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Near $50K for a 308?

Discussion in '308/328' started by Bullfighter, Mar 29, 2005.

  1. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 26, 2005
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    Jon
    Long post here - turn back now or grab a coffee or beer before starting:

    For the past couple of months I've been on the hunt for an exceptional late (84-85) 308GTSi or early (86-87) 328GTS. Given my weekend-toy car budget, these are the F-cars I can afford to buy in well-sorted, top condition. I already have a daily driver - just want something to show, take on weekend drives, and detail.

    From what I've seen, $40K buys a good but not perfect moderate to low-mileage late 308 from a dealer; $50K-55K buys a moderate to low-mileage 328. (I'm excluding the 88 1/2 and 89 cars, which seem to sell a bit higher.)

    However, for the third time I've been offered an exceptional '85 308GTSi qv well into the $40K range ($49,500 asking price.) It's a documented, one-owner, black/tan car with 18,200 miles on it. Gorgeous.

    Looking around, in moderate shock, I also noticed Ferrari of New England has (had?) a mint yellow '83 listed at $49,900 - listed on the marketplace section of ferrariusa.com, so it's probably an old listing now. Marshall Goldman of Cleveland had a black/red '85 with 17,500 miles -- time capsule car -- at $45K, but due for the major service.

    I asked the dealer (very reputable Ferrari guy) whether $49,500 was a bit on the high side for a 308, and he replied that he had sold another 308 (12,000 mile, two-owner car) to the CEO of Coca-Cola for $55K (!!)

    Given that anyone can ask any price for anything ... has anyone on this board bought a mint condition 308 in the $40K+ range? There are a lot of very nice 328's available at the $50K mark, and some GREAT ones between $55K-$60K. If top tier 328's are at $60K+, are top tier 308's pushing $50K?

    I'm not bargain hunting and will pay a reasonable premium for a great car. But, as a Ferrari newcomer, I don't want get taken. Thoughts? In Feb., I passed on the Marshall Goldman car, because at $45K plus major it was essentially a $49K car. I think I made the right call to pass. And $49,900 for a yellow/black '83 qv -- please -- didn't even consider that one.

    But -- my garage still has an empty space and the weather's turning nice. Help!

    Jon
     
  2. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
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  3. matteo

    matteo F1 World Champ

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    I paid $39.8 in July for an 83 qv. Excellent condition, all tools and records from F of BH. serviced with belts, two owner california car. 84 and 85 would be a little bit higher.
     
  4. Mike C

    Mike C F1 Veteran
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    Aug 3, 2002
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    I've seen that one. It is a certainly very good, but not a concours or "near showroom" car cosmetically without some work if that's what you're looking for. But it does seem to be mechanically outstanding and a good buy.
     
  5. Emartleb

    Emartleb Karting

    Dec 6, 2004
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    San Francisco, CA
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    Val Beltrame
    308 QVs and 328s are GOOD CARS (in addition to being good Ferraris) and their prices will continue to rise accordingly. $50-$60k respectively for excellent examples of each of these models is not, or soon won't be, out of line. Not that you have to spend that much to get a great car...

    I would, however, caution you on two items:

    1. I would avoid '83 QVs due to the hokie smog pump and, I think, smaller tires and wheels. (Did some even have those TRX tires??) Since 84s and 85s are essentially the same price and have other small improvements, I'd limit my search to those two years (unless a great '83 at a great price comes along). I wouldn't pay a premium for an '85 just because it's the last year. 84s are almost identical. I'd also prefer a 328 to a similarly priced 308QV.
    Finally, many people consider the holy grail of 308s to be an early Euro, single distributor, fiberglass, dry-sump car. In great condition, that might be a 308 worth $50k+...

    2. Several of the really high priced cars are that way because of low mileage. Since you don't plan to use as a daily driver and these two models are probably the most reliable, easiest to maintain and have the best longevity of the 3X8, 355, 360 series, I certainly wouldn't pass on a car in great condition, properly maintained, just because it has 40k+ miles on it. The "higher" mileage cars can be had for as much as 25% less. That's real money for tax and license, insurance, maintenance, vacation, beer, early retirement, etc.

    Pick the best car you can afford and forget the odometer.
     
  6. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    What was the mileage on the car when you bought? $40K for a premium, California '83 308 sounds reasonable.

    J
     
  7. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Yes, I've heard from a couple of F mechanics that an '84-'85 (all other things being equal) is the best of the 308 series. Worth a premium.

    Mileage? There's a 47,000-mile '87 328 in LA (Was an Andy Cohen car, now with another broker - it's been on the market a while) that really IS showcar perfect, red/tan, too nice to breathe near. Also priced at $60K. No takers. At 20,000 miles, that car would have been sold long ago, IMO.

    I'd guess that low mileage cars are going to fare the best when it comes to resale value/appreciation, and that's reflected in the price. So, maybe the 25% savings up front won't really hold over time (?)

    But your point about beer money is a good one.

    J
     
  8. Sean F.

    Sean F. F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2003
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  9. Emartleb

    Emartleb Karting

    Dec 6, 2004
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    Val Beltrame
    I guess it depends on what you want to use the car for. It's hard to fathom the wisdom of paying a premium for a low-mileage, too-nice-to-breathe-near car if you're actually going to drive the thing anyway. I think they're just too much fun to have and drive to hide them in the garage and never use them. I just don't think 3X8 fall into the show car category.
     
  10. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I second this entire post.
     
  11. ralfabco

    ralfabco F1 World Champ
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    I would not mind a superb 308 glass w/low miles.
     
  12. davel

    davel Guest

    A good 308 Qv is not worth 55-60 at all. Steve Algrhim just sold a beauty with 46k miles and recent service for 37,500. The owner is a member here. Thats what they are worth. No miles fully documented at 49k? Yep maybe until he puts 20k miles on it then its worth 33-37.
    At 50k start looking for a 328 89 year or something even newer. Fcars with high miles are a tough sell. If you are buying a car to get your money back, you wont be driving it much and you wont enjoy it when you do. A 69k miles QV isnt worth 37k unless the owner simply doesnt want to sell and if thats the case why is it advertised anyway. Go to exoticautobrokers.com and see a nice 87 328 black on tan with 60k miles and recent service, was 42k$ now its 39k$. Thats a good buy and add a few more miles on it and you wont lose much.
    Pete at Foza Motorsports has a 12k mi 83 fully documented and serviced for 42k$ Been there awhile also has an 85 with 23 k miles and wants 39k$ Lots to choose from and dont bother with an Official Fcar dealer if you can. Find a good privately owned car if possible.
     
  13. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
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    ...and I wouldn't mind a Muira that used to be lime green !
     
  14. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Again, more good advice here.
     
  15. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I agree, $55K for a mint, 12,000 mile QV is a stretch. Unless you're CEO of Coca-Cola and don't care about that kind of money.

    Is a 18,000-mile '85 QV worth more than $45K? Remember, that car won't have those 20,000 more miles put on it during 2005, so saying it's worth $37K with 38,000 miles doesn't really apply, because we don't know what an '85 308 qv with 38,000 miles is going to be worth in 2018 or whenever it hits that mileage number.

    We do know that a 60,000 mile car bought today, and driven a couple of thousand miles a year, might be nearing the end of its sale-able life (without rebuild and restoration) by then.

    Pete's '83 sold, by the way. I wasn't really looking for an '83, but at $42K it was certainly tempting. Someone got a very nice car.

    Maybe too much financial calisthenics here. I just wanted to know whether I'd be setting some sort of new record for idiocy if I stretched past $45K for a top tier '85 qv.

    J
     
  16. 308GTS

    308GTS Formula 3

    Dec 27, 2001
    2,220
    TN
    83 QVs are fine. They do come with 16 inch wheels same as 84s and 85s. 85s do have some slight differences that IMHO make them better than an 84. 83s have dual exhausts, no 02 sensor, etc.
    Don't rule out a nice 83.
     
  17. ralfabco

    ralfabco F1 World Champ
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    Cute !!

    Thanks
     
  18. davel

    davel Guest

    Nice. I forgot the 83 actually has a true dual exhaust.Does it sound better stock vs 84 or 85? I just dont recall hearing since from a few feet away its tough to tell the 83 from an 85.
     
  19. dwhite

    dwhite F1 Rookie

    I have an 83 and it sounds wonderful w/ a Tubi. 60K and I'll bet it's in as good or better condition than just about any other original car out there. 3 maticulous owners. Condition, condition, condition, is all that matters, don't get hung up on the mileage unless it's too little ;).
     
  20. Gatorrari

    Gatorrari F1 World Champ
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    I believe I read somewhere that the '84s were the first 308s to use galvanized steel. If that's the case, go over the body on any '83 very carefully to look for incipient rust.
     
  21. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Two Time F1 World Champ
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    You are EXACTLY right.
     
  22. spike308

    spike308 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 8, 2003
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    Mike Z
    I dunno...
    I bought mine to drive. I do not give a Sh*t about the miles.
    I wonder about those who constantly worry about the miles... do they REALLY enjoy the car the way it was intended to be enjoyed?
    It is not an investment, so drive it! But remember, it is addictive, and your face will hurt from smiling so much!
     
  23. ferraripete

    ferraripete F1 World Champ

    guys, these prices are killing me.

    i recently sold my 83 gtb qv 6k orig. miles rosso metallica/black euro spoiler, ansa sport exhaust, two sets of wheels metric and dealer optioned bbs's
    all smog in place and working...major done 2 years ago. i bought the car w/ 3k miles on it from eddie karam.

    it was as new cavalino platnum quality! the guy that bought my car lives in the bay area and had looked no less than 10 cars before shaking my hand as soon as the car cover came off!!

    $36.5k
     
  24. ferraripete

    ferraripete F1 World Champ

    great point...i always buy a car w/ the intentions of driving...alas...i never do. i end up w/ a car that is too nice and i always think that i don't want to be the guy that ruins this great machine! so i never drive it!!
     
  25. ralfabco

    ralfabco F1 World Champ
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    Exactly

    The way to "avoid" this; is to be selfish and purchase several exotics. - That will cure the problem.




    The way to do this:

    buy a mobile home

    obtain an 18 year old guuurl friend, who likes to walk around the kitchen barefoot. She can microwave your TV dinner, when you choose not to go out to the Golden Corral.

    Purchase a large 54" big screen TV w/remote. (gives her something to do).
     

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