News

New California t first Ferrari all gone wrong any advice

Discussion in 'California/Portofino' started by Dbs516, Aug 13, 2019 at 12:43 PM.

  1. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
    hi all I’ve purchased a 2015 california t first Ferrari and within its first month has been in for a few issues that have been sorted however I reported a rumbling on idle and
    Just been told it needs a new flywheel ( main dealer I got it from ) 14 k miles
    Whilst this has dampened the experience I waited more than a few decades does any of you know if this is an issue I can’t see any threads With this fault
    Thanks for any advice
     
  2. Federal man

    Federal man Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 3, 2018
    63
    Seattle area
    Full Name:
    Mark Higinbotham
    Sorry to hear this and I don't recall any other threads about this issue. Did you happen to buy your car from an authorized dealer and get the 2 Yr New Power Warranty?
     
    Il Co-Pilota likes this.
  3. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
    Hi pal
    Yes it came with a 2
    Year warranty they have said the flywheel isn’t covered by that ??? But are covering it as I’ve only had it a few weeks and done a few hundred miles half that to and from dealer
    Also had the battery issues that’s sorted
    The dealer is doing all it can I give them that just tainted a brand I’ve wanted since I was a kid
    Can’t find nothing online if it’s an issue or why it would fail
    Plus now waiting for parts from factory
     
  4. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ

    Aug 22, 2002
    10,075
    flywheel most likely specific to how that car was driven....
     
    boobernackle likes this.
  5. Federal man

    Federal man Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 3, 2018
    63
    Seattle area
    Full Name:
    Mark Higinbotham
    That is concerning to hear it is not covered under the New Power Warranty but good that your dealer is stepping up to cover it anyway. I will have to go back and read my fine print now that my curiosity is piqued. Just seems quite unusual to me to hear a flywheel has failed. Best of luck!
     
    RamsHmb likes this.
  6. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
     
  7. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 24, 2011
    3,252
    East
    For example? Driving a Ferrari balls out? I dont see many people that buy California's doing burnouts or things that would kill a flywheel so quickly.
     
  8. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ

    Aug 22, 2002
    10,075
    who knows - some rich guys 18 yr old cld have trounced it a few times. good news is a flywheel is replaceable.
     
  9. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
    Yes. A bIt worrying how it was driven before
    I’ve just purchased it and drove it like miss daisy
    It had a small rumble on idle not constant but just mentioned it as it went in thought it was normal ( first Ferrari coming from a 991 turbo ) and everything rattles on those

    Other jobs sorted I hope
    Dealer has stepped up not sure he couldn’t tbh
     
  10. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Owner Miami 2018

    Dec 1, 2000
    48,996
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    more likely stop and go traffic not driving a Ferrari like it is supposed to. don't the F1 clutches do better with hard crisp driving than moderating the throttle stop and go, especially up hills? I know that was the case with my Maserati F1.
     
  11. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ

    Aug 22, 2002
    10,075
    i wldnt worry about it - whenever you buy a pre owned car it takes a cple tries to get it right. you will love it once its sorted.
     
  12. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
    I love it already but I just can’t drive it ha ha

    They have my money and my car

    Wish my customers were like me
     
    Federal man likes this.
  13. Raydog9379

    Raydog9379 Karting

    Jan 10, 2018
    118
    Full Name:
    Ray
    Did you do a PPI beforehand? Or just figured all is good since it was from a dealer (maybe that's why the dealer is covering it)?
     
    Federal man likes this.
  14. vjd3

    vjd3 Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 3, 2005
    1,437
    Massachusetts
    Full Name:
    Vic
    It's a bit difficult to see how the flywheel would not be covered, if you have the factory New Power warranty, as it covers the engine and gearbox, aside from oil seals and leaks:

    • Engine: crankcase and all internal components thereof, cylinder heads and valvetrain, oil radiators, head gaskets, oil sump and oil pump, variable valve timing adjusters, solenoid valve (oil seals and oil leaks not covered), ionising ECU. 


    • Ignition/Injection systems: Oxygen sensors, secondary air system (secondary air system pump and valves only). 


    • Mechanical gearbox/F1 gearbox: gearbox casing and differential housings, including all internal components. 


    • F1 Power Unit: electric pump, valves; actuator, ECU, selected and engaged gear sensor (oil seals and oil leaks not covered). 


    • DCT gearbox: gearbox and all internal components, ECU (oil seals and oil leaks not covered). 


    • Power Transmission Unit: ECU; clutch (rubber boots excluded). PTU: all internal components (oil seals and oil leaks not covered). 


    • Suspension and steering: complete steering box, suspension arm joints, power steering pump (excluding drive belt), toe-in tie-rods, ECU for controls on steering wheel (oil seals and oil leaks not covered). 


    • Cooling system: water pumps, fans (leaks not covered). 


    • Air conditioning/heating: AC system control devices, AC 
compressor and climate control ECU. 


    • Electrical system: alternator, starter motor, ignition coil, engine ECU, transmission ECU, crankshaft sensor, camshaft sensor, power window motors. 


    • Fuel and induction system: injectors, throttle bodies, air flow sensor, intake manifold, pressure regulator, temperature sensors, fuel pipes, fuel pumps. 


    • Brake system: hydraulic brake pump, brake pressure regulator and servo. 


    • Bodywork: RHT roof function (wear, bodywork and paint defects, seals and water infiltration not covered).

    • Labor relative to the removal/installation and replacement of the aforementioned components.
     
    Chizz and Gh21631 like this.
  15. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
    Just been reading the warranty new power

    Unless they say it’s a clutch part
    The flywheel normally has the clutch but on this one it’s In The g box correct at the back

    I’d have thought it was warranty but as dealer is replacing I don’t care

    I bought from a Ferrari dealer for the peace of mind at times like this

    The rumble was very weak but they say as they had it in they investigated further

    Hence where I am now

    Thanks for all your replies by the way
     
    Chizz likes this.
  16. Fireman1291

    Fireman1291 Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 30, 2017
    463
    Tampa, FL
    Full Name:
    Adam
    Sorry about the flywheel issue. Seems strange.

    I know that my Cali30 started running great after a few weeks of driving it. I bought it 12/31/18 with 4600 miles on it, and it being a 2014 means the previous owner didn't drive it enough. Once I knocked the cobwebs off man did she smooth out! It was noticeable. Yours might be the same case...
     
  17. boobernackle

    boobernackle Formula Junior

    May 28, 2016
    819
    #17 boobernackle, Aug 13, 2019 at 10:52 PM
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2019 at 10:59 PM
    Flywheel is a consumable, like brake pads, etc. On a 2015 MY car with only 14 km, that's a bit short, but keep in mind this was the first year run for a Cali T, so it could've been an early part bug. Or just driven hard for an extended period.

    Dealer covered it anyway as a kind gesture and to keep the customer happy given the recent sale. I would've done the same. If it were a new car, one call to the dealer's regional manufacturer rep would've been a reimbursement.

    This says a lot about your dealer, but it also says a lot about you and that you're easy to work with. Your ease is being reciprocated.
     
  18. Carnut

    Carnut F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 3, 2003
    3,408
    Gladwyne PA
    Full Name:
    Morrie
    I also have a 15 T, and mine sat a long time before I got it about a year ago, I think it had maybe 1500 miles on it. Over the years I have blown up transmissions, and clutches often when building out a car (my 997 with 18K is on number 4 of each), but usually it is manual cars with way more power than the factory had planned. I am sure I could do damage to the T if I tried, but it would likely require some purposeful actions on my part. Unfortunately Ferrari dealers do not have central service(some dealers to hare info) info center (like Porsche BMW MB), so unless the car was serviced there you will probably not be able to see the cars service records, and if it were me I'd probably want to see them. Good luck and I'm glad they are fixing the car for you.
     
  19. treue

    treue Formula Junior

    Jan 22, 2004
    267
    Oklahoma
    Full Name:
    Tom Treue
    The reason the dealer balked at replacing the flywheel is that he may have seen clear abuse which is rarely covered by any warranty. Then he relented because Ferrari has an image to protect. Also, it seems a little unethical if not illegal to sell a car that had an easily detectable major issue (and they DID detect it, just later rather than sooner). I would expect (rightly or wrongly) that I would get a better quality used (I hate the marketing term “pre-owned”.) car from an authorized Ferrari dealer than a used car lot or an individual unless I had reason to believe otherwise.


    I have seen a flywheel that was clearly abused. The contact surface was very blue and had 6 or 8 cracks running radially across the contact surface. The cracks were quite wide: 0.020 to 0.030 inches. I didn’t inspect it for warpage, but I don’t know how it could not have been warped. In this situation, the flywheel had to be replaced because the cracks could have caused the flywheel to disintegrate with catastrophic results. This was a 3-pedal manual, not an F1, but, I suppose an F1 can be abused as badly as a standard standard.


    The experts recommend that, given two or more alternatives, the used car with the fewest previous owners is the better choice for purchase. Many new (to them, if not brand new) Ferrari owners want to see “what it’s got” so they “get on it” (high revs and speed). More owners – more abuse. A lot of people have more money than sense.



    Tom
     
  20. vjd3

    vjd3 Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 3, 2005
    1,437
    Massachusetts
    Full Name:
    Vic
    However, in theory, you cannot abuse a DCT clutch the way you can a manual clutch — you can’t slip it, you can’t ride it, you can’t overrev or miss a shift. It’s supposed to last the “lifetime” of the car and the computer handles the shifting. Aside from using launch control repeatedly or a lot of hours on the track, how does one wear out the flywheel in 14k miles? And wouldn’t the CPO inspection for the New Power warranty include a look at the computer for launch control use, rev ranges and clutch wear?
     
    Fireman1291 and Chizz like this.
  21. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
    Good point you would need a long road and no police to thrash a Ferrari

    Can the dealer check how many times the launch control has been used as
    I’ve never used it ( in the 200 miles I had it) and never used my Porsche one in 12 months of its ownership

    I would have thought they could check this maybe that’s why they replacing it
    They have said it’s a component failure ??

    The car was picked up with a leaky headlamp washer it emptied the washer tank on the first night in my garage
    This is just bad luck I assume
    Seems to follow me with cars


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  22. vjd3

    vjd3 Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jun 3, 2005
    1,437
    Massachusetts
    Full Name:
    Vic
    I can't say for Ferraris, but I know for (recent) 911s they can check the DME computer for the times (and duration) that the car has experienced "ignitions" past redline -- these occur mainly by bouncing the car off the rev limiter in manual mode, and they can tell when they happened during the cars' lifetime -- and I suspect they keep track of launches, too. There is a famous Road and Track test a few years back where they launched a new 991 twin turbo (PDK dual clutch) at an airstrip more than 50 times, one after the other, and the car did not so much as break a sweat, but I would never try that with a Ferrari -- at least, not with one that I own ;).
     
  23. 4th_gear

    4th_gear F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 18, 2013
    4,229
    Full Name:
    Michael
    Actual flywheel wear is caused when the clutch plate rides the flywheel, either because the driver is riding the clutch or if the clutch plate is not disengaging properly. This is what happens in a conventional stick shift manual transmission, which is DRY.

    However, the DCT in the Cali uses WET clutches so the high tech lubricants should prevent heat damage to the clutch and the flywheel. Usually in a manual transmission coupling, it's the clutch plate that wears due to high mileage or poor driver skills/habits and if left unrepaired, the worn clutch plate will then damage the flywheel, by friction and overheating. But as I said the DCT uses wet clutches so it's highly unlikely to experience clutch damage. A DCT heat sensor would have thrown a fault code before overheating happened.

    I suspect it is the flywheel pilot bearing that is damaged, either due to a defect or improper assembly, as when the DCT is serviced and improperly reassembled in the field. Did you notice problems from the transmission when you drove the car? What were the symptoms? Did you get fault codes? Is the DCT original, never repaired?
     
  24. Dbs516

    Dbs516 Rookie

    Tuesday
    8
    Full Name:
    Dean
    No nothing at all
    No issues apart from knocking at idle and that was weak
    As it was a new to me car I was unsure if it was normal
     
  25. technom3

    technom3 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 29, 2007
    3,371
    Phoenix AZ
    Full Name:
    Justin
    the transmission wont allow for over revs... ... ... this over rev thing is a porsche thing.
     

Share This Page