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My Latest...

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Napolis, Apr 18, 2005.

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  1. tomgt

    tomgt F1 Veteran
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    Tom Wiggers
    #301 tomgt, May 5, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  2. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    Nice one, Arlie ! :D The old fella certainly has a lot (of confusion) to answer for !
     
  3. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    Le Mans Test Days, in April 1967, to be precise, Tom. Check the style of the #21 .... and the eBay seller's text.
    Photo is currently for sale on eBay: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5193757318
    .... for the princely sum of £2.99 (re-listed twice).
    Careful you don't give anything away, Tom .... ;)
     
  4. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Honorary Owner

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    Oh I think it will add a certain je ne c'est quois...
     
  5. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
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    Sep 30, 2003
    18,059
    Savannah
    geeze , Mr piper had a 917 also???? holy crap, that guy has owned, raced, wrecked and chopped up all the the "ICON" racecars!


    Mr Skett, i just wanted to add how nice it is to read all your additions to the recent threads. your grasp of the history and how things have evolved are incredible. i cant imagine trying to keep all of these people, parts and races in the order they occured. your passion is truly great. Michael
     
  6. goin2fast52

    goin2fast52 Karting

    May 2, 2005
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    Andrew
    Jim,
    I am new here at Fcat, and I am totally speechless looking at these amazing cars of yours.
    I just so happen to be coming to New York City June 16-21, so I was wondering if it wouldn't be too much trouble for you to take a little day trip to the city one day...? :) If not, I bet I could convince my uncle to meet in the middle :)
    Keep driving those aweosme cars the way hey were meant to be driven,
    Andrew Briefman
     
  7. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    #307 P4Replica, May 6, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Still has, as far as I know, Michael, and continues to race it in the occasional historic event, along with (if I'm not mistaken), his Ford P68 3-litre; Matra MS650; and of course the Ferraris: 250LM (his favourite); 330P; 365P2/3 and P4 ..... see photos below (top one David sat in 917).
    Pretty impressive for someone coming up to their 75th birthday this year, eh ?
    See: http://www.racecar.co.uk/isp/ and http://www.racecar.co.uk/isp/david.html

    Thank you for your kind remark, Michael. Yes - I am truly a 'P4 obsessed' - I spend FAR too much time in Vintage, posting on P4 threads for my own good ! If I get time this evening, I have another little interesting 'P4 snippet' that will help keep this thread alive while Jim is going through #0854.
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  8. Wouter Melissen

    Wouter Melissen Formula Junior

    Nov 12, 2003
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    Wouter Melissen
    He was a very loyal Ferrari privateer, but then he bought a 917. He lost a part of his leg in an accident in the Porsche...
     
  9. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    #309 P4Replica, May 6, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Yes - during filming for Steve McQueen's 'Le Mans' movie.
    See here: http://www.pts106.com/Ford%20F3L.htm and scroll down half a page. Note this quote from the last paragraph (written in 2003): "At Le Mans last June in the classic race before the 24 Hour he got his 917 to over 200 mph down the Mulsanne straight. In December he turned 73 and I really can't figure out how he does it."
    Photo of Piper's 917 below - Note 1970 Le Mans style 'scallops' over Piper BP green.
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  10. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    Not wishing to turn this into 'The David Piper' thread, or cause anyone to 'jump ship', there was a nice little thread about David (the source of some of my URL links and photos), in the Atlas F1 Nostalgia forum, a while back.
    Makes for quite an interesting little read, and gives an insight into the career of this 'gentleman racer'.
    See: http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=73895
     
  11. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

    Nov 4, 2003
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    As promised …. And in belated reply to a couple of Arlie’s (‘Horsefly') earlier posts:
    and also (from the ‘Mystery P4 photos’ thread):
    Sorry, Arlie …. There was one that I had forgotten:

    Back in early 2002 (up until May, at least), there was, advertised for sale on both Pennsylvania Motor Sport’s website (for $20K): (http://www.pamotor.com - now defunct) and also on Rick Carey’s website: http://www.rickcarey.com , what purported to be the original nose clip from 330P4 spyder #0860.
    The text on both websites included the following paragraphs:

    “The panel offered here appears to be the original 330P4 nose which graced the entry of Chris Amon and Jackie Stewart (chassis no. 0860) at the July 1967 BOAC 500km at Brands Hatch where it finished second, earning the extra point which secured the 1967 World Championship for Ferrari from Porsche. Old and tired, beat up and scarred, it bears about 60% of its original paint, and carries the race number “6” in characteristic style. According to historians, the only P4 which ever raced under the number “6” is the Stewart/Amon Brands Hatch car.

    It is likely that the nose panel offered here, adorned with the race number 6 of the Brands Hatch 500km, was quickly discarded in the rush to transform 0860 from the CSI Group 6 330P4 into the 4.2 liter Can-Am Ferrari 350. Tossed on a scrap pile, it had no further utility in a racing world that would take 312P’s and McLarens to championships.

    Yet, this artifact of racing evolution and regulatory obsolescence is, most probably, the nose that crossed the line second in the 1967 BOAC 500 to leverage Ferrari the World Championship over Porsche. It doesn’t get much more “historic” than that.

    The part itself is visibly old, efflorescing quietly from years of exposure to the elements with the characteristic white fuzz that the lightweight magnesium-aluminum alloys of the period exhibit. Circumstantial though it may be, replica panels wouldn’t use exotic lightweight alloys. Large blobs of badly deteriorated mushy foam cap the air intake ducts. There is no hardware or emblems beyond the large “6” painted on the ancient nose.

    Reach your own conclusion from the photographic evidence or on-site inspection. We think this is the P4 nose that …. and so on ....” (© Copyright 1996-2002 R.S. Carey and various publishers).

    Sadly, although I printed out both web pages, at the time, I never thought to ‘right-click’ and save the excellent close-up photos from Rick Carey’s website. From what I can make out, they appear to support the description above. Does anybody else possibly still have these photos, saved to their HD, that they could post ?

    Apparently (from notes I made elsewhere), this nose clip was subsequently sold as Lot #105 at RM Auctions, Santa Monica auction on 5/25/2002 (very cheaply, if it was the genuine article) for a mere $6.9K including 15% commission …. to Symbolic Motors.

    Now, as you probably know, Symbolic have had many past involvements with P4’s, beside handling sales, including, in 1998, the conversion of #0844 from a N.A.R.T. Can-Am spyder to it’s original P3/4 berlinetta configuration, using, (dare I mention it) body panels supplied by one David Piper – (don’t even ask !).
    See: http://www.symbolicmotors.com/images/restoration_dept/0844/0844.html

    Many years prior to this, Pierre Bardinon had also converted his 350 Can-Am, #0860, back into a P4 spyder, using aluminium bodywork also supplied by David Piper. (Piper’s own ‘continuation’ P4 #0900 allegedly still wears the original P4 spyder bodywork from #0860) ….

    And so …. To the $64K question(s) – does anybody know whether this alleged original #0860 P4 spyder nose clip was genuine, and where it is now, and more to the point, who owns it – or which car is it fitted to ???

    Being offered for sale on the West Coast of the USA, was this possibly an original panel scavenged from the Modena ‘graveyard’ by his ‘partner in crime’, Tom Meade, rather than David Piper (for a change) ?

    Confused ? You will be ! Blame good old David Piper (and Tom Meade) ! LOL :D
     
  12. wax

    wax Five Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 20, 2003
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    Dirty Harry
    Disclaimer be damned... Crikey. Marry Pipes already. Can 'Napolis have just one thread where you don't start blowing bagpipes? *As SuperDave might say,* "all this sycophantic A$$-licking is making me want to paint everything green." Since you love the sound of your own internet voice so much, pay attention to your own weary quote:
    Right, Mr. Embodiment-Of-The-Above-Personified.

    So, this is it. Start all the fawning, glowing threads you want to celebrate Piper's many achievements and modifications in his storied lifetime, but restrict your comments on Napolis's threads to the cars, minus the tiresome Pipe-swallowing and accompanying slurping sounds, sarcasm, spite and sneering smiley's. :) :) :) :)

    Your obsession with all things beginning with "P" does not go unappreciated, but there are unwritten rules when it comes to respecting turf, be it green or otherwise.

    The thread is called "My Latest..." - the "host" of this thread has the moniker of 'Napolis. By default, this is his turf. We are his guests. This is his Love Story with that car and by association, one you openly disdain. I don't care, nor do others, to ungentlemanly be reminded ad nauseum that Piper banged her first.

    Now, what were we talking about?
     
  13. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    Sounds like YOUR ego trip, Tom .... ;) Thank you for another invaluable contribution to the thread (not).
    What is that hanging out or your Avatar's mouth anyway ? A turd ?
     
  14. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Let's keep this civilized, shall we?

    Wax, don't start a fire. I actually am interested in the Piper stories, I do think they relate closely to Jim's cars. Point in case: Just read Jim's 100 page book. You can't talk P3/P4 without seeing green...
    :)
     
  15. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    #315 P4Replica, May 6, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    On more than one occasion, it seems .... See below.
    'Banging' as I always understood it, is part of 'Racing'. Something these particular cars just happened to have been designed for, and are still capable of. A point lost on some people, apparently .... (Note: no smiley - O.K.?)
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  16. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 World Champ

    Nov 1, 2003
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    Angus Podgorney
    In more ways than one, methinks.
    Believe we need a Piper thread...
    BTW, David's going to have to lengthen the wb of the 250 soon...needs to cut back on the carbs.
    This is the "what followed me home" thread...Not the "that puppy is crap, has no papers and won't ever win a dog show" thread.

    Back to our cognitive dissonance programming....
     
  17. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    This pic would make a good one for a capture contest: What's the man in that Simca (?) thinking? "Damn. That Ferrari is just bits and pieces but he lapped me for the 12th time!"
     
  18. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    You talkin' about Wax's avatar ?
     
  19. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    #319 P4Replica, May 6, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    After the pitlane accident at Kyalami, #0854 was temporarily repaired using a short length of scaffolding tubing, and lots of duct tape - and still finished the race in 5th place !
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  20. wax

    wax Five Time F1 World Champ
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    Dirty Harry
    That's a cigar. Where there's smoke, there's fire, but I didn't start the goddamned fire, I'm snuffing it.

    Start all the Piper threads you want, but this thread is about where this car is now, the restoration thereof, considerations given for what it will take to achieve that goal, which is not, by the way, to make it look, run and sound like it did while Piper had it, but before. This thread is not for bashing the current owner (who will pass this and other praiseworthy vehicles on to his heirs) at every opportunity with thinly veiled spite while singing the praises of the Pie-eyed Piper.

    If someone wants to discuss this with me further - do it via PM.

    The "discussion" is over.

    Hence, "Now, what were we talking about?"
     
  21. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 World Champ

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    Think it's an R8 Gordini...friend of mine died in one of those wretched $hitboxes @ Road America.
    Racing is just that. I'm puzzled Paul that you site damage as inevitable, which I agree, yet argue some points based on damage/unlikelihood of repair/salvage. Dichotomous @ best.
    At least you didn't post a GFY when Tom quoted you.
     
  22. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    And not forgetting of course ....
    The occassional bit of sycophantic fawning .... (Note: no winking smiley)
     
  23. P4Replica

    P4Replica Formula 3

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    Slight coincedence, that photo, because the large circular cool air vent on a P4/412P's dash comes from ....
    A Renault 8 Gordini (as Jim knows, of course).
    The bodywork at the time of Piper's accident had fortunately already been changed for thin lightweight fiberglass.
    Trust me, Lee .... I was sorely tempted !
     
  24. Sfumato

    Sfumato F1 World Champ

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    #324 Sfumato, May 6, 2005
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I started a Piper thread, with a nod to the lads of the Grail.
    I don't believe most of us are sycophants here. Tifosi, yes, crazed, yes, rabid, yes. But not sycophantic. I fail miserably @ kissing up, and I have no point in doing so to anyone on the board. I too, love these cars, have seen more than a few come and go, and I am quite interested in a 206 street Dino with crap oil pressure as much as Jim's or Jacques S' cars.
    P cars are wonderful, but they don't convey mystical powers to those who know them, drive them, or pound the crap out of them. They are just cars.
    So agree to disagree, and drop it. Jim has been gracious, I have not been.
    This thread has been similar to the neighbors who come to see a new baby, bring holiday pictures, then won't leave.
    Why the mods tolerated things as they did...it is interesting!
    But the basic disagreement is there, and the thread should be closed/split/dissected somehow.
    In my dreams I know, but hope springs eternal.

    PS:Only thing those wretched cars were good for were the vents.
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  25. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Just speaking for myself as a mod: I jumped to Paul's defense when attacked by some here. I did that because I like to hear what he has to say and because I don't belive Jim needs any help in "defending" himself. At the same token I'd jump on Paul (or anybody else for that matter) if the attacks or his language goes over the deep end. I like a good discussion and I don't mind it to stray away a bit from the original thread. I don't like name calling, foul language and the like.

    As far as the P4 cars are concerned: I see all these pictures all of you post and have to say, despite having been to many Ferrari events, for the life of me I have never seen a P3 or P4 in the flesh, real or replica. Sad, isn't it?

    Finally for what it's worth: Lake Forest Chicago had (has?) a Dino racecar replica for sale. A real beauty.
     

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