summary of the decisions taken during the meeting" - again a different summary of the same report! This latter summary states human error, and this must have been a finding during the meeting, since the summary is pulled from the meeting to discuss events. Both documents are FIA summaries, so it would be nice to see the actual full report. Transparency? I think this is a much transparency as we are going to get on this one unfortunately.
I continue to believe that claims of collusion or conspiracy between Masi/FIA and Red Bull are totally bogus. The simple truth is that Masi screwed up in Abu Dhabi and the FIA had a very delicate mess to clean up particularly because Red Bull were in no way complicit and merely took full advantage of the situation the FIA error gave them; nothing wrong with that. I've said it before and I'll repeat it again that regardless of what the FIA would do going forwards most people could spin their actions to support any narrative they want. I prefer to look at the broad strokes and take away the following: 1. The FIA clarifying the rules from 'any' to 'all' in the safety car proceedings for lapped cars by no means constitutes a rule CHANGE. It is merely a fine tuning of semantics mainly due to Red Bull's attempt to 'lawyer' their way out of a situation that they knew darn well was not correct. The more broad interpretation is that the words can be used interchangeably in that context as the over-riding principle of the sporting code is to apply rules impartially to all competitors. A SINGULAR decision that treats any 2 competitors differently by its very nature breaks the sporting code. To anyone who insists that precision in the regulations is key and that the rules indeed have changed then please explain how Max was not penalized for passing under the safety car as it was a clear as day black and white breaking of the rules. In that instance rationality prevailed and it was understood to not have been an advantage which is why I support the FIA throwing out Mercedes' appeal on those grounds even if by the letter of the rules they were right. Sorry guys can't have it both ways. 2. Masi's firing was inevitable and in no way is proof of anything. Fact is his image was far too controversial for him to continue in his role. Just the politics of life that he turned out to be a casualty of. 3. I for one am surprised that the FIA was as forthcoming as they were on the release of their findings. They really pooped the bed in Abu Dhabi and the clean up was well beyond issuing an apology. I've discussed this issue with a lot of people both inside and outside of the sport and the feeling is pretty universal that the rules were broken. The people who defend the actions of the race director seem to always have justifications that focus on details ignoring the big picture and ignoring that other details can easily be used to disassemble their argument.
I've stated that I will no longer post in this thread, but this post needs a reponse. Out of respect to the poster ... The FIA clearly and explicitly disagrees with you. From the report issued by the FIA on 3/19: "34. In a recent E‐Vote, the WMSC has confirmed a rule change that clarifies that in case of unlapping « all » cars rather than « any » cars have to unlap. Further investigation into the F1 timing system shall clarify whether a « virtual unlapping » procedure could bring advantages and simplification." Again, the FIA clearly and explicitly disagrees with you. From the same report, issued by the FIA on 3/19: "23. On Lap 57/58, after the message “LAPPED CARS 4 (NOR) ‐ 14 (ALO) ‐ 31 (OCO) ‐ 16 (LEC) ‐ 5 (VET) TO OVERTAKE SAFETY CAR” was published, Mercedes’ Team Principal (Toto Wolff) radioed Race Control: Team Principal: Michael…Michael, this isn’t right. Michael, that is so not right. That is so not right. [later] Team Principal incorrectly stated: He [VER] just overtook under safety car. " The reason that Verstappen was not penalized for overtaking under the safety car, is because the telemetry shows that both cars were on the gas & brakes during those moments, and it's quite likely that Hamilton's abrupt braking is what caused the apparent, momentary advance of Verstappen's car. Anyone familiar with racing should immediately recognize this. The MUCH better question in Abu Dhabi, the question that has NEVER been answered to any objective satisfaction, is: Why did Masi allow Hamilton to gain a position off-track in lap one? The most reasonable answer, by far, is a desire to keep Hamilton in contention for as long as possible. I, too , have discussed the race with several people ... fans, as well as professionals. Opinions on the matter are quite evenly split. However, everyone agrees that Verstappen clearly earned the 2021 championship! When the entire season is considered (rather than one lap of any one race), there is universal agreement among all objective parties that Hamilton received far more "gifts" from the officials than Verstappen. For what it's worth, I'm entirely satisfied ... Verstappen's championship has been validated for 2021 (direct quote from the FIA), and safety car rules have indeed changed for 2022 (another direct quote from FIA) Everything else is background noise ... or perhaps "fodder for controversy", intended to keep the sport in the headlines. OK, i'm done.
