My nightmare buying experience with BHCC/Andy Cohen

teterman2004 · Mar 19, 2005

Cavallino Motors said:

Ken:
that is unrealistic in some cases. If you buy from a reputable dealer you have nothing to worry about. Further if you know the car is leased or financed you can get a pay-off from the bank and send them the check and get the title and pay the seller the difference.

Having no title is not the worst thing. Dealing with a dishonest carsalesman is what really should get you going.
Click to expand...

Have to disagree on this one. Even reputable dealers will commonly follow this transaction sequence:

--1) you sign the contract (which obligates you to pay for the car), but the dealer does NOT give you the pink slip (why not. . .?)

--2) contract contains financing terms (usually negotiated at the dealership, very often on the weekends, when banks aren't open)

--3) come monday morning, dealer "sells" your financing to the banking market (if dealer made the right call, no problems, and you get your title in the mail the next week. However, if the dealer gave you too good of a deal and can't sell your paper as it stands, you might get that dreaded phone call, "err, financing fell through at that rate you signed for. . ." this practice, although very common, borders on illegality)

--4) So, you've already had the car for a week. You've already signed a binding contract. You don't have title, and the only way to get it is to "cave" to the dealer and sign the new paper they shove your way. . .

--How does this all apply to high-dollar transactions (like buying a 6 figure car), where we usually obtain financing on our own, etc? Dealers are ACCUSTOMED to holding onto your TITLE, even after you've signed a binding contract and taken possession of the car, even if they only sell 6 figure ferraris. This puts them at a significant advantage if anything goes ary. . . !

Bottom line? No matter how much you want to driver your new toy home that evening, don't take possession without title in hand, and make sure there is an "out" written into the contract that requires clean title within a specific period of time, or the deal's off. . .

410SA · Mar 19, 2005

Another reason why these kind of deals occur without a title changing hands promptly is that the relative value of the deal is small.
I know it sounds obnoxious but it's true.

richard_wallace · Mar 19, 2005

alexpapas said:

Whenever used cars are being traded there are several parties involved - not least of whom are the seller, the buyer and the the middleman. Banks are also involved where they have financed the seller in his original purchase, leasing companies who own an interest in the asset, and there are also sometimes co-owners, such as a spouse soon to become an ex-spouse or a business partner where the car was orininally acquired in a business.

All of these combinations can be present when the seller consigns his car with an agent such as Andy Cohen at BHCC. Now it's hard enough to make a living selling relatively scarce commodities. It's not like you can call the local food wholesaler and order more Kellogs Corn Flakes for your grocery store because demand seems to picking up. Dealers like BHCC rely on consignors -people wanting to sell their cars in an appropriate environment in order to get inventory to show to their prospective customers. They often have to rely on the promises of their consignors regarding the financial condition of the car. Does it have a lien on it? Does anyone else have a claim? is anyone else offering it for sale?

I have bought several cars from dealers. It's almost standard practice that you hand over the money and then take possession of the car. The title usually follows later, when the seller gets his money and signs the release on the title. If a bank is holding the title, the original owner has to pay off the loan in order to get the title back from the bank.

If the dealer has sufficient working capital he can ensure that the transaction with the bank happens before the sale and he therefore can have title in hand when he sells the car. A perfect world scenario. What usually happens more often than not with consigned cars is that the dealer has to firm up the deal on the buyer's side before he begins the process to get the title.

Getting the title from the bank may sometimes (especially with high value cars) be linked to other obligations of the seller and the mere repayment of the car loan may not be enough to immediately get the title back from the bank.

I have known Andy for a long time and I have purchased two cars from him. Similar cars actually - a 308 and a 308 on steroids (F40). Huge price differences and in the case of the F40 the title took a few weeks. But the important thing is that I had the car and a clear trail of the transaction. The best safeguard I had in dealing with Andy is that he has been around a very long time, has a good thriving business and reputation, and that he had a lot more to lose than what he would gain by stiffing the seller.

I understand your anxiety, but you're buying a used car with a high value. If you don't have confidence in the process, then follow everyone's advice in this thread and demand to see the title before you hand over your money. You'll be safer financially but you will also have to pass on good cars that are too expensive for the dealer to bridge the cash required.

My advice is to know who you are dealing with and to make your decisions based on the reputation of the dealer.

I have a list of people I wouldn't deal with even if they had the title delivered to me pending my payment and then there are those guys I trust who I will park money with while they look for a car that I want.
Click to expand...

Alex - I think you are generally correct in all your points - know who you deal with, it does take time in many cases...

But if you look at what was described in the first post (assuming it is correct on the timeline) - we are talking about from July - until January (approximately). We have all waited on titles - My new lambo title took nearly 30 days to get to my house and this was a new car not used or consigned (I was not worried, as you mentioned - I know the dealer and I knew I would get the title - didn't even think twice about it).

In this case - again assuming the timeline as described - 6 Months is way way way way to long by any strectch of circumstances that one could even imagine happening. If there was a potential issue - if I was the dealer - I would have been so over communicating what the issue was to the buyer - to ensure peace of mind if nothing else.

If this situation was me and I was not being communicated to (In a clear and honest manner) - and not knowing the dealer. I would have had a few lawyers show up on his doorstep after about 3 months elapsed time of not getting the title. After 6 months - I would have been in court.

Not to mention - you can't drive it - because you can't register it, Your mind starts to think worst case scenarios (even if things aren't as bad as you think they are)...

I guess my point is - regardless of this particular dealer - the timeline of 6 months to get a title is highly unusual for any normal circumstance - and typically only when there is a problem (the kind you don't want to have) would it take this long.

Conversations

Alerts

My nightmare buying experience with BHCC/Andy Cohen

teterman2004 Formula Junior

410SA F1 Veteran

richard_wallace Formula 3

Share This Page