No regular V12 coupe in production... First time ? What's next ?

At that moment, GTS, due to its rigid roof, will play the role of the coupe and convertible simultaneously.
Soon it will come 812 VS (and a limited Aperta version), and will remain in production alongside the GTS until the end of 2022 or beginning of 2023.
After that, I believe that we will see a repeat of the 1973 transition, when the front engined GTB/4 Daytona was succeeded by the rear engined 365 GT/4 BB.

 

The 812 was originally slated for a 5 year production cycle. Production of the 812SF only ended due to lack of demand that resulted from the SF90 reveal. Quickly afterward that reveal 812SF orders were cancelled and replaced with SF90 orders (Ferrari's self-proclaimed new top series car). This was a large mistake by Ferrari, the SF90 was not close to production (still none in customer hands) and its reveal should of been withheld until early 2021 where all production issues were well sorted.

Plus, Ferrari intentionally overproduced 812SF for EU/China markets due to emissions regulations including noise regulations were feared to interfere with desirability or even the ability to register (especially the case in some China markets). At the same time, the USA and other markets were under supplied. The idea was that the EU/China markets would be satisfied with the oversupply and then production will be increased for rest of world, but then the SF90 reveal terminated that idea.

So, because of the original 5 year plan (which I had confirmed in 2017 as being the plan at that time), the replacement car is not close. Plus numerous changes to EU regulations have occurred subsequent to 2017 and those are greatly complicating creation of the replacement. Comments such as "fighting for the V12" have been proclaimed by Ferrari's Engine Lead (Michael Leiters) have been published. What the next V12 can be has been greatly impacted by these changes not to mention revised chassis regulations that will be required for the replacement model that were only established in March 2019. For example, look at others in the V12 space, notably Lamborghini is stalled, perhaps waiting forever to replace the Aventador engine, while others are simply cancelling V12s (BMW, Mercedes, etc).

I suspect the next V12 will be much smaller block, larger V-angle and hybrid assisted in some fashion. And, I also suspect it will eventually be made an optional power source for the yet to be revealed FUV.

 

The cancellations of 812 orders for SF90 orders seems surprising since I would assume only top customers would be getting allocations for the SF90 and would have already bought the 812SF as early customers in order to get the GTS or just to own the 812SF first. Now I know at least one person who did buy the 812SF and put it up for sale in order to make room for the SF90 he ordered. He only had his 812 for 6 months and put 1200 miles on it before putting it up for sale in December 2019.

I suppose whatever actual demand for the 812SF is, it will now have to be satisfied on the used market and if there is demand, the number for sale should shrink. Of course there are the customers who bought the 812SF in order to get the GTS that will probably be putting their 812 up for sale after delivery of the GTS so those cars may also supply whatever 812 demand there is. The opportunity to spec your own 812 though is surely gone unless you can get a special request according to my SA.

 

My local dealer said ordering an 812SF is still possible, but it does sound as though there will be very very small amounts produced for the rest the production span. So likely special requests like WRS stated.

 

I would doubt it as impossible until the next model is released. The GTS is similar enough that I would bet they would still take an SF order if someone ordered one. But it would likely still be a "special request". Maybe it's impossible in Europe, but it seems enough US people are being told that they can still place orders.

 

I was deeply immersed in the 812 production cycle from March - July 2019 and numerous private contacts with multiple dealers revealed that "orders stacks" 18-30 deep in March with 18+ month wait were completely gone by July (i.e. were cancelled and those dealers suddenly had immediate allocation, how else could you have ordered, as many others, and received your car in 4 months or less? The first such car I personally knew about was ordered in May 2019 and received by the dealer in mid August 2019 --3 months order to delivery--- ! it seems the attrition had started prior to the SF90 reveal, but that was the fulcrum point) And most of those orders were simply moved to SF90s, remember orders do not equal allocations, anyone could order. As always there is churn to orders for numerous reasons but this was an avalanche, swift one!

 

This guy claims he's spec'ing one now. https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/waiting-list-812-gts.628996/

 

I think Ferrari caught McLaren-itis with an aggressive product plan involving a plethora of new models.

 

the gts is the spider not the coupe

 

my mistake, apologies

 

They are building a few 812SF in January

 

I actually disagree. EU regulations are forcing much of what the sweater set up before his untimely passing.

Recent 5-year new model list:
2013: LaFerrari
2013: Speciale
2014: Special-Aperta
2014: Cali-T
2015: tdF
2015: 488
2014: 488 Spider
2016: Lusso
2016: LaFerrari Aperta
2017: Lusso-T
2017: 812SF

that's 11 new models in 5 years

In September 2018 Ferrari introduced its 15 new models in 5 years:
2018: Monza
2019: F8
2019: SF90
2019: 812GTS
2019: F8 Spider
2019: Roma
2020: Portofino update
2020: SF90 Spider
2021: 812VS
2022: 812VS Aperta
2021: FUV
2022: LB
2022: LB Spider
2022: 812 replacement
2022: 812 replacement Spider

that's 15 new models in 5 years

Of those 15 new models, EU regulations is forcing the SF90 and LB models to exist, remove those and you are back to 11 new models, same as recent history, not that big of a deal, and certainly nothing to do with imitating McLaren...

 

I remember how much fanfare there was for the 812 in 2018 when it was first being delivered. The first one I saw the first one delivered to a customer here in Austin was around February 2018 I think and I was told it would be two years to get one. I was starting to think about the 488 Spider in the spring of 2018 and there was no Pista yet, the 812 was the newest car along with the Portofino. I ended up buying the 488 Spider from a flipper instead of ordering and waiting 6 months to get it. I fully expected to wait 6 months to get the 812 when I ordered it and to end up with it at my doorstep in less than 3 months was good for me but I am not sure what it says about the depth of Ferrari's customer base.

I wonder if some of the 812 demand was diverted by easier availability of the Pista given your description of the order attrition on the 812? There were plenty of people who ended up getting a Pista without buying a Lusso or Portofino that they didn't really want. It could be that Ferrari was making more money on Pistas than 812s and so they encouraged that shift? Whatever the case, it worked out great for me because I never had any desire for the Pista but I wanted the F12 from 2014 and I was considering going backwards from the 488 Spider to get a 2017 F12 until I found out I could order a new 812.

 

Of course there can be a variety of reasons, however, I had, at the time, direct conversations with multiple dealers where I was directly provided those details I indicated. No speculation on my part at all. The SF90 reveal was the pivot that resulted with the premature destruction of demand.

 

I have no reason not to believe you. I am just speculating as to the reasons. I like the car, I am just surprised not many do.

 

Thanks, as for personal reasons for each that made the switch I can only speculate but I think being able to order the new top series car was the main attraction. Another possible issue might of been the substantial delay between order and allocation and delivery (of the 812, making it year+ away for most) and having the newest model on order was compelling especially due to its 20%+ gain in overall power. Don't forget, at that time (May 2019 and prior), the USA was being undersupplied, all dealers were receiving half their expected allocations (due to EU/China oversupply). Combine those with lengthy production delays and a new, available top series car and many dropped the 812. It appears that fewer than 1000 812SF were made for the USA between 2018 and 2020 (I speculate 350, 350 and 100 delivered for those years, perhaps a little more).

 

Can someone elaborate on what special request entails please? Thanks.

 

everything i have read stated the SF90 demand was low, no idea why

 

It looks funky ?

 

You are too kind and over-diplomatic.

Marcel Massini

 

I feel very fortunate to have a personality that doesn’t give a damn about exclusivity, perceived rarity, perceived favor by Ferrari personnel, and resale value...I just buy an individual car based on how desirable it is to me for #1 looks, driving character, usefulness (? road trips/mileage friendly) and only then the performance numbers. It is a blessing.