Not understanding the 328 (308 as well?) cooling system... | FerrariChat

Not understanding the 328 (308 as well?) cooling system...

Discussion in '308/328' started by mike996, Apr 9, 2018.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

    Jun 14, 2008
    6,691
    Full Name:
    Mike 996
    What is the function of the "breather pipe, engine to water reservoir" (item #42 on the Ricambi parts diagram of the cooling system.)

    It dumps water into the expansion tank. I had never paid any attention to this previously but today, with the cap off, after adding some coolant, with the engine running there is a stream of coolant coming into the tank via that hose. I never realized that coolant was feeding into the expansion tank constantly. I thought it was like a typical overflow tank that just had coolant going in/out thought a single fitting as pressure increased/decreased.

    I noticed after adding the coolant/first starting the engine that the stream was rather forceful with lots of bubbles but it later subsided considerably to much less volume/no bubbles.

    I want to understand how the system works but can't find any info on line that addresses this specific system. Any 3x8 cooling system operational knowledge out there?
     
  2. kcabpilot

    kcabpilot Formula 3

    Apr 17, 2014
    1,527
    California SF bay area
    Full Name:
    Paul
    I've been elbow deep in the cooling system of my 308 for the past two months and the way I understand it is that is a bleeder hose and it kind of does two things. First it will purge any air in the system (up to a point at least) and secondly it causes the coolant in the expansion tank to circulate which is needed because there are two thermal sensors on the tank. In regards to air my engine has a bad head gasket so it was constantly getting in and despite much of it going through that bleeder line when the thermostat opened some of it would go to the radiator where it gets trapped. If you are constantly seeing bubbles in that stream then there is a problem somewhere but if it turns into a steady stream of coolant you're good.
     
  3. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,146
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    #3 Steve Magnusson, Apr 9, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2018
    It's more accurate to say that it circulates coolant "up" into the expansion tank. The level in the expansion tank is the highest point in the cooling system (so any air collects there). The injected cars do tend to put various sensors/devices on the expansion tank to sense the coolant temperature as kcabpilot mentioned, but having the expansion tank level above the engine is still important for the (sensorless) carbed cars - the 308GT4 WSM has a decent figure.
    At cold start-up, the coolant is just recirculating in the engine (less losses) so the flow would be more forceful in that condition. Once the thermostat valve changes state, there will be more flow losses in the long pipes and radiator (so the pressure at the fitting supplying the expansion tank will be lower).
     
  4. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

    Jun 14, 2008
    6,691
    Full Name:
    Mike 996
    Thanks Kcab/Steve, good info! :) I guess I could just trace the hose but it's dark out and I don't feel like looking at the moment - where does the "other" end of that hose connect? If you say, "Get your lazy a$$ out there with a flashlight and look!", I won't be too upset. ;)
     
  5. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    25,146
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    The "hot" coolant going to the expansion tank comes from the fitting on the hot water crossover pipe on a 328 -- hose 49 on Table 22 is the same hose as hose 42 on Table 21.
     
  6. kcabpilot

    kcabpilot Formula 3

    Apr 17, 2014
    1,527
    California SF bay area
    Full Name:
    Paul
    Yes, coolant is pumped into the block then up through the heads and to that crossover manifold which connects to the thermostat that directs it back to the engine or to the radiator or both depending on what state it is in. The small line to the tank comes right off that manifold. and there is going to be some air bubbles when you first start because the output of that line is above the coolant level in the tank. Like I said I've been all through this and have replaced every hose and component in a quest to solve my issue (I started a thread titled "air in the cooling system") In my opinion, when all is right, the system is perfectly adequate and you should have no troubles. The only modification I think might be worthwhile would be to run a bleed line from the radiator back to the tank but the more I think of it the more convinced I am that it's not really necessary.
     
  7. eulk328

    eulk328 F1 Rookie

    Feb 18, 2005
    2,800
    Full Name:
    F683
    I have a Euro 328 so it may have less "stuff" on the expansion tank. As others have alluded to, the tank is not just an expansion tank but a re-circulation tank. The Auxiliary Air Valve is mounted to the bottom of the tank. The combination of the coolant heat transferring to the bi-metallic "shutter" in the Auxiliary Air Valve, along with the 12 volt heating element in the valve, are what help determine the idle speed with a cold/cool engine.

     

Share This Page