Monterey RM Auction Results | FerrariChat

Monterey RM Auction Results

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari/F80' started by Bill S, Aug 13, 2015.

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  1. Bill S

    Bill S Formula 3

    Oct 2, 2004
    1,995
    Pope Enzo $5.5M and F50 $1.8M. Enzo looked very clean. F50 not so clean with noticeable very poor repairs on doors and engine cover.
     
  2. geno berns

    geno berns F1 Rookie

    Oct 26, 2006
    3,006
    Midwest
    Full Name:
    Geno
    The F50 also had the front bumper reshot with out sanding the old rock chips out. The clear plexy looked a mess with lots of cracking around the mounting points and white residue all around the parameter. A few other touch ups around the front end. Sold for $1,980,000 with the premium I believe. $200k too high IMO.

    Geno

     
  3. Camlet1

    Camlet1 Formula 3

    May 3, 2014
    2,085
    UK

    I'm so not neutral, but that doesn't stop me from saying I'm over the moon with the F50 result. Mine is European, mint (apart from a dodgy AC fan which is being fixed) it's done 5.5k miles, and she's epic. Never quite sure if the F50 will ever emerge into the sunlight it fully deserves and with a cooling of sentiment generally I was worried it would wobble in Monterey. So happy in the UK (even if the weather today here sucks).
     
  4. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    42,831
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    What a ridiculous price on the Pope Enzo. I see no reason why it should be worth 3x as much as a normal Enzo, low milage and (if you're religious) Pope blessing sure account for a few hundred K for the collectors but 6m. Unbelievable.

    I've got a sincere worry that many of the cars are being bought now by investors who really only care about the monetary aspect of the car and perhaps so they can brag (certainly in the Pope's Enzo) at parties where you have to wear a tux that your Enzo is blessed by the pope, and it's parked right next to your Picasso, with velvet rope around it.
     
  5. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

    Jun 9, 2005
    21,674
    Full Name:
    Christian.Fr
    It was the "last" Enzo :))....the Pope signature is 10% of the price.
    Well, in case that is Vatican bank who bought the car for
    Their museum you can change the dynamic numbers.:)
     
  6. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    42,831
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    Sure, ''last'' (officially of course. experts put the numbers closer to 480 to as high as 550 odd). But it's in no way different than the first, 93rd or 260th Enzo. It's not build better, or has an FXX engine.

    I appreciate that the ''last'' official car made is worth a little extra, and that it was blessed by his Popeness, and that it has no milage to speak of. But none of these things make it worth this much more than any other Enzo.

    Hence, I hope that the investor who bought this gets shot in the foot and that his investment turns sour. I'm in no way against making money (otherwise what would I be doing here on this forum!), but the man who bought this was simply seeing dollar signs. Nothing to do with love for cars anymore IMO. I really hope this doesn't ruin the market even more for people who really love cars and want to drive them.
     
  7. roma1280

    roma1280 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 2, 2010
    4,835
    Palm Beach, Roma
    I think Christian is spot on. Collectors always like the first of anything, the last of anything and anything rare like prototypes or with special racing history or stories. I think it's super cool that it was the last Enzo and even cooler that it is associated with the Pope. If I was a bored billionaire looking invest a few hours of interest on my money into another car, I would just keep bidding on the Pope's Enzo until it was mine. I guess in the case the bidding stopped at $5m.

    After I had bought the car I would call up one of my other bored billionaire friends and say "I own the Pope's Enzo and you don't NA NA NA NA NAH .." and then hang up
     
  8. roma1280

    roma1280 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 2, 2010
    4,835
    Palm Beach, Roma
    I on the other hand applaud the guy for buying something he wanted, not caring that maybe he was overpaying for it and I hope he enjoys it in the best of health.
     
  9. BJK

    BJK F1 Veteran

    Jul 18, 2014
    5,524
    CT
    and there had to be a SECOND 'insane' bidder in the room to drive the price up to that point.
     
  10. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    I'm a little more skeptical, and from my perspective with every reason to be, in this case the result was not as accidental as you suggest it might be, this notion underscored by the fact that the final number was @ the suggested estimate issued a while ago.
     
  11. Camlet1

    Camlet1 Formula 3

    May 3, 2014
    2,085
    UK
    Couldn't agree more.

    Shouldn't be too harsh. Everything we do is irrational, it's what makes us human. You think the bunch of us posting about this stuff is rational? I don't know what's more nuts, a Pope owning Enzo selling for mega bucks, or us spending time talking about it :) Judging by my wife and her tut tut every time I pick up my ipad, it's the latter lol. I too hope the person who bought the Enzo many years of health driving, bragging or polishing.
     
  12. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
    42,831
    ESP
    Full Name:
    Bas
    I do hope you're right and this is not a purchase with just making more $$$ on his mind.

    I was sitting here criticizing but if I had a lot of cash and no Zonda yet I'd lay down well over market value to have one...
     
  13. roma1280

    roma1280 F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 2, 2010
    4,835
    Palm Beach, Roma
    I'm the guy sitting at home taking everything at face vale. You guys are the experts so I defer to you.

    To the layman it would seem unlikely that the sale of that car would be one big charade, but stranger things have happened I'm sure!
     
  14. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    I appreciate the sentiments.

    No, I'm not suggesting its one big charade, more like a slight exaggeration of enthusiasm, based on not much more than the possibility of sprinkled Holy Water.

    Yes, people do pay more for a first-of-a-series or last-of-a-series, or a documented historical ownership. 10% more, maybe 15% more in exceptional cases. But not 100% or 150% more.

    You'll have to excuse my dispassionate and level-headed nature even when talking about Ferrari Supercars. I have a tendency to not get carried away. Its one of the reasons people hire me.
     
  15. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

    Jun 9, 2005
    21,674
    Full Name:
    Christian.Fr
    The Enzo is a great car, this one in particulary.
    This car, will be a capsule of time and it s good to know that.

    Sometimes, in thoses auctions I m asking myself if Peter Sellers is here...
     
  16. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Aug 25, 2004
    5,836
    Dallas Texas
    Full Name:
    If you know you know
    I'd be " that " guy too!

    S
     
  17. cvalentone

    cvalentone Rookie

    Aug 14, 2015
    1
    Hi all, I am new here to this forum.

    This $6M sale is crazy .. this means a regular Enzo is $5m and we know they are not there yet!!

    I was in person and bid on this car. An amazing car and I am really sad. To me, the Enzo will always be iconic. LaFerrari is a better machine but the Enzo will be remembered as the car that ushered in the supercars of the 21st century.

    You cannot find delivery mile Enzos anymore and I felt 4M+premium for this car was a great deal and boy was I dreaming with that price. I based that on a delivery enzo being 3.5M.

    Joe, I am new here. I dont see how to private message (maybe I dont have this option until I post enough?) Can you reach out to me, I am looking for an Enzo and need one ASAP. Maybe I am crazy but I think the Enzo will be worth more than the LaFerrari in 5 years. LaFerrari is the hot topic right now, but in 5 years I bet the Enzo is worth more because of the history of the car.
     
  18. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary

    Mar 2, 2005
    24,868
    Yes, it takes two to tango.
    The second underbidder (personally known to me and from central FL) stopped at 4.6 M, the last underbidder was from India and gave up at 5.4 M.

    Marcel Massini
     
  19. Tenney

    Tenney F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2001
    4,297
    Price paid, in addition to being the last one and Pope provenance, may help solidify this one as the one to own going forward?
     
  20. bundas

    bundas F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 31, 2005
    7,090
    lexington ky usa
    Full Name:
    mitchell barnes
    I have done that once or twice��. Sounds nuts but I really enjoyed sticking the other bidder. They always said, ' you paid too much'. Ok. But I got it�� and you don't. I was always really bad at auctions about this. Auctioneers have some times called my hand. Other bidders would just stop trying to bid. That's what I was after. Home run at that point.
     
  21. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    #21 joe sackey, Aug 15, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Your PM is not set up yet.

    I do have a very nice low-mileage Enzo for you right now at a fraction of the price of the subject car (think number that starts with a 2), also red and also flawless, it'll make you smile just as much. In fact, it was owned by someone famous too.

    Contact me on [email protected] or call me on (714) 928 56256, it'll be my pleasure.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  22. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    It depends on what a buyer is looking for.

    This car is red, and claims 2 things:

    - A "last" status.

    - A famed ownership.

    Regarding the "last" status, technically, the car is a 'post-production' car, and another car, number 399/399, the actual last 'production' car (a car that happens to be owned by a client of mine) claims legitimate last status, also. In fact, my client would much rather have 399/399 than 400/399. No stories (albeit cool ones) to explain in 20 years. If one wishes to be truly technical and define 'last' by the way of the very final Enzo to be built by the works, either production or post-production, then even the "pope's" Enzo is not the 'last' Enzo. There are Enzos built after it. The only absolute "last" is 399/399 by way of being the one-and-only 'production last', that much is incontestable.

    Regarding the famed ownership, I looked into this and the information I received was that the "pope Enzo" car was never actually owned by the pope. Ever seen any pics of him standing by it, sitting in it, or (better still) driving it? That's because the car was built for the purposes of being sold by a charity of which he is a patron. If ever a car's ownership provenance was a stretch by remote association, this is it. This is not a car that was registered, used or enjoyed by a famed owner in the way, say, a Steve Mc Queen car was, and that is a huge difference which the astute collector will note as obvious. That difference translates into a real value difference.

    No doubt the car is a special Enzo, but the pope linkage is rather exaggerated. IMVHO, people are getting carried away, as the car's so-called claim to fame is not peerless or incontestable.

    "The one to own" going forward should be for you, not for other people. I have a client looking for an Enzo, and he doesn't care whether it was owned by the President of the United States or was the first one built. It just has to be black in color. To him, thats "the one to own". So, as I said, it all depends on what a buyer is looking for, and the one to own will be different for everyone.

    Regarding prices - by all means people should pay what they want to pay, and the more they want to pay, the more everyone seems to benefit. For now, till things change, and they will. One can only suggest prudence & caution so much. After all, a buyer can and should be able to spend their money how they like.
     
  23. Camlet1

    Camlet1 Formula 3

    May 3, 2014
    2,085
    UK
    Fascinating, honest and pragmatic.
     
  24. Tenney

    Tenney F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2001
    4,297
    Good point(s), Joe.

    Of course if the Pope had dropped by the atelier to spec his car, Zanasi would've installed a taillight kill switch!

    With ya on the one to own being the one for you (though perhaps for some, the one for them is indeed the one for others?!).

    Still suspect that the Enzo market in general, if there is such a thing (maybe we just witnessed a bit it?), may place this one at the top - unless other Enzo's are now 5M cars, or Jim bails on the P4/5.
     
  25. joe sackey

    joe sackey Five Time F1 World Champ

    May 23, 2006
    57,525
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Joe Sackey
    Enzos are basically $2m to $3m in my book, and nothing I see warrants a departure from this. If anything, the market has cooled from 6 mos ago, and the global situation doesn't exactly inspire great confidence. So, more of the same is a good thing.

    As regards top-of-the tree Enzos, I'd suggest 001/399, 399/399, or, a car truly owned and enjoyed by a Ferrari icon such as multiple World Champion Michael Schumacher's Enzo or FXX. Those would be some Holy Grail Enzos in my book.

    That said, the top Enzo is the one in your garage!
     

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