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Miller Ferrari Service Cost... out of line!

Discussion in '308/328' started by gio1992, Oct 15, 2005.

  1. fmaderi

    fmaderi Formula Junior

    May 8, 2005
    254
    clearwater Fla/NY
    Full Name:
    frank maderi
    cost does seem high.maybe you can have them give you a better idea of what they plan to do.yes they are in grennwich,ct.maybe an independent can help you out.i worked for bill pollard @sportauto years ago.so i trust him.give him a call 860-350-1515.yes sometimes you get what you pay for.sometimes its better to pass on the job.you might not like this but 348's dont have the best appeal to some F tech's[pita]dealerships do get all the info so please do some checking around.the best customers are the most informed.good luck to all.im just trying to make a living and enjoy the love of the marque even while it evolves.
     
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  3. ferrarokid

    ferrarokid Rookie

    Jan 30, 2004
    19
    T- mobile guy ..

    Take a pill dude ! !

    I VERY HIGHLY DOUBT HE HAS MORE KNOLEDGE ON THE 348 THEN I ! !
    To this date I have done over 200 + major services on that model alone. have the records to verify that.

    For all the years they were run in the 348 /355 challenge I have re-built, degreed cams, ported heads, tried different seat angles, and dyno'd more engine's then I can remember ! ! (good thing !)

    I also run the Miller Motorcars challenge team starting back in 92' with (3) 348 challenge cars !

    In all those years .. not one of my challenge cars failed to make the grid due to a mechanical failure.

    If you cannot figure out which dealer I work for .. then you need to slow down a little .. take a deep breath, and actually read the posts ! !

    I did not come onto this tread to make anybody look bad .. just to clarify the facts ..

    which are :
    (1) Miller Motorcars does very good work, and for a fair market price

    (2) can you get it done cheaper somewhere else ? absolutely !

    (3) Cars are my passion .. not something I take lightly or willing to, leave my precious investment in the hands of "the cheapest guy" sorry not going to happen.

    (4) This is a great debate proving, that there are many avenues to having your car serviced ! ! !

    (5) The cog that drives the timing belt .. gets connected to the crankshaft by a double row chain ! also a small single for the oil pump ! !

    (6) Every time I work on one of these cars .. I learn something new ! !

    (7) Take it for what it is ... Relax and injoy your passion .. for sometime in the future you will NOT have the luxury of just jumping in your car & going out for a blast through the canyon's ! !

    Enjoy !
     
  4. lusso64

    lusso64 Formula 3

    Apr 12, 2004
    1,535
    Simi Valley
    Full Name:
    David
    fierokid, until you give us some information to authenticate your claims, your oppinion is worth about as much as mine. ZERO.

    You are making some big claims. Substantiate or capitulate.
     
  5. ferrarokid

    ferrarokid Rookie

    Jan 30, 2004
    19
    I also run the Miller Motorcars challenge team ....

    do you get it now ? ?

    p.s. nice 95' 355 .. one of my favorites !
     
  6. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    Don't take pills, but thanks for the offer. :)





    This to me, sounds like an attempt to make someone look bad.....





    I read ALL the posts, and not once did you disclose that you worked at Miller. As for me figuring out it out......before I made an INCORRECT ASSUMPTION, I wanted to ASK YOU to make sure what I was thinking, was the case.

    It should not be anyone's job to figure out where you work...you should have disclosed this immediately. Your statements will be viewed differently if they were given by a third party as compared to someone with a vested interest in defending Miller, but I think you already knew this thus the reason for the non-disclosure of your capacity.
     
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  8. ferrarokid

    ferrarokid Rookie

    Jan 30, 2004
    19
    This thread really is not about who I work for but, on the basis of common sense !

    I think all questions were answered..

    And the client can form his/ or her own opinions !
     
  9. matteo

    matteo F1 World Champ

    Aug 1, 2002
    13,748
    On a plane somewhere
    Full Name:
    Heir Butt
    IS JRV back on the board?
     
  10. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    You work for Miller! Isn't the title of this thread "Miller Ferrari Service Cost...out of line"?
     
  11. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Five Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    52,695
    Texas!
    I always find these threads amusing. Maybe because I also charge high fees for what I do, I am somewhat sensitive to this issue. The bottom line is that if you don't like what a shop, doctor, lawn guy or whatever wants to charge, then take your business someplace else. Geeze Louise. This ain't that hard.

    Now, if you pay top dollar and don't get top dollar work, I'll agree that you have right to gripe.

    I'll leave you with this story that I tell people who question my fees.

    Once upon a time, a Doc saved a man's life on the table. After the operation, the patient was effusive. "Man, you saved my life. You are God. How can I ever repay you?

    But a month later when the patient got a bill for $5,000, he lost it. "$5,000! No way!. I was only on that table for 20 minutes." The patient demanded an itemized bill.

    By return mail, the patient got a huge package that had page after page after page of itemized billings. $1 for a needle. $1.25 for a band aid and on and on and on.

    The subtotal of all this detail was $1,000.

    Then, on the last page of the bill, was one line item charge for $4,000.

    What to guess what the description of the charge was?

    It said, "Knowing where to cut ---- $4,000."

    Dale
     
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  13. brent Lachelt

    brent Lachelt Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2003
    1,818
    Brownsburg, INDIANA
    Full Name:
    Brent R.Lachelt

    I don't know? Where you work is a valid consideration. You did answer several questions and offer opinions, but as an employee of Miller Motorcars or at least a person who is associated with them you then become a representative for them. Especially when you are making statements and comments on a public forum that are in writing. "Common sense" would say you did share your opinion. Business sense would say that maybe it was done in away that was less than professional. Would Miller Motorcars approve of someone representing them in such a light as to offer thoughts such as this? (Remember you are a representative for them whether you like it or not.)

    Originally Posted by ferrarokid
    FRICKEN HATE PEOLE THAT HAVE ZERO CLUE, AS TO WHAT IT REALLY INVOLVES ! !
    sometimes we forget the experts !

    I would be suprised if I walked into the service department at Miller Motorcars and got this response from the service manager after I told him I thought there estimate for my major service seemed high.

    That being said your quote from Miller Motorcars on that major service is still too high.
     
  14. parkerfe

    parkerfe F1 World Champ

    Sep 4, 2001
    12,887
    Cumming, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Franklin E. Parker
    That is WAY too high IMHO...I only paid ~$6k for an engine out service for my BB512i at Ferrari of Atlanta!
     
  15. ferrarokid

    ferrarokid Rookie

    Jan 30, 2004
    19
    Tmobil Guy or whoever ..

    The questions were answered to the best of my knowledge ..

    I wish you were local .. so I can show you with your own (2) eyes some of the "great" work done at cheap prices .. you might re-think your whole position.

    Your comments do nothing but make me smile ! !

    The bottom line is : I have first hand experience.

    Read all the info .. Gain knowledge on the subject that interests you ..
    Then form your own conclusions ! !

    If I can be of any help .. you can shoot me a pm, glad to answer any questions you might have .. or help get the info you seek.
    :)
     
  16. matteo

    matteo F1 World Champ

    Aug 1, 2002
    13,748
    On a plane somewhere
    Full Name:
    Heir Butt

    Yep, The new "JRV"
     
  17. brent Lachelt

    brent Lachelt Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2003
    1,818
    Brownsburg, INDIANA
    Full Name:
    Brent R.Lachelt
    Well you know what that means!! You better get to it. Release the hounds!!!
     
  18. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,164
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    Yup, they sure do. Like when I hear of 20 hours to r&r the engine quotes. What a joke. After I had everything drained and disconnected I had mine out in about 4.5 hours. Oh yeah and that was without the luxury of a lift and ALLLLLL by MYSELF. Now if you have done 500+ engine outs, you know damn good and well you can have the engine out in half a day.


    I will be changing those when I do the next major. As for the water pump, it was just fine. Absolutly ZERO play in the bearing so I left be. IF, it starts making noise, no big deal I'll pull the engine and fix it myself for FREE.

    The front cam seal housing drain just fine. No I didn't radius it because I wanted a tight seal. I also tightend the cam cover down evenly and little by little, so that the o-ring didn't get squished more on one side causing it to be pushed out and "pinched" on the other side. I did put some Tripple Bond at each of the corners, and to date NO oil leaks.


    Yup they sure were, and at an angle.


    Well seeing that I have pulled the trany already, by myself and for FREE, I will not get gouged with $120 hr labor charges. The tranny is currently sitting in BillyBob's garage torn apart. Again that was for FREE because I did the tear down with Fatboy.:D. Now as for the parts well I may just have to pay the piper for the rear bevel gear, UNLESS I can find a place here to make me a custom gear stronger and cheaper than the junk stock gear. The inner bearings are SKF and I have a place that I can get them cheaper than what the dealer charges. So the only thing I may have to take it in the shorts is with the bevel gear.

    What and replace them with the junk stock cables, and get jacked with dealer prices? Sorry but no. Unless you are willing to spill the beans were they can be bought at non dealer prices.:)

    That is a big gigantic NO!!! Nippondenso baby.

    Yeah I still have those. But I will be replacing it with a solid cable before the trany goes back in.

    Oooooooh that one is sooooo hard to do. You can also do that with the O2 sensors. But Sssshhhhhhhh, don't let too many people know that, cause then they may have no need to buy any more O2 sensors for $350 each.

    Nope. I let the spring do all the work like directed in the book. One Fchatter , that I helped with instructions on doing the major, for FREE, bought the gauge. He set the tention letting the spring do the work, and then checked it. Guess what, the spring was right on. So I'm not gonna waist money on a tool that is questionably needed. Besides you can only retightend the belt ONCE, according to the book, then it has to be replaced.

    Yet another tool for the dealers to use. "Oh Mr.Sucker your belt is out of spec, you will need a new one. That will be another $8,000 plus the "tentioners" for another $1,700". Never telling the guy that it can be retightend one time in minutes, with the engine still in the car.

    Oh dangit, did I just give out another tip.

    Uhhhh, that one is a big fat NO!!!! Any time you disconnect the battery it clears out any codes stored in the ecu's. Even IF the battery was still connected, the ECU's would have been disconnected from the power supply, because they MUST be disconnected from the wiring loom in order to remove the engine. Though I did let it idle for at least 20 minutes, so that the ecu's could relearn the warm up process after the egine went back in.

    Well let's see. I just got my new tags, and I'm in the worst place for smog laws, Kalifornia. Oh yeah and that was a pass with ONE functioning cat. :D. The other one was burned out. I'll put Hyperflows on when it goes on the sniffer the next time. That will be the cost of the cats minus labor, because a I will be doing the work myself. So another FREEBEE.

    Hmmmmmmmmm, and yet somehow I know this stuff?????


    I AM saying go to an independant. Until the dealers STOP charging INSANE prices for parts and service, I will continue to recomend going to an independant, or better yet Man-Up and do the job yourself for FREE.:D
     
  19. matteo

    matteo F1 World Champ

    Aug 1, 2002
    13,748
    On a plane somewhere
    Full Name:
    Heir Butt
    Looks like Ernie is taking the lead on this one. I am just waiting for JRVKID to say that it's ok to charge $250 to clean a air intake with a towel because "it's a extra touch" and that other shops reuse timing belts
     
  20. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran

    Jun 20, 2003
    6,687
    North shore, MA
    Full Name:
    THE Birdman
    Sheesh you guys, I think you might be going just a little hard on Ferrarokid. OK, so he comes on here swaggering as an expert with only 5 posts but his first reponse to this thread was just to say what was included in the service that this thread is talking about. Ernie, as much as like him, did kinda jump down his throat a little with the "frickin' hating people who try to rip you off" or whatever he said. The guy has been on the defensive ever since then just because he has few posts and suggested that a tensioner bearing wasn't included in the service. You can tell from reading his posts that he is not clueless, the guy knows something about 348 service procedures. Let's take it back a notch here. The real issue is that some feel the quote for the service is too steep and Ferrarokid feels it is worth it to have it done by a dealer. That's about it. We don't need to beat a dead horse. The only thing I can find, re-reading the whole thread, that hurts Ferrarokid's position is the suggestion that replacing the tensioner bearings is optional. And frankly, this very subject has been argued over and over in the Tech Q&A section, so it's not as cut and dried as it seems. I am of the position that once you go so far as to do an entire major, to skip replacing the tensioner bearings is a big mistake, but that's me and they are cheap for a 308!

    My $.02.

    Birdman
     
  21. ferrarokid

    ferrarokid Rookie

    Jan 30, 2004
    19
    Ernie .. man Im laughing my ass off ! !

    Dude relax ! !

    pm me if you need any shims for the diff carrier, or setting the pinion heights/ preload .. we bought a bunch of them back in the early 90's for the challenge cars.

    -Ferrarokid-
     
  22. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,164
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    Relaxed. Ball busting over.

    Thanks for offering the help. I may take you up on the offer.
     
  23. ferrarigtofan

    ferrarigtofan Formula Junior
    BANNED

    Sep 26, 2005
    510
    USA
    If you are comfortable doing you own repairs and have access to parts at a discounted rate, go for it.

    An authorized dealer has to live with repairs far longer than an unauthorized shop. If Ferrari of Atlanta fixes something and you have a problem they know you will be all over the internet ripping them a new one. While I do feel labor rates and parts rates at authorized Ferrari dealers are too high, I can see their point of view as well. If one sale is lost because of a tirade by a service customer, the authorized service center is still a loser even at their higher rates.

    I will probably go for a major service in winter 06/07 and I may or may not use an authorized dealer. I intend of visiting several shops, asking questions and then maybe asking on-line about experiences with ones I am seriously considering. An authorized dealer has no wiggle room for playing dumb, they are liable and they know a lawsuit is bad for business, so they over do everything to play it safe.

    So authorized versus not authorized is ~$2000, is that a savings or just winging it and hoping? I don't know, but i will agree the parts fees are borderline rape.
     
  24. Joe G.

    Joe G. Formula 3
    BANNED

    Dec 9, 2003
    1,077
    Los Angeles
    Full Name:
    Joe Gazzani
    my thoughts EXACTLY :)

    sounds just like him
     
  25. ferrarokid

    ferrarokid Rookie

    Jan 30, 2004
    19
    #72 ferrarokid, Oct 18, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  26. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,164
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    He's a former chatter from the old school days of Fchat.
     
  27. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    I agree with a lot of that Birdman...although I think the other thing Ferrarokid should have done was to 'disclose' his affliation with Miller. I think it very material to his positions and this thread.
     
  28. lusso64

    lusso64 Formula 3

    Apr 12, 2004
    1,535
    Simi Valley
    Full Name:
    David
    And dammit, I want to know his NAME, but I am too lazy to look it up. Why the secrecy for so long in this thread? Why not "Hi guys - I'm Peter from Miller, and here's my response on behalf of the company....." Would have saved all this jerking around, and we could have been discussing the real issue..... Dealer or Indy for service, and why?

    Dave (yes - that's my real name, but I'll answer to David also)
     

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