My Theory

I think some were indeed bought by speculators and are now in good hands and as you say , they are being used.

I dont know if the numbers of Enzo totalled is extraordinary or are we just focusing on them because they are Enzos and in fact we have, proportion wise, the same number of modenas , 911 , vettes being crashed ?

My opinion is that the Enzo being very usable at town speed might lure its driver into a certain confidence that will vanish once higherspeed are attained..

 

I think it's "Enzos falling into the hands of drivers now." In order to qualify to buy an Enzo new at MSRP chances are you are going to have many other cars in the garage, including many other Ferraris. By nature, the Enzo is going to sit when you're out in, say, the F50, or the 275, or whatever. For people buying them on the open market, first of all they are people who REALLY want the car, as they were willing to pay a lot more than MSRP for it, and thus they are more likely to drive it than to just let it sit there are depreciate, and second they may have fewer Ferraris in their driveway to choose from otherwise they may have qualified to buy it new in the first place.

 

Same as CGT's, too much car for most!

 

IMHO several issues. No car can contravene the laws of physics. Not everyone realizes this. The Enzo is a lot of car and things get fast quickly.
They also get fast smoothly and they stick so hard, until they don't, that when they get loose they get loose FAST and if you don't react FAST you'll loose it.

I would NOT drive any car at speed without a fire system. Before I tried to drive an Enzo FAST I'd take it to a large parking lot and loose it to see how it feels and how little warning there is before it does. I'd loose it several times until I learned how to catch it. I also would not drive any of these cars FAST on the street. I would think twice before putting it into RACE Mode.

I think when people first get these cars they are nervous so they drive calmly. As time goes by they feel more comfortable, relax and without realizing, because they are so smooth, just how fast they're going get going TOO FAST.

 

It isn't extraordinary, for example nearly 150 of 1250 Porsche Carrera GT are totalled.

 

150? Are you sure about that? Thats a huge number of cars...

 

are you sure that so many CGT are destroyed ???

where do you have the info ?

 

I think you are incorrect about that #. Where did you get your info?

 

The problem is, people get out of slower cars or even normal cars (say someone won the loterry), and get into an Enzo. They have no experience of the car, and certainly no (or not enough) experience of the power.

With any car, you have to get to know it and use it a fair bit before you can really 'push it' or 'open it up'. Its all about experience and first hand knowledge in my opinion. And with any super car, you have to make a judgement before you put your foot down, or overtake a car. As your dealing with something that is faster and different altogether.

Every car is different, which is why it can take time. For example the Carrera GT, from what i have heard and seen, the back end of the car is pretty lively.

When you get to know and car, and understand how it performs and everything, thats when you can have the most fun with it (unless your being instructed around a circuit for a day, but thats different) in my opinion.

I have actually heard stories of extremely rich people asking for instructions as to how to drive supercars (i.e. Oil or Software millionaires).

More often you see manufacturers offering courses as to driving their models, for example, Koenigsegg, BMW, Porsche etc.. which just backs up my point a little, when it comes to understanding the car and experience.

Good theory Eric, take care, and enjoy your Enzo!

 

I understand your concern, I would probably feel the same way as you. Have you considered as Jim said, finding a biig parking lot, or take it to the track with a lot of space, and try and let it loose a little. Both driving it quick and trying to loose it at a good speed also, until you master it? I'm pretty sure it would help you a lot Eric. If I were in your shoes, or feet, as you don't were shoes when you drive , I would do exactly that. I wouldn't feel comfortable driving it, if I knew I couldn't handle it proberly. Not saying you can't, but I would do it

 

This is my guess. People are getting comfortable with them and pushing them more.

 

And why would you do anything else - Enjoy it, that's what it's build for.

 

Eric, the next time you are in Europe, go to Maranello and ask Ferrari for instruction at Fiorano.

You could arrange it beforehand and make it clear you own an Enzo.

Perhaps you could do a trackday at Fiorano with Manuma?

Alternatively (or in addition to) you could go somewhere like the Skip Barber Racing School.

Exactly like a racing car.

 

I cannot comment much of anything about the Enzo from personal experience, but the CGT has a wild tendancy about its torque curve that gives you a false sence of security when all of the sudden, all hell breaks loose at 6,000 rpm, and it could find you in a heap of trouble very quickly, if exiting a turn, or even giving yourself an easy launch then hard run once locked in in 1rst gear... the tires WILL break loose under heavy through open throttle positions.... and if cool enough, will happen in 2nd gear as well.

all talk on the CGT's clutch being an issue is simply heresay... the clutch is fine, its the immediate responce, and drop off of the engine that first-time drivers don't know how to deal with IMHO.

600 hp is a lot to deal with, where it doesn't feel so in the Ford GT... of course, Ford's car is conciderably heavier.

I can fully see people being easy on the street, even if driving in a spirited mannor... I don't doubt some of this can apply to the Enzo as well.

 

I commented on this in the other thread in main. Compaire the number of recent crashes involving an F40,288, F50. You just don't hear about it. In fact I would venture that not too many f50's have been cracked up, and if they have they were either fixed or totaly written off. I have come to think that there is a design flaw in the Enzo, a major one.

 

to me, the big flaw in logic is that the F50 while very fast 'only' has 513 hp, and 380 some tq. It has very wide tires that make up the extra rolling resistance, and such.

an extra 100 tq. and 150 hp is truly "that much faster" and that much harder to handle... particularly when youa re dealing with an automatic clutch, and sequential gearbox doing the thinking for your left foot.. it may in some ways be detatched from the driving experience?

if anything, arguments could be made that the Enzo has an issue with allowing to increase its angle of attack too easily over a crest, or bump at high speed... I don't know if this would be due to more firm suspension settings, the higher dependance on underbody ground effect, while having a group-c-like additional air volume intake on the front protruding too far in front of the front tires...

anyway... just my 2 pence

 

Official info from Porsche for their paint shop (outsourcing... ):

134 in North America
3 in Australia
2 in Germany
1 in England
1 in Netherlands

This numbers were current in January 2006.

 

thats what i'm going to do, next time i go to Europe in about a week-i just postponed it, i was going to leave today, will be for a second back sugery, but next summer I'm going to do that. thank you for the idea

 

Eric,

Bondurant is over in Phoenix......a very nice track....

Mr. G has hit on a VERY important point, IMO...these cars FAR exceed, technically and speedwise, the "street" environment...that's why Eric is very wise in his 'cruiser mode'....

Concrete transitions (vertically), paved curve turning radiuses, basically ALL facets of roadway design are based upon the predicted speeds and engineered towards that...it's TOTALLY different from the racetrack environment where the top speeds above 200MPH are normally reached.

So it's a case of the poor car "running out of room"...

I also think the common thing in several of these crashes (not this week's) is the front "catching air".....Dahr, Richard Loose and possibly the Malibu "no skid marks" car.

But think about this...those big Mercedes GTPs that launched at Lemans...no where else was that possible.....it took a 'perfect storm' of race speeds, public roads, and turbulence from cars in front......but then, they were gone, into the trees!

 

I would suspect that a large percentage of those CGT crashes occured with the four-channel anti-spin control (ASC) turned off.

Anything analogous to that on the Enzo?

 

paint shop..How much of those are just fender bender ?

 

The whole of a Carrera GT is "pretty lively"! I have 610bhp in my Ford GT and it's a great car - possibly as fast as an Enzo and definately faster than an SLR (except maybe the SLR 722). And it behaves well.

However, mentally I've moved moved away from super-fast road cars and prefer to drive fast track cars instead - it's a safer place to push things and no-one else is going to get hurt.