Mitsubishi Mu 2

So I just bought one ....

Starting my training on it February 11th with Professional Training out of Salina (MU2 specialists). Having flown in it I must say it is "light years" away from
the piston experience. Anyone here have any time in these and any advice as to operations?

Here are some pics of the airplane ...

Thanks

Mark
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Congrats on your purchase.

Never flow one or flow in one. They have a nasty reputation upon losing an engine - as you know the airplane does not have ailerons so when you lose an engine and you correct your spoiler raises and destroys lift. Not a good situation. Knew a pretty experienced pilot running cargo in one that didn't make it after losing an engine on takeoff.

There is plenty of info on the MU-2 reputation and I'm sure you are aware of it. Not sure of the stats but I think it may have the highest accident rate of any certified airplane. It is definately a good idea to go to specialized training. Also I think the insurance might require it.

I'm not trying to "rain" on your purchase. The plane looks to be in nice shape.

Are you using it for work or for pleasure???

 

Both,

Actually the accident rate since the new training went into effect has placed the airplane at the LOWEST of all certificated airplanes. The spoilers do not "destroy" lift. They actually
turn the airplane much as my familiar 767 does (it utilized spoilers also). You simply have to fly this airplane like a jet and you won't get into trouble. Most of the people that do
have not had training in the airplane and they try to transfer experience from piston twins and that won't work.

The airplane has been made a whipping boy for pilot error accidents. When you dig into what has happened with the recent accidents you will see that.

Best to all...

 

Lots of airplane accidents are like that. There always seems to be much more going on under the surface.

I guess the 767 uses spoilers like the crj I used to fly to assist in the turn. The airbus doesn't use them other than as speed breaks, that's not too much of surprise, airbus likes to do things differently. My understanding was that the spoilers are called spoilers because they spoil lift. Makes sense to me because they disrupt laminer flow over the wing, decreasing the lift on the associated wing while the other wing's lift is not decreased causing a turn. But I guess I'm wrong and I am certainly not an aeronautical engineer! And I guess there is a component of drag assosicated with the use of the spoiler.

Best of luck!

 

One of them went down in coming out of APA just a few years ago. Be safe.

 

You are correct. The spoilers disrupt the flow over the wing AND cause drag that lowers the wing and helps produce a turn. The advent of the spoiler was due to the movement of the thin and flexible wings of the modern high speed aircraft where an aileron became a tab that twisted the wing into the opposite direction of what was asked of the aileron, therefore producing aileron reversal. The spoiler was placed at a thicker and stiffer point, at or near the MAC where it would be the most effective and to produce the required command. Added to this arrangement was a high speed aileron aft and near the spoiler. This adds to the power of the lateral control devices when a hard over signal is asked for. The inboard high speed aileron aileron is usually all that is used in normal high speed flight. Then at slower speeds such as approach to landing, the outboard aileron(which is locked out in high speed flight) acts in concert with the inboard aileron and spoiler to give superior lateral control when it is most needed. This arrangement was designed for the 727 and it had a greater roll rate than a P-51. I guess that I'm talking about the Boeing airplanes that I worked on for 48 years.

 

This airplane reminds me of the Martin B-26 Marauder from WW2. The flying prostitute, " No visible means of support". It had the same design philosophy as the MU2 and assymetrical power presented some challenges in directional and roll control. The only answer to an engine failure on takeoff was to retard power on the good engine to keep the airplane upright and under control to where it was going to hit. Sometimes flying over Tampa Bay you could see B-26 wreckage peeking out of the sand. Hence, " One A Day In Tampa Bay." BUT, the airforce used B-26B's in Texas at Del Rio as advanced twin engine trainers near the end of the war with great success. Stay awake, stay sharp, and stay ahead of the airplane.

 

Congratulations on the purchase, I have always liked the looks of these MU2's, be sure to get the most out of the training course and get to know the plane as much as you can and you

will do just fine, much better than on a Duke

 

I'm sure you checked the insurance rates prior to purchase...how do they compare for the MU vs the other aircraft you were looking at?

 

When did the new training requirements go into effect? There have been 11 fatal MU-2 accidents since 2004, according to the NTSB, the last one being in September 2006.

There was also a nonfatal accident in December 2008, so I find it hard to believe that the accident rate for the MU-2 is the lowest of all certificated types. I suppose if the training requirements went into effect in 2007, that might be the case for fatal accidents. Certainly since 2004, the MU-2 has had almost as many fatal accidents (11) as the other comparable types combined-- King Air (2), Turbo Commander (3), Cheyenne (2), and Conquest (5).

 

I have about 600 to 700 hours give or take in long body MU-2s, but there is probably nothing I can tell you that you won't learn in ground school and during your flight training. I was going to recommend Reece Howell and his flight school (where I went years ago) but since the school you are going to is run by someone that has a long association with Reece, I think you will be in good hands. There are (or were) some other big name schools that were trying the "one size fits all" approach to MU-2 training ie. fly it like a 310 or Baron and were teaching things that could get you killed (primarily dealing with an engine loss near the ground).

I repectfully think you are wrong with your "spoiler" talk. Fly it like a jet is fine, the long body MU-2 flies like a 727 or MD-80, move the yoke and the plane thinks about it and then says, "oh...you want to bank....uh...ok I guess so". Do not fly it like a jet if you lose an engine. You should learn in MU-2 school that if you lose an engine in an MU-2, get on the trim ASAP as to use as little to no spoiler as possible. Not sure about the short body MU-2 ( my only exposure to the short body was one or two flights with an owner), but on the long body if you lose an engine near the ground, get on the trim ASAP (reduces spoiler usage ie. lift) and leave the gear alone (down if down). Opening the clamshell doors trying to bring the gear up and also having a spoiler up instead of using trim will get you killed in the MU-2 if you are anywhere near the ground....It has been a number of years so I may be off on my recollection, but the two together result in a 1500 to 2000fpm descent despite "your best efforts." Other than that, awesome airplane and a lot of fun to fly. It has been about 7 years or so since I have flown one but I had a blast when I was.....

 

Thanks for the info.. Actually what I meant about the spoilers is that they do not destroy lift on the entire wing. The new training (which went into effect about 1 year ago) teaches to fly the airplane AS CONFIGURED (just as the airlines do...) with the exception of not putting the gear up. No flap changes until speed marks are reached etc. etc.

Thanks again

 

About 8 - 10% higher. 8100 per year for full coverage.

mark

 

Just finished training with Shawn McDonnell at Professional Flight Training in Salina. WOW. I am so glad I took this training. This airplane is a ROCKET. It is, in my opinion, the most underrated airplane in the turboprop world.

Climb rate? 2800fpm to 10K, Speed? 280 - 310 Knots depending upon power setting. As far as the "dangerous" part? Absolutely, if flown by an untrained pilot. My first hour in her made me feel like a student pilot. I have never
flown an airplane that REQUIRED trimming like this little rice rocket does. But when you trim it? Best flying bird I have ever flown in 13,000 hours and 60 types of airplanes! The airplane will do 60 degree steep turns INTO the dead engine
all day long and is as stable as a house! (It was mighty funny looking at the stopped prop while doing these, however...) The airplane will kill you if not flown properly but is as safe as your mothers arms when correctly trained in.

Down the runway to 105Knots, rotate, and you have 120 knots within TWO seconds! 120 knots and the airplane flies out of any engine out situation. Like I said- it requires training but is a wonderful airplane. I invite anyone to consider it
that is looking into a turboprop/Duke/421. You will not be disappointed!

What an airplane!

 

Two more pics
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Rob I thought I was going to die... very quiet. (sorry to anyone with emotional ties there - no offense intended)

The big night out was the all you can eat prime rib at the truck stop. Fortunately the training took all of my time - 12 - 14 hours per day between ground school and flying.

Not somewhere I would like to live ,,, but I will be back next year for recurrent. Shawn McDonnell is one of the finest instructors and gentlemen I have had the pleasure of meeting.

M

 

Great to hear that you liked the plane, I think it is an amazing plane, and as you say a very underrated, but with proper training it is a great buy, keep it properly maintained and fly safely.

 

DMark1,

Congratulations on your MU-2. I was in the Navy many years, and got to fly the MU-2 up at China Lake CA....or rather forced to. We wrecked one there, so we went to two qualified pilots up front vice one. I think we had an L and an M model. After flying Hornets for years and then climbing in an MU-2, I felt I was in over my head with that plane. I didn't like the amount of control in that plane(or lack thereof), but properly flown it was a fast, reliable transport. If an engine pops.....that rudder comes in quite handy. Keep up with your training, and go back for refreshers often.....often. At some point after I left, I think they bought some Beech 1900's as their people haulers. Right now I'm at Southwest Airlines....torturing as many passengers as I can.

Dogdish

 

Cool plane. I used to work on the engine for this aircraft. When they changed the training requirements on the plane they gave us a demonstration ride and shut down one engine. Pretty strange flying around on one engine, but other looking at the parked prop I wouldn't have known anything happened. They convinced me it was a safe plane as long as you flew it like a jet.

Cheers Jim
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A true freight dog!

 

Lived in Ellsworth for a while. Nothing like Cozy Inn.