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New F40 owner

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari/F80' started by prototypefan, May 11, 2006.

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  1. prototypefan

    prototypefan Formula Junior

    Dec 23, 2005
    396
    ab, canada
    #1 prototypefan, May 11, 2006
    Well I just got an F40. 1990 US spec. 4700 miles with great service history.

    The car is a real treat to drive. I'm used to my Testarossa, but this car is about as subtle as a sledge hammer, those turbos are fun, real fun.

    I've only put 150 miles on and could use some advice.

    The car showed the "5-8 slow down" warning light for a second or two during spirited driving, it did not stay or ever come back on. About 25 miles later while trying to do a fun run on a straight section of road, it ran poorly on accelleration and would not spool up, during this attempt the boost warning light came on.

    It idles fine and drives fine at low speed, however it will not rev up at all now. Any advice or answers to the following would be appreciated:

    1. I made a couple of calls and was advised to remove the battery cables for a 24 hour period and then start the car and let it idle for 45 minutes, this would hopefully reset the computer. A potentional source for the slow down light may be the catalytic convertor.

    2. I'm going to check the turbos but was advised that the original turbos had bushings and there is an upgraded bearing turbo that adds considerable power and reliability.

    3. I'm considering a different exhaust system but am really impressed how civilized the car sounds with the stock exhaust. A different system must uncork alot of power, but I'd hate to have the car really loud.


    4. I'm 6'3" and I need to get more room on the lower right bolster on the seat. Has anyone got advice on a great seat source.


    Thanks
     
  2. Jimbo49

    Jimbo49 Formula 3

    Aug 5, 2004
    1,889
    Geelong, Australia
    Full Name:
    James
    #2 Jimbo49, May 11, 2006
    Congrats on the car, nice choice;)
    as for the problem, im sorry i cant help you, but there are quite a few F40 owners on this site who will be able to help and give you suggestions. Fchat has a wealth of knowledge and everyone seems really friendly..
     
  3. SIR CARLOS YEPEZ

    SIR CARLOS YEPEZ Guest

    Mar 17, 2006
    43
    Brentwood, Tn
    Full Name:
    Carlos Daniel Yepez
    #3 SIR CARLOS YEPEZ, May 11, 2006
    What a sensational feeling it must be to getting ahold of a F40. Congrats once again and sorry for the issues your having. I wouldn't mind seeing some pictures of the car! Carlos.
     
  4. FastLankan

    FastLankan Formula 3

    Sep 27, 2005
    1,465
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    FastLankan
    #4 FastLankan, May 11, 2006
    The F40 is the ultimate Ferrari......pure car......congrats!!!!
     
  5. rush109

    rush109 F1 Veteran

    May 26, 2005
    8,103
    Montreal, Quebec
    Full Name:
    Joshua McRae
    #5 rush109, May 11, 2006
    F40 WOW, your the man, GREAT CHOICE, lets see some pics of the beauty!!!!!!
     
  6. Tubi

    Tubi Formula Junior

    Jul 1, 2004
    577
    Athens
    Full Name:
    Hari
    #6 Tubi, May 12, 2006
    Your considering a diff exhaust but would hate to have it really loud?? ....Its an F40 it should be loud!

    Get a Tubi LM!!

     
  7. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    #7 Simon^2, May 12, 2006
    Was the tach functional during the low power period? The tach is run by the 5-8 cylinder bank. if the 5-8 cylinder back cam position sensor goes out, you lose input to the ECU, but you also lose the tach. (tach reads 0 rpm).

    tach function provides signif clues to diagnosing/excluding 5-8 cylinder bank probs...

    And congrats on your car!!!
     
  8. prototypefan

    prototypefan Formula Junior

    Dec 23, 2005
    396
    ab, canada
    #8 prototypefan, May 12, 2006
    Thanks for the positive comments on the car guys, sorry no pics but I'll tell you this, it's red all over and gorgeous.

    Simon, to the best of my knowledge the tach still worked. The battery is unhooked and I'll be putting it back on tomorrow and trying the restart solution. After it runs for the recommended 45 minutes I'll take it for a drive and say for sure that it worked or I still have the problem and whether or not that the tach works.

    Would the tach reset itself during a restart or would that non-operating tach condition remain?
     
  9. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    #9 Simon^2, May 12, 2006
    Since the problem seems to be intermittant, tach would likely come and go. likely failures include cam position sensor, ECU, and loose electrical connections.

    Fuel pump always a possibity, but very unlikely, as that wouldn't give you a single bank warning light.

    edit: if 5-8 ecu is bad, tach still works (run from cam position sensor), if cam sensor is bad the tach AND 5-8 bank down.
     
  10. Scuderia-San-Antonio

    Scuderia-San-Antonio Formula 3

    Feb 27, 2005
    1,567
    San Antonio
    Full Name:
    Wes
    #10 Scuderia-San-Antonio, May 12, 2006
    What gas are you running?

    Sounds like maybe you fouled the plugs. Try a different set.

    What is in there now?
     
  11. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    #11 Simon^2, May 12, 2006
    Good point, getting back on track...

    My comments regarding the tach were aimed at providing a diagnostic clue to the problem (if the tach was out), but not meant to imply other causes could be excluded.

    FYI, the onboard computer does not store error codes when the car is off. Error codes are extremely generic however!
     
  12. Christian.Fr

    Christian.Fr Two Time F1 World Champ

    Jun 9, 2005
    21,614
    Full Name:
    Christian.Fr
    #12 Christian.Fr, May 12, 2006
    it s great! you find a "Perle" in F40.
    incredible for find a F40 at this the mileage.
    hope to see some pics.
    Congrats!
     
  13. prototypefan

    prototypefan Formula Junior

    Dec 23, 2005
    396
    ab, canada
    #13 prototypefan, May 12, 2006
    I've just got off the phone with someone and while describing the problem, he finished my description. I forgot to give one last part and that is when you try to accellerate the turbo overboost light came on. The car now has just basic accelleration no turbo boost.

    The culprit as he believes is the 5-8 ECU, it is mounted near the shock tower and is about 1 X 3 inches the wires that go into it have black silicone and the new upgraded ones have green silicone. Does this make sense to you guys?

    I'm going to call and get some prices.
     
  14. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    #14 Simon^2, May 12, 2006
    not sure about the turbo boost light part....

    Be careful, about ordering parts until you are 100% sure that part is the culprit.

    Remember my example, a bad cam position sensor takes out the ecu... on the 5-8 bank the way to tell the difference is whether the tach functions. could also be loose conections...

    IMO, take a little time to be confident the ECU is bad before you replace it...
     
  15. Tenney

    Tenney F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2001
    4,287
    #15 Tenney, May 12, 2006
    Cracked/faulty overboost valve?
     
  16. allanb888

    allanb888 Karting
    BANNED

    Jan 29, 2004
    106
    Melbourne, Australia
    #16 allanb888, May 12, 2006
    I had a somewhat similar problem with my F40. The engine was reluctant to rev, and the overboost light came on. I quickly found that only one bank of spark plugs was firing, so it was only running on 4 cylinders. Every time I replaced those 4 spark plugs, after a short run the plugs were dead (malfunctioning) when tested out of the car. Also the waste gate controller could be heard continually clicking on and off.

    Any way an astute local Ferrari specialist traced the fault to a faulty manifold pressure sensor. The car has 3 sensors, one for each bank of cylinders and one for the overboost guage. I think the early cars only had 2 MAP sensors.

    Please let us know if your problem turns out the same, or what exactly is found.

    Would anyone know what can kill spark plugs in just a few kilometers of travel?
     
  17. Supercar Ace

    Supercar Ace Formula 3

    Aug 23, 2005
    1,810
    Sunny So Cal - LA
    #17 Supercar Ace, May 13, 2006
    Congrats on the new car! :) I'm sure the guys on the boards can help answer your questions.
     
  18. davehelms

    davehelms F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2004
    4,629
    Full Name:
    Dave Helms
    #18 davehelms, May 18, 2006
    Start by replacing the slow down ecu's. I have seen them cut out a bank with no slow down light showing. Make sure there is enough engine temp. If too cold it will shut down boost

    Just finishing the final details on Hyper-flows new cats that we are helping Troy with. These are a work of art and have adjustable flanges to aid in tail pipe centering. Good sound with Tubi mufflers but I am going to try the cats with Tubi LM straight pipes. I suspect this will be the end all answer to sound, power and legal. The F40's make a much broader torque band with the cats in place. NA cars are rated at more HP than Euro's with the difference being the Cats.

    Dave
     
  19. 996TTnoprob

    996TTnoprob Karting

    May 14, 2006
    61
    midwest
    #19 996TTnoprob, May 25, 2006
    Congrats on the car, nice choice
     
  20. riverflyer

    riverflyer F1 Rookie

    Nov 26, 2003
    3,583
    Mendocino, Ca
    Full Name:
    John
    #20 riverflyer, May 27, 2006
    AB, i am also 6'3" and in one of my cars(so very sadly not an f40!) I bolted the race seats to the floor elimating the slides all together and it made almost 3" of addtional headroom AND the view/drivers outlook improved significantly.
    Can you post some pics?
     
  21. Harmonyautosport

    Harmonyautosport Formula Junior

    Apr 28, 2006
    683
    New York
    #21 Harmonyautosport, May 27, 2006
    When I was looking to purchase a 360 I ran into the headroom problem. Installing a set of racing seats(sparco) and custom brakets should solve the problem. My solution was to just buy a 550 and call it a day lol. Good luck with the car, its a personal favorite of mine.
     
  22. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    #22 Simon^2, May 27, 2006
    Fred,

    did you solve your cylinder bank shut down issue? what did it turn out to be?

    Simon
     
  23. prototypefan

    prototypefan Formula Junior

    Dec 23, 2005
    396
    ab, canada
    #23 prototypefan, May 27, 2006
    Thanks for asking Simon and for all of the input so far guys. We are going to work on the car again tomorrow. I have a friend that is an instructor at our local technological institute helping me out. This is the diagnosis so far:

    1. All fuses are good on the panel

    2. Fuel pumps both work, they power up and make the higher pitch to lower pitch hhhhhhhmmmmmmm (this is when bypassed through the fuse panel)

    3. Fuel injector relays both work

    4. Adequate spark on 1-4 bank

    5. We unhooked the four wire connector from the 1-4 thermocouple ECU and tried to start the car, NO 1-4 bank although adequate spark exists, exhaust is still cool

    6. Attempted starting the car with everything hooked up again, NO 1-4 bank although adequate spark exists, exhaust is still cool

    7. The tachometer works in all situations

    After reading the owners manual this is what stuck out:

    1. When you turn on the ignition key the fuel pumps are supposed to turn on and cycle for 2 - 10 seconds depending on temperature, they do not

    2. When you turn on the ignition key the 1-4 and 5-8 slow down warning lamps are supposed to do a test circuit and the lamps will remain on for two seconds. The lamps do not come on

    We have not checked the fuel pressure or pulled out an injector to see if it was operational. Somehow we suspect an electrical or software gremlin as the pumps work when power is put to them through the fuse panel but not through the ECU which controls both fuel and spark.

    There is another comment in the owners manual along the lines of "If the slow down warning light comes on, you need to bring the car into a dealer to have the ECU reset" Is there a clearing or reset procedure for the ECU?

    Is there software available for a common diagnostic tool for the ECU behind the seat. The connector does not look like any that we have seen for anything common.

    A couple of items that we have been advised to check but have not yet are a "key services relay" on the fuse panel and there is a removable panel below the ECU behind the seats, we are going to check the connections on all of these.

    Hey I'm still a happy guy, I'll just be alot happier when she is back in proper running order. The closest local dealer is a 12 hour drive, that's what sucks.

    Thanks for the input gentlemen.
     
  24. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    #24 Simon^2, May 27, 2006
    Good luck tomorrow. Keep us informed.
     
  25. allanb888

    allanb888 Karting
    BANNED

    Jan 29, 2004
    106
    Melbourne, Australia
    #25 allanb888, May 29, 2006
    I posted earlier that I had a very similar problem with my F40. Tested many of the things that you have checked, and in the end it was a faulty manifold air pressure sensor. My car had 3 MAP mounted high just inside the engine cover that is removed behind the seats. Some early models have 2 only. Testing is a simple matter of swapping the wire plugs around between sensors, to see if a different bank of cylinders stop working, or the turbo boost guage stops. I'd be interested to know what you find eventually.
     
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