No power to left engine bank | FerrariChat

No power to left engine bank

Discussion in 'FF/Lusso' started by enzoenzo, Jun 8, 2024.

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  1. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Hi guys,
    I'm new to Ferrarichat but I have been a long time visitor.
    I have a 2012 FF with 29,000 miles and a 6 speed 456 GT with 66,000 miles.

    My FF has an annoying issue. I had a crank no start (with codes about no communication with left engine bank and ion ecu). I have a Ferrari warranty so it was taken to a Ferrari main dealer who repaired a wire (I think at the ecu connector to one of the ion ecus). Car returned and worked fine until I got hot in traffic and started to missfire). back to another ferrari dealer in London and they were advised by 'technical' to try swapping the main engine ecus left to right. Car fixed and working fine... until yesterday.

    Now I have another crank no start. The codes were
    P1677 lost comms with ion ecu bank 2
    P1560 System voltage (Cylinder bank 2) malfunction.

    I have a brand new battery and this did not help.
    I cleaned the connectors/pins on the connections for the 2 engine ecus and the 2 ion ecu
    I swapped the engine ecus left to right.
    Still crank no start

    Live data for the "Engine left" indicated system voltage of 0 volts, when the live data for "Engine right" shows system voltage of 12.7 volts.

    I checked the fuses in the passenger footwell and none are blown. I probed the power wire/pin for the left ion ecu and there is no voltage.
    There is no power at the fuseboard for F17 "Left bank engine control power supply" (nor to any of the 3 or 4 adjacent fuses at the top right hand corner) but there is power at fuse F16 "Right bank engine control power supply".

    I wonder if these fuses are powered by a relay, which might be faulty, or I could have a break to the wire that powers fuse F17 (and adjacent)

    Long first post I'm afraid!
     
  2. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
  3. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    #3 sid12345678910, Jun 9, 2024
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2024
  4. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Thank you for your reply sid12345678910!

    There is no power at the fuse board for the fuse for the 'Left Bank Engine Control Power Supply' (F17) 0v
    but there is 12v at the fuse 'Right Bank Engine Control Power Supply' (F16)

    I did probe the pins for the ion ecus and there are obvious power supply wires for the right and left ecus. Rhs has 12 v lhs has 0 c

    I thought that the power for these will come from the fuseboard, so I was interested to note the lack of power for the left bank power supply fuse.

    Do you think I should look behind the fuseboard for damage or will this power be controlled by a relay?

    All of the other fuses have power with ignition on except the ones on the top right of the fuseboard (see photo)

    I feel more optimistic now that I see no power to these fuses.
     
  5. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
  6. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    So first check the resistance from ecu pin 12v to fuze 12v, check resistance. Then check ground pin resistance to ground resistance. It could be sensing a overcurrent as soon as key on and shutting it down. Thus you seeing 0v. If you see high Z then you have narrowed down where the problem is.

    After that try switching ecu to either side to complely confrim its the wiring. And not the ecus.

    If all resistance checks out and 0v stays on the same side then you'll need to start ripping out that fuse box and looking for a split wire. If your seeing 0v on many fuses then it's likely the relay. Pull the relay and measure if thay relay is getting 12v or not. If it is then you can swap the relay from the good side to the bad side and vise versa if the issue carry then congrats you found your problem

    If it is the wiring tho your best bet is it buy a wiring diagram for the ff on ebay. It would be great for this fourm to share it with everyone if you do.
     
  7. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    I just had a look at the fuse box diagram, try swapping t09 and t10 relay. See if you get power to left side bank
     
  8. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Thank you so much for your continued support.
    I swapped those relays over, but still no power to left side bank.

    Interestingly, there is no power to F85 (headlight washes). F85 is the lowest of the 5 fuses without power (see photo above).
    Might this suggest a connection issue rather than a relay issue?

    I'm resisting taking out the fuse board at this stage until other options have been ruled out.
     
  9. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    Check fuse f03
     
  10. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Fuse f03 is not blown. I also cleaned the blddes and replaced but no change.
     
  11. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    Could you give me a list of all the fuses that have no power? do you have the Workshop manual for the FF?
     
  12. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
  13. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    pm me your email, i have the workshop manual its much more detailed of what the fuses do and lead to
     
  14. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    Check fuse F88 & F108, Pull them and see if 12V is coming from the power pin
     
  15. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
  16. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    You are a superstar
     
  17. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Reporting back...

    "Try pulling T09 and see if 12V are going to the pins."
    I removed T09 and still no power at ECU pins. There is power to the relay connections.

    "As far as i can tell there is an issue of 12V power coming into t09. Try pulling all the fuses that connect to T09 as well as it may be tripping overcurrent protection. Measure if there is 12V coming into the Relay pins
    Pull:
    F-11
    F17
    F22"

    There has always been power to the T09 relay. I tried removing the fuses 11,17 and 22 and there is still power to the relay T09
     
  18. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    If you have swapped T09 and T10 already then i am convinced that the wire leading out of T09 is either burnt up or corroded. if fuses 11,17 and 22 are all not blown then its something to do with T09 not switching on. you could purchase something like this relay switch that can bypass the relay, or you could getto rig a wire and see if that will allow power to the ecu but you will need to be very very careful.

    relay bypass kit
    https://a.co/d/2a1cbQ8
     
  19. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Update...

    I very carefully bridged the T09 relay which provided power to the fuses 11,17 and 22.
    The car will now start.
    But it's a bit lumpy, and there are just 2 fault codes (rather than the 10 before).
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  20. sid12345678910

    sid12345678910 Karting

    Nov 24, 2020
    50
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Sid V
    congrats on getting it started!

    You can ignore these codes they will clear with normal driving.

    Its lumpy because it hasn't started in a long time, I hadn't started my ff once for 4 months and it idled very rough but it cleared up after some very slow calm driving.


    Otherwise it seems you have narrowed down where the issue is, if it definitely isn't the relay (honestly at this point I would just replace both t09 and t10) then it's now the signa wire that tells t09 relay to click over. A wiring diagram would be extremely useful to at this point. I think unfortunately you need to pull the fuse box to see where that wire leads and see if it's burnt up. If you can't find the wire then there is a super getto way of getting your car up and running.

    NOT RECCOMEND
    You can run a wire from t10 relay signal wire into t09 signal wire. Thus when t10 powers on then t09 will power on. I highly don't reccomend doing this. But this will get your car up and running
    NOT RECCOMEND

    It could be as simple as a broken solder point on t09 signal lead and your golden but you won't know untill you pull the fuse box.
     
  21. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Yes, I was pleased to hear it running!

    I will now pull the fuseboard to check the joints on the reverse.

    We're currently struggling to work out how to remove the aluminium frame/cover for the fuseboard. There are 5 hex bolts visible but it seems fixed to the floor under the carpet in some way.
    PASSENGER SIDE FOOTREST STRUCTURE
    For Ferrari California, FF
    Part Number: 83479300
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  22. enzoenzo

    enzoenzo Rookie

    Jun 8, 2024
    14
    Full Name:
    Robert Batt
    Thank you. My frame is slightly different (possibly due to being RHD). I will persevere and report back.
     

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