Mondial QV gear oil leak | FerrariChat

Mondial QV gear oil leak

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by Richqv, May 2, 2022.

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  1. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Manchester UK
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    Richard Stephens
    My QV has recently developed a gear oil leak. It seems to be seeping between the transfer gear cover and the part of the block that the gear oil sump (pan) sits beneath. The red arrows in the picture show seeping oil starting to appear 48 hours after a clean up.

    Has anyone experienced similar and can advise how to remedy? Many thanks in advance, F-chatters.

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  2. mike32

    mike32 F1 Veteran

    May 13, 2016
    5,961
    Isle of man- uk
    Not sure which bit you mean but if its the gearbox sump cover, you can renew the joint- but be sure to look at the drawing as there are 3 springs and balls that will drop out when you remove it. Its a long time since i did one so i can not recall exactly.
    Re the enging sump joint, NB you cannot get the sump an off with out removing the dip tube first. It will only drop so far and then will not come anymore.
     
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  3. moysiuan

    moysiuan F1 Rookie
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    I am wondering if this leak is inside the clutch area, ie. the rear main seal which would require the clutch/pressure plate and flywheel to be removed to replace, with oil that can dribble out of the "slot" in your picture?
     
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  4. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido F1 Rookie
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  5. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Thanks, Mike. I'm really hoping I don't have to disturb the gear oilsump as those springs sound very fiddly!
     
  6. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    That's very interesting, thanks, Moysiuan. I won't get to the car for a few days but when I do I will see if I can put a Q tip into the "slot" and verify if it is oily inside.
     
  7. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Many thanks for the help, theunissenguido!
     
  8. moysiuan

    moysiuan F1 Rookie
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    I am pretty sure I have a leak from inside, I have ruled everything else out. The problem is the air flow under the car can make leaks look like they originate from places which are not the source of a leak.

    This seal should be replaced at the time a clutch is done, especially in the case where one has the flywheel skimmed as part of a clutch service, but I suspect for many the seal is original and will be weeping from wear and age.
     
  9. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Massive thanks for this suggestion, Moysiuan, I think you have diagnosed my leak - so not gear oil at all as I had thought. There was oil in the slot and a further clean up and 12 hour wait shows a steady stream of oil coming from the slot (see pic).

    The seal itself is not expensive but I've never replaced a crank seal before. Next step is to scour this site and beyond for good "how to" advice.

    Thanks to all those that replied - really helpful.
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  10. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    Nov 29, 2001
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    Whatever seal it is, you would have to remove the bell housing, and then you would know what's leaking.

    If I were to go in that deep, I would definitely remove the flywheel and replace the RMS. On the way back out, I would also have to replace the three orings between the bell housing and the gearbox case. And that is all the seals there are.
     
  11. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Richard Stephens
    Thanks, yelcab, yes I see that it could alternatively be the three o rings you mention which I wasn’t aware of. Which, given the gear box oil smell, may be the more likely culprit. Thanks for this v helpful suggestion.

    Does anyone have any advice for flywheel removal - is it simply a case of removing the 8 bolts that hold it onto the crank? Thanks
     
  12. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    This video by TheHeliDoctor is really clear for the strip up to the point of clutch plate removal

     
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  13. davem

    davem F1 World Champ
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    About 10 years ago, had the engine pulled for a 30k plus $$! Replaced the clutch for example even though at 26k it showed no signs of failure etc... So my advice is........ don't use gaskets from Superformance in England.
    I had, and had to replace them again. They were cheaper repros that just didn't fit.

    The risk/ reward as mentioned above.....parts are cheap, but the labor to do this.... You want it one and done.
    They might be better there now. Some of the hard parts were fine. Service from them was great, but.....no to gaskets
     
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  14. moysiuan

    moysiuan F1 Rookie
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    The gear oil o rings mightleak while the car is at rest. I think the crank seal would only leak with the engine running, I don't think the oil level would be right up to the seal at rest (but am not sure). If you cleaned your area up, and without starting the engine there is some oil the next day, that would argue for the O ring and gear oil leak.
     
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  15. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Please, does anyone have any tips for removing the bell housing on a Mondial QV? I've removed the transfer box cover, the lower gear and its bearing so there is nothing there to stop the bell housing from sliding away from the block on its studs. But there does seem to be resistance where the transfer shaft enters the gear box. Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks in advance : )
     
  16. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Once the bell housing has come away from the block, please can anyone help what I think will be a next dilemma, shown in this image:



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  17. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    That "surface" is the back side of a cup and it is removable. Reach your finger into the hole right above it and work it out. Behind the "cup" and in the hollow side of the cup is a split retainer ring. That ring does not need to be removed. Assuming you have removed all the bell housing nuts, the starter bolts, the clutch actuator arm, then the bell housing slides out with some prying at the mating surface.
     
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  18. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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  19. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido F1 Rookie
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    Watch this video of the heli doc...from 12 minits on
     
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  20. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

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    #20 Richqv, May 16, 2022
    Last edited: May 16, 2022
    Many, many thanks for explaining that, Yelcab. Very much appreciated!
     
  21. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

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    Thanks, guido. I had already studied the video - the helidoctor's work is first rate!

    Even having watched it this part confused me but now I am clear on next steps.

    For the bell housing, I think I just need to ensure it comes off absoultely square.

    This forum and community is amazing - thanks to all!
     
  22. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Thanks, Yelcab, it came off easily, just as you descibed (thumbs up)
     
  23. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    The bell house is off. It's very oily within the bell house and the end of the block (see first pic).

    It looks as though the rubber o ring around the shaft going into the gear box had failed - hopefully that's the source of the leak, meaning it was gear oil (see second pic of the bell house).

    But I'm going to also do the rear crank seal while I am here as I'd already ordered the part (a superformance seal)

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  24. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    definitely do the RMS.
     
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  25. Richqv

    Richqv Rookie

    Jul 7, 2021
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    Thanks to everyone who commented on this thread. The job took AGES but is now done. The oil leak is no more and the culprit looks to have been the largest of the three O rings. It is clearly kinked in the picture.
     
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