My $15,500 oil change and the mechanic from hell

Peter,

I wish I could wave a wand and cause these problems to disappear. We talked on the phone several months back and I found you to be a genuine and nice guy. Unfortunately folks like you are sometimes very trusting (I am too) and get screwed.

I would not just let it slide. I would apply every measure of pressure I could in order to get criminal charges filed. Can't you sue for more than $2,500, but you just can't do it in small claims? You may not have much luck collecting, but if you get a judgement against the guy, have a PI do a search on his assets. If he has a car, a house, a bank account, or anything, you can go after it. If he has none of those, then in most states a judgement is good for 6 years. He would not be able to have any of those things without risk of seizure for 6 years. That would be incentive to pay.

One positive aspect of getting partial payments is:

1) a partial payment is better than no payment
2) it establishes that he acknowledges and admits what he owes
3) I believe the life of a judgement is measured from the last payment. If he goes 2 years, then pays you $20, it's X years from that date (I believe).

Unfortunately the guy probably has a lot of folks in this position, and not enough worth to satisfy them all. I would get together with others and get a DA to file charges. That "level" of fraud should net him at least a few years in jail, PLUS restitution to you I would think.

Good luck.

 

Peters

I feel of you BIG TIME brother. I have been scamed myself in the past, by a childhood friends mother no less! It was only for a grand, but the close personal relationship made it worse.

Anyhow, you ABSOLUTELY have to take this guy to court! With the other people that he has ripped off this has to be done. The problem with letting this go is that he will continue to do this to others. He has to be stopped from doing this again. Because he will. He may be an excellent mechanic, however, it is well known, that money can corrupt even the best of us. So take him to court and let the law take care of him.

Man it is SOOOOO hard not to think about breaking this guys knees. Sometimes violence is nessesary, but this is not one of those times. If a member of your family was in danger, then by all means, violence is a valid option. But this is not a situation like that. It is only money. It isn't worth sitting in the clink for this scum bag. He is the one that needs to be behind bars, not you. So let the courts handle it. Why don't you also look into having the D.A. go after this guy criminally? It is worth looking into.

I hope things turn out okay for you. Man this just sucks.

 

This brings up very bad memories. I had a VW Scirocco with a blown headgasket sitting in my garage. I had just gotten my first Corrado, and didn't care about the Scirocco, but my Dad was stuck driving a crappy station wagon and wanted the S for himself. So I took it to a shop recommended by a friend, it was the shop his family had used for year. Turns out they were the ones getting used.

Scirocco went in for headgasket. Estimate was $250- and a one week turnaround. Several weeks went by, no word. I didn't care, I was happy driving my Corrado, and my Dad, an admiral in the Navy, was too busy to notice.

Well life throws you curves sometimes... Dad was flying through New Mexico en route to St. Louis with his CAG, and his F/A-18 went down in a snowstorm. Search party couldn't locate them for over 24 hours due to the storm, but it turned out that he'd been killed. Horrible. Absolutely horrible. Needless to say the family was a mess, me included. He was the first USN Admiral to be killed in the line of duty since WWII, so it was all over CNN and what have you.

So during this time, the weasel working on the car decides to take advantage and do some improvements. He does fix the headgasket, but replaces all the valves, lifters, waterpump (which had just been replaced the year prior), and a long list of other stuff that didn't need to be touched.

A week after my dad's funeral, the guy calls me and tells me the bill was $1100- plus another $400 for storage. Claimed that he'd called us to have us pick up the car a few weeks prior. "Your dad authorized all the repairs and for us to store it while he was out of town."

Well problem, my dad's name was not on the repair order, I did not live at home with my parents, my name was on the car's title, and my dad had at no point been brought up in conversation with the mechanic. So this was total BS, and he was trying to take advantage of us at our worst moments.

I refused to pay a cent more than the estimate I'd approved. He threatened to disassemble the car and leave it on the street if I didn't pay him what he demanded.

Had to take him to court. What a pain.

You know, these kinds of mechanics are true idiots... think of all the money they lose from having repeat customers, if they were only honest and efficient at their jobs!

 

Just a foot note. I have had an entire car stollen very cleverly buy a mechanic. It was an old Lincoln that my dad had gotten me for my first car. The body was in great condition. It was a late 60's car. The one with the suiside doors, and the rear window that rolled down. Anyway it was left with the mechanic to have the engine over hauled while we went on vacation. Money was paid in advance for the job. Yup Peters your not the only one that has done something dumb like this before. So we go on vaction for a month come back expecting the car to be ready, only to find that the car is gone. We ask were it is and the guy tells us that is got totalled sitting outside of the shop. His story was that someone hit it and ran in the middle of the night, and it went to the wrecking yard. No paper work from the wrecking yard, no police report of the insodent, nothing. It was all a load of lies. We didn't have any paper work of the engine work that was supposed to be done, because the mechanic was a friend of my dad. So we had to let it go. The only thing I ever got back was $100, that's it. Now this was no Ferrari but, for a sixteen year old kid to have his first car ripped off sucked big time. So Peters, when I said I felt your pain, I really ment it. Take the dirt bag to court.

 

Very sorry to hear about your situation Peters, I have just read the thread by Eric called scamed, and noticed your responce to him on the first page about business sense, two sides to every story ect,ect. I think when someone trys to warn people in the Ferrari comunity about ****s who rip of owners, there warnings should be taken notice of. I dont mean to sound harsh at all becourse i am realy realy sorry about what has happend to you, but Eric was trying to warn every one about this guy, did anyone listen. Eric also stated about the guys aftermarket ferrari lines and how they came about with no financial margin but still you said yes to haveing parts fitted.I know i am stateing the obvious but for someone who talks about business sense.....you paid him thousands up front.I would love to hear what Eric is thinking right now. Tossers like the mechanic realy piss me of when i hear about it, but equally .........well i wont go on.

 

Regarding the "Eric" thread
As in any business transaction that hasn't been resolved yet, sometimes it's necessary to be passive before becoming aggressive.

Eric was retaliating by (planning to) put other people's parts on ebay. That was bordering on criminal activity, which I "read between the lines" on peters admonishment, even before peters became specific later on the aforementioned thread. It is true, he was defending Wayne after Wayne replied. BUT, in my mind's eye, it's possible peters was dangling a carrot in front of Wayne Hynes to get peters car out and about once the "critical mass" point of no return had been reached AND make certain peters stuff weren't among those items being sold.

The time came and went and here we all are today, wailing and gnashing teeth, because we were enlightened by peters - who tried to resolve not only his own issues quietly, but literally and figuratively, that of a newbie's - *Eric's issue so that Critical Mass would not be reached...
*=(Who the hell is this guy? Is he airing dirty laundry? Does he have a mechanic's lien? He's selling other people's stuff? Is some of that stuff "mine"? "mine" = peters)

But, like I stated, it's just in my mind's eye.
_____
Wayne Hynes's site:
http://www.srexoticautomotive.com/
..."This website is temporary shut down for maintenance"...
Surprise! Not.
_____
Assuming one's case falls within Statute of Limitations for any disputed charges - for a primer on Small Claims, go over this:
http://public.findlaw.com/consumer/newcontent/consumerbook/dgtchp7_a.html

That leads to "Common Scenarios" such as the following:
http://public.findlaw.com/consumer/newcontent/consumerbook/dgtchp7_a1.html

IMPROPER WORK, LABOR, OR SERVICES

Example:You pay a person or business to perform work, labor or services and you:

do not receive service
receive inferior workmanship
receive the wrong service
you perform work, labor, or services and are not paid

1. What You Must Prove
The person, company, or business that agreed to perform services
1. How to Prove It
Your testimony, contract

2. What You Must Prove
What work was promised
2. How to Prove It
Contract, notes, correspondence, sketches, promotional material

3. What You Must Prove
What was paid
3. How to Prove It
Canceled check, receipt

4. What You Must Prove
(a) Service was not performed
(b) Inferior workmanship
(c) Wrong services performed
(d) You performed work competently, for a fee; the defendent accepted the work performed but won't pay
4. How to Prove It
(a) Photographs, your testimony, witnesses
(b) Photographs, your testimony, witnesses, mechanics' estimates of repair
(c) Your testimony, witnesses
(d) Photographs, your testimony, witnesses, written contract, notes, partial payment by canceled check, receipt

"Defenses":
Services were performed properly.
You were unreasonable (kept changing work plans, etc.).

You can also include components of the the next section on the "Common Scenarios" link:
WRONGFUL TAKING AND BAILMENT...

 

Peters,
I am quite sorry to hear of this happening. I have seen it before. Do not let the issue drop.

Tom B.,
No truer words were ever spoken! We will all carry the weight of this!

TRVFreak,
Could not disagree with you more. In this business there has to be a level of trust. Trust has to be hard earned without question. On occation I take deposits for jobs that require large parts orders. My general rule is to pay for the parts and then invoice the customer. This tends to ensure the customers money is used for their car only. My std agreement is to bill every 2 weeks on jobs that take longer than that. The bill comes with pictures of work as it progresses, all parts purchased and a detailed description of work performed durning that period. When a deposit is involved the bill comes with a spread sheet showing balances. This creates a huge amount of extra paper work but as stated above trust is, and should be, hard earned.
I take great pride in being able to call my customers friends. The day that I have to sign an agreement like you suggested is the day that I close the shop doors and get into the construction industry (smile)!
There are still some of us around that consider a hand shake a binding contract, and live by that code of conduct.

 

Clear solution:
1) Lawsuit for damages, loss of use, lack of specific performance, $ scammed

2) Break legs after you collect!

 

PeterS.....

You went into the arrangment with the best of intentions based upon more than satisfactory past experience.....and I would have done the same. You can at least consol yourself with that knowledge. Dealers and independants and individuals will continue to steal from clients however. Go to the police.....even if they dismiss you, press the issue.....if enough people do they eventually will investigate. I've seen it happen before in our industry.

The last time this happened on this magnitude with several people I know.....it was a garage owner who put most of his business's and customers ready cash up his nose.

 

PeterS - Sue him! Talk with the DA, but it sure sounds criminal AND civil!

I am sorry you were duped...you have gone through all of our worst fears.

I don't trust ANY mechanic right now, which is why I am helping others to learn about their Porsches right now...starting off small, lol, until I get to my own 308!

Look, if it makes you feel any better, I know of some guy, who at age 19, was NEVER shown how to work on cars by his father! On his way to college, his father gave him 5 minutes to show him where the oil went, where the automatic transmission went. Toyota Tercel, btw.

Needless to say, I got a call from a Porsche dealership by him, crying...I run down there to see what happened, and I find a BLOWN engine!

Porsche offered to drop in a new engine for $2000, which I KNOW was generous coming from them! I have personally stayed in touch with this dealership, they have been invaluable for me for parts, when I can't have used ones.

But this poor kid had just spent all his money on the car, so my cousin and I did the job for $500.

What had happened is that he was checking the automatic transmission fluid, and thought the oil in the engine was okay.

In the end, I was kicking the old engine, when what do I see!? A 7" wad of newspaper was jarred loose - coming out of the coolant hose area - WTF!?

The idiot before him had shoved that in, while working on the Headgasket, INSTEAD of properly draining the fluid!

So, do not kick yourself over the crankcase oil...we all have done something like it, or know someone. As a future owner of the 308, I am going to definitely learn from this, and make sure I will identify the correct areas for the different oils.

Curiosity - when you added the engine oil, didn't you notice that you had an increase of volume on the Oil dipstick? I would have thought you would change the oil filter, too, which would have probably leaked oil all over you.

Oh, well...live and learn!

Good luck!

- Julie

 

Dave, you and Tom B may be the exception, but my principles for engaging a mechanic have been extremely effective for me and my friends. I learnt my lessons the hard way. The friends who use my "rules" also have all been burnt. Peters' story has been repeated hundreds of times. The industry is rife with rip-off artists.

Reading your post, I think you are disagreeing only to signing a contract beforehand, not to the customer not leaving the car with you and not to the customer not paying for items and work in advance.

You are right that there has to be a level of trust in business. We disagree on the level of trust that ought to be shown. Notice in my post that I did not advise doing things like asking for the old/discarded parts back. I also did not recommend several things that would show a real lack of trust, and create more work for the mechanic.

I do recommend protecting yourself by:
- Minimizing the amount of time your car is left in the mechanic's facility
(you have not specifically mentioned this, but I would think you would be fine with not having another car in your facility if you were not working on it),

- by not paying for parts up front
(this is standard practice for you),

- by not paying for all the work up front
(standard practice for you),

- and by putting the contract in writing
(you disagree with this, but you create equivalent or better documentation of your progress through pictures and and an accounting of the funds through spreadsheets).

An oral contract is very difficult to prove in a court of law. Most Business Law 101 courses teach "Put it in writing!" as a very basic principle. It's great that you can conduct business on a handshake. Unfortunately, people like you are few and far between.

Rgds,
Faisal.

 

I would talk with your local DA. If this guy has done this to others, they may already have some knowledge of him. You'd be suprised how quickly little things like a phone call or fax can also constitute wire fraud in the hands of the right prosecutor. Much may depend on the willingness of criminal justice authorities to devote time to the matter. My suggestion is to find a criminal lawyer with entre to the DA and arrange an appointment to make a complaint. After that, its pretty much out of your hands. You cannot threaten criminal prosecution as a means to get reimbursed (that would be extortion), nor will you see a dime from the guy even if he gets convicted. But, you will not spend very much of your own money on lawyer's fees, and you might have the pleasure of seeing this guy be forced to chew what he bit off. (One other thing i've found is that the authorities like "sexy" matters; it doesn't hurt that you are talking about Ferraris, so if the prosecutor can find a case in this, he knows he can get some publicity).

Also agree that the filing of a civil suit doesn't cost much, but if you don't prosecute it, it won't mean much more than a "lis pendens"; if you do prosecute it, it will cost time and money, with little likely upside. So, on balance, i would opt for a criminal complaint for fraud, conversion, etc. (Let the criminal lawyer you hire to get you hooked up with the authorities spend a little creative time in the books, conjuring up all the crimes this guy can be held accountable for; in my experience, the easier you make it for the civil servants, the more likely they are to help you). This is where you might get some real bang for your buck. Good luck. PS. The lawyer you hire can also hire a private investigator to climb up this guy's ass. (Let the lawyer do it, its then covered by privilege). I've seen people get into big trouble for "other" crimes that just happen to be found along the way; one client of mine routinely starts to deal with any dispute by having his consigliere hire private guys to look into the past. Always turns up some interesting, and sometimes useful, stuff.

 

Peter: whatever the locals can do, just name it.

--Dan

 

Suing?

Depends on how much money you have and what you seek to accomplish.

If your goal in suing is to come out ahead financially at the end of the day, it is probably not a good idea. You probably don't have a way to recover attorneys fees, and you'll spend more in fees than you'll recover.

Plus, the guy is obviously a deadbeat. Even if you were to get a judgment, it would probably be hard to collect.

If your goal is to make his life miserable, and get vindicated in court, and you are willing to pay (probably a lot) for it, go for it.

Getting a lawyer involved is really too late at this point. If a lawyer was to get involved, it should have been at the beginning of this train wreck.

This guy obviously smelt a sucker/softy the second you cut that $6500 check (in exchange for which you received nothing but air). You were dead the SECOND that check cleared.

As to criminal, good luck. You can report it to the DA, just don't really expect anything to happen.

Finally, as the the post above which says "Also agree that the filing of a civil suit doesn't cost much, but if you don't prosecute it, it won't mean much more than a "lis pendens"; if you do prosecute it, it will cost time and money, with little likely upside." What does that mean? How in the world would a lis pendens in any possible way be involved in this dispute???

 

suing is too costly, and he wont pay anyway, see if he will pay you anything, if he will good, something is better than nothing, most of all let it go, you have too. you are caught in one of those catch -22's life is too short.

he will get his, they always do.

Sorry this whole story sucks!

john

 

Gearhead quoted me:"Finally, as the the post above which says "Also agree that the filing of a civil suit doesn't cost much, but if you don't prosecute it, it won't mean much more than a "lis pendens"; if you do prosecute it, it will cost time and money, with little likely upside."

and then asked:

What does that mean? How in the world would a lis pendens in any possible way be involved in this dispute???

Gearhead: I meant "lis pendens" in the literal, latin sense of the word, which is not confined to real estate disputes; that is, a litigation is pending. If you weren't being facetious in asking what I meant by my comment, it was, that while true that it is cheap to initiate a suit (drafting complaint and filing fee), not prosecuting a civil case vigorously, and letting it languish, might indeed be cheap--i was responding to an earlier suggestion that the initial cost of suing is not great--but that its virtually worthless, ie, gives the plaintiff a right to claim that it has a pending lawsuit against the defendant. That will be revealed in searchs of public records, but little more. As to the rest of my statement, i think it is self-evident that strenuously litigating a civil case costs money, and in this case, the guy-as you put it, is apparently a deadbeat- thus, "little possible upside." Kapish?

As to the merits of seeking criminal prosecution, well, it does depend on alot of things, but i wouldn't conclude that it is impossible. But, there's only one way to find out, right? And, what's the downside?

 

If you sue the guy you will probably win.......absolutely nothing. So drop that whole money wasting waste of time. What is more important, is if you thought you drained the oil out of the car. What happened when you added 10 quarts of oil to an already full car. Where did it all go? Can a Ferrari hold 20 quarts without it comeing out the filler tube?
I think this is the important question!

 

What criminal charges would you try to get a assistant DA to file? They might be busy with other criminal cases, murder, tort, theft, on and on.

Gabriel & others have said it all. File on him, win judgement and get $0. Then again he has a "business", so chance are if he wants to stay in business you will get your cash.

In court, its not what you know. Its what you can prove.

Good luck &
Thanks for warning us about this guy.

 

Small claims in California can be up to $5,000, it is only limited to $2,500 if you file small claims more than twice in one year. It won't cost you much to do a small claim action for $5k, and it will give you some vindication seeing him lose in court. Then you can talk to the DA about crimial aspects.

-- Michael

 

Im so sorry to hear this taken place....sue his ass....might cost a few bucks but he should not be allowed to get away with this.
Good Luck !!

 

Vref: You asked what criminal charge might be filed. I do not practice criminal law in California, but a few minutes with the Criminal Code there unearthed several possibilities, and i'm sure there are more. I'm not sure why you and others are so skeptical. Are you practicing lawyers? Have you ever had anybody put down?



484. (a) Every person who shall feloniously steal, take, carry,
lead, or drive away the personal property of another, or who shall
fraudulently appropriate property which has been entrusted to him or
her, or who shall knowingly and designedly, by any false or
fraudulent representation or pretense, defraud any other person of
money, labor or real or personal property,... is guilty of theft.



532. (a) Every person who knowingly and designedly, by any false or
fraudulent representation or pretense, defrauds any other person of
money, labor, or property, whether real or personal,. .. is punishable in the same manner and to the same extent as for larceny of the money or property so obtained.



484b. Any person who receives money for the purpose of obtaining or
paying for services, labor, materials or equipment and willfully
fails to apply such money for such purpose by either willfully
failing to complete the improvements for which funds were provided or
willfully failing to pay for services, labor, materials or equipment
provided incident to such construction, and wrongfully diverts the
funds to a use other than that for which the funds were received,
shall be guilty of a public offense and shall be punishable by a
fine not exceeding ten thousand dollars ($10,000), or by imprisonment
in the state prison, or in the county jail not exceeding one year,
or by both such fine and such imprisonment if the amount diverted is
in excess of one thousand dollars ($1,000). If the amount diverted
is less than one thousand dollars ($1,000), the person shall be
guilty of a misdemeanor.

 

1) Find an excellent lawyer well versed in these issues.

2) Define what you want back within limits of the law. If your lawyer says you are screwed, then you are.

3) If you cannot get your money back, ask your lawyer what the maximum amount of harm you can do to him while still being within the boundaries of legality. Class action lawsuit? Can it qualify for one? If so, can you gather the victims and have each pitch in x amount to pay the lawyer for the fees since winning will get you no money?

4) You will probably not make your money back on this. By hiring a great lawyer and gathering his victims together, you have a better chance at putting him under than nature would have allowed to happen.

5) You do everthing legally. You put everything in motion. You get all his victims together, you gather money for whatever lawyer fees and YOU DO NOT ROLL OVER once you have all this in place. 1, 2 years from now, don't let up. 5 -10 years from now? The choice is yours.