"I know a number of Ford employees that do nothing but work on the car, and were responsible for it's origin, design and engineering." Ouote of Official Ford Press release in their own words: The race car has undergone extensive design and testing within Ford and Multimatic, with CGRFS providing input into the development. This more than adequately confirms that the "race car" was not totally solely designed & developed by your " number of Ford employees" "it is just a brand badging exercise." Let me make it easy. If Ford constructs the car then it is a Ford however it is the fact that Mutimatic constructs the final product "the race car". Therefore putting a badge on it does not make "the Mutilmatic version race car" a Ford- thus brand badging is the appropriate description. You are grossly misinterpreting what I said for your own purposes. Never did I state or dispute it was not Ford's instigation and original idea to do this. The fact is that they did not do all the race development engineering themselves. Additionally they don't construct the race cars nor will do so for the road cars.
babci, You can say exactly the same for every single car made or on a race grid nowadays, and probably for all time. You do realise that manufacturers do not make everything, ie. aluminium, steel, lights, alternators, tyres, oil, petrol, etc. Instead of criticising Ford, we should be thanking them for spending their money on this cool car, instead of another boring family car IMO. Pete
Agree. Would we say that a Ferrari is not a Ferrari because the body was built by Pinninfarina or Scaglietti? Would we say that a Ferrari race car built by Michelotto isn't a Ferrari? Silliness. And congrats to the C7R.
" You do realise that manufacturers do not make everything, ie. aluminium, steel, lights, alternators, tyres, oil, petrol, etc." Pete, I am not talking about who makes the ancillary parts. I am talking about where and who constructs the total heart of the car, the chassis which carries all the rest of the ancillaries across the finish line. The chassis of the car is not a Ford produced product. "Instead of criticising Ford, we should be thanking them for spending their money on this cool car, instead of another boring family car IMO" Please refrain from attempting to put words in my mouth as I am not criticizing Ford just pointing out facts and expressing my opinion the same as everyone else on the thread. I applaud the fact that they are stepping up with their extensive check book and some of their resources to try to repeat a different version of their prior accomplishments. I am just not terribly enthused/inspired by the fact that they chose a subcontractor to build them rather than do it in house.
That's probably the dumbest idea in recent memory. Who knew that when you took your Ferrari in for service, it became something else because Ferrari wasn't the one who put it back together. I'm gonna use that info to talk down the price on one of those Joe Dealership 458 Italias...
I have a crazy newsflash for you: There's not a car on the planet that is designed and engineered 100% in house. Multimatic had parts on roughly two dozen cars in the field this weekend. "Oh but the heart." Alright man, do the math on what percentage of equipment signifies a factory effort and let us know. Also, while we're going on to "I never said that," I never said they solely designed and developed the car. Yawn. "Brand-badging" is meant as a pejorative to downplay the effort. Kudos Pratt & Miller on your win this weekend, and good work in brand badging exercise Chevrolet! Can't wait until Mubea Carbo Tech badge-branded McLarens start racing in GTE.
"Yawn. "Brand-badging" is meant as a pejorative to downplay the effort." Bigger Yawn. More misinterpreting tears of a factual correct statement. Ford does not build/manufacture the car. See post 280 to PSK for my opinions of the factory effort. "I never said they solely designed and developed the car." I apologize however you did state "I know a number of Ford employees that do nothing but work on the car, and were responsible for it's origin, design and engineering in response to my factual statement about the cars being Multimatic built/constructed/manufactured. Further you go on to state "The Ford guys would be really surprised to learn that in fact, no, they did not design and engineer the car." attempting to insinuate that I had said they did not. Your statements point out your position is it all depends on your personal interpretation of the words not the facts. My compliments and thanks as you are a great instructor of that technique.
you may not be fully aware of the history of the first ford gt win at le mans and the groups such as Holman & Moody and Shelby American and their involvement in the development of one of the greatest racing stories of all time?
That just plain silly. And.... Outside of ferrari isn't every F1 car built within couple hours drive of silverstone? Say it isn't so that hamilton's wasn't built in Germany? hell even in the Barnard days ferrari f1 hq was in the uk Anyhow design manager of the ford gt was my colleague , my old roommate And close friend.
+1000 more. Someone mention vipers earlier... The gt-r version as I recall was a French outfit that built and design the initial BPR-LM viper cars, Michelotto = 308 gr4, 348LM,f40LM the 333sp was done also developed there in conjunction with Dallara. And this Dallara character? Lancia stratos first 5 works cars, montecarlo turbo Gr5, gr4, fiat x19 gr5 racer...most of these cars were built in house with the exception of the welded frames which were fabricated by marchesi. Marchesi btw constructed the BMW m1 homologation frames ship them to ital design who styled the car and assembled them in Torino. Then they went to a Baur a coach house in Germany for fitting of the mechanical assembly before BMW sold them as race cars... I'm just havin a little fun I suppose
Before 1966 Ferrari had nearly a complete monopoly on LeMans wins for a decade. Ford was FIRST US team to defeat Euros & Ferrari juggernaut at their own game This was HUGE & Legendary. Viper &!Corvette also have important accomplishments but Henry was the First
Dun care where or who built it, or signs the cheques; as long as it kicks the clock's ass and steals it's lunch money.
Seems they were manufactured by Cosworth and historically carried both Fords and Cosworths name badging depending on application and are historically referred to as Ford Cosworths or Cosworth Fords. So in today's "Politically Correct" environment the new Ford race car with basic design by Ford then cooperatively race engineered and developed with Multimatic and others then manufactured by Multimatic and powered by Ford should or could be referred to and badged as a Ford Multimatic or Multimatic Ford to those who care to be unbiased, put all their personal position aside, be "Politically" and historically correct.
How do you know that Ford only did "basic design work"? I guess my Scud is a Pininfarina Alcoa Ferrari.
It's got nothing to do with where or who's its manufacturered. If you fund the project you get to call it anything you please. If ford chosed to hyphenate cosworth on the valve covers it was there choosing. They didn't put Yamaha on the sho valve covers in bold font but if u look closely u can see them on the castings. Wasn't the original gt40 designed and built by eric Broadley at Lola in the UK? Nobody seems to be complaining too much about that for the last 50 years It's perhaps a romantic marking choice... Would you want your Gt be called ford-multimatic? Maybe if Dan Akroyd was pitching it.
"I guess my Scud is a Pininfarina Alcoa Ferrari." Wow! What a incredibly perceptive, generous and correct statement.
" If you fund the project you get to call it anything you please." Thanks for another excellent definition of brand badging. I could not have said it better. "Nobody seems to be complaining too much about that for the last 50 years" I can't see where Jahn Jahn is complaining about who designed or built the original GT 40s or the new current version. IHMO he only expresses his opinion of what (one person or persons) (in Jahn Jahn's words)"should or COULD" consider calling the latest Multimatic version under very clearly defined conditions. "Would you want your Gt be called ford-multimatic?" Speaking strictly for myself only. If I could manage to get my hands on one I really wouldn't care what someone else called it or thought of me for having it. Unfortunately I can't determine what country you are from or live in (no insult meant or intended) but I come from and live in a free country where it's population have the right to their own individual opinion. Ownership or been seen driving one does or would not validate you or define what type of person you are other than being healthy enough to drive it and a fortunate enough soul to have earned enough to pay for it or otherwise somehow been lucky enough to score one.
Black is white ... some appear to just want to argue, no matter how obscure their point is (in my opinion). Keep going, the internet won't fill up Pete
So you're saying you have no idea how much work Ford vs Multimatic did here? Thanks for confirming yet again...
Sorry, I am confused as in your original post #292 your question appears to be addressed/directed to Jahn Jahn post #291 and not me. But to in attempt to clarify and enlighten: My post #294 refers only to your "I guess my Scud is a Pininfarina Alcoa Ferrari."statement. In addition in the odd case you are directing your question to me. I already answered you in my post #276. All I know are the facts I have seen in the published offical Ford press kit release etc. ("The race car has undergone extensive design and testing within Ford and Multimatic, with CGRFS providing input into the development") which is confirming that Mutimatic did or provided some design work and input as well as constructs, builds, assembles etc. the cars and that Ganassi and Felix Sebates who also provided development input to the project hopefully be will doing the race campaigning and winning.
