Model Choice Dilemma

Greetings, Fellow Ferrari enthusiasts! I recently sold my 3rd. Ferrari. And now I am looking for another. Here is where the dilemma is. I have ascended the Ferrari model ladder. First was an1985, 308gtsqv, I traded up for a 1986, 328gts. The 3rd one was a 1990 348ts. This was a huge jump in performance all around. Big difference for the better in handling, and engine performance.

I am now considering going backwards to an early 308GTB. Back to the model roots. Yes, a Euro 308GTB. 1977, through early 1980. (will consider a 1977 US spec) This is of course the Carb. Era. The sound, the romance of that early time of the 308, and the pride of ownership! This is what draws me to an early Carb. Car. But on the other hand, my practical side, the commonsense side is warning me to find a nice Euro 308 qv-gtb, Or even better a Euro 328gtb.


How user friendly is a Carb 308 today to maintain and enjoy? I hear all sorts of needy maintenance, and carb service issues due to Ethanol in the gas, and what else? Is it worth it? Would like to hear your thoughts.

Thank you
Sincerely

 

I have a ‘76 GTB and also a 550 (so injection, early electronics etc)

I don’t see any major issues with the carb car, as long as you have access every 1-2 years to someone who knows how to tune them (assuming don’t want to do yourself). Ethanol can be addressed by changing the hoses which you’d likely need to do even on later cars anyway, and you can use fuel additives that protect against it (head’s up - I’m in UK with lower levels than US at 5/10% ethanol). I don’t think there are any other different maintenance demands?

On the positive side, it’s a much simpler car with no early electronics and the gremlins they can bring.
Starting a carb car is a bit more of an art it must be said, but just a different technique (in fact a technique!) and a bit of patience, it’s never let me down.

I appreciate the later cars have many improvements but to me the induction howl on acceleration, power and purism is unbeatable so I wouldn’t worry at all about getting a carb car if that’s what your heart is saying. Any 3x8 is an emotional not practical decision. As always, buy the best you can afford and I wouldn’t chose a poor carb car over a great injected one….

Hope helps
John

 

I am really good with carburetors. I still consider them as best used as museum displays.
I understand if we are talking about say Muscle cars. None really had fuel injection. With 308s there really is no excuse, both were available and the injected models were head and shoulders better.
And no one has spoken of the ignition system in the early 308. Victorian era garbage. Not to mention Magnetti Marelli recently went out of business so even the Chinese made replacement parts may all soon be NLA.

Gremlins in the electronics of 308/328????????? I must have missed that in my 47 years of Ferrari experience.

 

Rob,

I'm kind of partial having owned an early 77 US spec car for 47 yrs.!

I guess my first few questions to you would be:

• Do you do your own work or depend on a shop?
• Do you like "fiddling" with your car?
• How much do you plan on driving the car?

Once you get the carbs sync'd and tuned nicely, they will stay that way for years as long as you drive the car. The more and harder you drive it, the better it will run. If you let it sit, you will have difficulties.

I also eliminated the R1/R2 points, initially with optical sensors in the late 80's, and more recently with a Pertronix ignition. That eliminates having to mess with and adjust the points periodically.

My recommendation would be if you like to "fiddle", nothing beats the sound and performance of a properly tuned early carb'd 308! If all you want to do is get in and drive periodically, get a QV

 

Thank you John,

Wow, this is good solid advise, and encouragement. Yes, I am leaning towards a Carb car. I did drive a carb 308 a couple of years ago. I do recall the start up
procedure. The owner said, Pump the accelerator 3 times, and now start. He went on to say DO NOT ever use the choke!! He was very firm on that point.
Was that close to a good Carb start up? By the way this car was cold.

Thank you again for your insight.

Sincerely

 

Thank you,
Again, great advice. Yes, I like to tinker with my cars up to the point of my confidence level. I do and will drive the car often. I want to learn how to tune and adjust the carbs. I saw a u tube of a guy tuning a 308-carb car. He had these devises he dropped into the intake trumpets. He then got a reading on a handheld device. He went back & fourth a few times and then declared Victory! All tuned. All & all it took 15 minutes. Is it that easy after an initial proper tunning? (I am considering a 77 us car) Is there a cut off of the desirable cams on the1977 cars? Or are all the 1977 non cat cars good? The one I am looking at is a September of 77 one.

Again, very much appreciated!

Sincerely

 

Thank you,

I appreciate all advise. This is a huge help in my decision process.

Sincerely

 

Birdman did a good layman's write up on carb syncing here:

https://birdman308.com/service/sync/carb_synch_tutorial.htm

It can take 15 min. to get the carbs sync'd, but the whole procedure will take longer than that because of the disassembly and reassembly. Also, with an unknown baseline, it's always good to make sure all the floats are set correctly, jets and tubes are cleaned and verified.

And yes, I believe all the non cat 77's have the hotter cams.

 

Rob,
It sounds like you’re aware that the Euro GTB carb cars are dry sumped.
This was one of the main reasons I swapped my QV GTS for a ‘79 Euro GTB.
A pleasant bonus was the throttle response of the Webers compared to the K-jet.
I am unapologetically a carb guy, having had Webers on my sports and racing cars for 30+ years. Yes, they’re a crude device compared to modern F.I., but the same could be said of most vintage cars when compared to more modern machinery.
Best of luck with your search, it sounds as though you’re likely to become a regular around here.
- Dave

 

I am reminded of the original Road and Track magazine road test article on a then-new injected 1980 308 GTSi, which replaced the carb GTS.

The first line in the old article said: "The 'i' stands for Injected ... and Improved".

 

"Improved" my behind! I've had my GTB for 47 years and it is a wonderful car.

 

Thank you all for your great advice! This has been very encouraging and has helped me with my decision to go Carbs!!

Sincerely

 

Never owned a carb 308 but from what I’ve read, you better get used to smelling like unburnt fuel?
Guess that’s the trade-off for that amazing sound of those carbs opening.

 

??? You might want to change your info sources. As someone who grew up with carbs of many varieties on many makes, I find all the myths about carbs to be so amusing. They are archaic, but they won’t make you smell like fuel and set up correctly and used several times a year, they will need very little to no attention for many years. On my carb cars, I do a removal, clean and re gasket every 10 years or so.

 

Thank you! This is great advice, I truly appreciate it. This is a great help because I believe they are not as fragile as some think. Do you have to add gas additive to counteract the Ethanol effect?

 

Why are you going to smell like unburnt fuel? - Are you expecting the fuel to somehow leak into the cabin?

Show the articles you've read that state the carb'd 308's will leave you stinking of unburnt fuel - Because in 47 years of reading road tests and reviews of 308's and 328's, I don't recall any that said: "The four carburettor 308 is a great car, but it will leave you smelling of unburnt fuel!"

 

@rob58 Another vote for a Dry Sump GTB: I bought mine 40 years ago in Germany, a fairly late build, early 1980, so single distributor with reliable electronic ignition.

All Euro B's with the Dry Sump will have the hotter cams, but @Dockboy really nailed it: Once they're dialed in, they are good to drive for years. And as much as I drive my car, I absolutely want the sounds of four downdraft Webers a couple feet from my ears (right side scoop is air induction). As far as fuel goes, Non-Oxy fuel is my drink of choice (besides AvGas for other uses).

No factory 3x8 car is quick by any modern standards, so why not have the sights, sounds and (some external) smells of a carb driven period car? If I want to go-fast(er) with fuel injected comfort, that's what my BMW E39 M5 is for.

 

Here are three comments that took about 30 seconds to find. If you want to be an ass about it, maybe you should do a search yourself. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

For what it's worth, I don't find my carb 308 (US) as troublefree as an injection car. I've never been able to eliminate hot start issues, cutout in sharp corners, and the very slight smell of exhaust that makes its way into the open cockpit. None of that really bothers me, because of the sound and responsiveness of the engine.

 

IMO, this is what you should look closely at....very surprised there is not more of a premium

 

Thank you all for your comments, and information this is very helpful. Please keep it coming, I am learning a lot. Aside from
locating ethanol free gas in my area, the local track has a verity of ethanol free but is too far & very pricy! is there any additive's that anyone uses
to counteract, or dislodge the ethanol?

Thank you
Sincerely

 

Rob,

Where are you located?

I run standard 10% ethanol 93 octane fuel from a high volume provider (Wawa) and have for over 200k mi. I would not worry about the ethanol.

 

Thank you,
I am in Colchester, CT. So, no issues with the 10%Ethanol? I heard it can be troublesome with hoses, rubber fuel lines and gumming up jets and
so on. Anything to worry about?
Regards

 

I'm also running 92 octane 10% ethanol blend premium in my carbed 308 and have been doing so since I got the car about two and a half years ago. No problems at all here. I don't think this is an issue that you really need to worry about as long as your fuel lines are in good shape

 

Four double barrel carbs , that’s a barrel for each cylinder are a rare automotive joy to behold .
Once Webers are set up with regular use they are fit n fit get . No electrotwackery to age off .

Think your garden strimmer / bushwacker …..simple tech .

I don’t buy into all “ fuel smell “ nonsense. Obviously like every other bit of rubber it’s got a life ( fuel pipes ) and should be maintained.