Nutrition for lifting thread | FerrariChat

Nutrition for lifting thread

Discussion in 'Health & Fitness' started by Chupacabra, Feb 23, 2021.

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  1. Chupacabra

    Chupacabra F1 Rookie
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    As requested in my pistol squat thread, here we are!

    I have some things to contribute, but no time at the moment. Everyone else, have at it! I'm sure we will all love to see what you're doing that is working for you.
     
  2. rdefabri

    rdefabri Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Well I’ve been blessed with a great metabolism, so my weight gain or even body fat has always been pretty good.

    Where I’ve had issues is crazy heartburn, a result of my eating habits (I was eating every 2 hours to keep my weight up).

    I was successful in cutting that out - no more heartburn and I’m now getting pretty cut.
     
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  3. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    I have always been pretty simple. I eat pretty well overall but as I got older we modified our diet some. Generally dinner is 2 vegetables and a protein. We have potatoes, rice, bread, etc but not every night. I don't generally drink during the week but I do appreciate a cocktail on the weekend. I control total intake to stay in a calorie range to maintain weight. Lately, I have added protein (using Isopure) and raised my calorie intake a bit. That has helped me push through the prior plateau.

    I am definitely gaining strength but weight is only up about 2 lb. It appears that I have driven general body fat lower and my weight belt goes one notch tighter. BUT I still have a bit around the middle. If I want to get rid of the bit around the middle I think I am going to have to get serious about a controlled diet.

    I can tell you a bit of age does impact your weight gain and recovery. What worked easily at 40 doesn't work as well as I close on 60 in a few more months.

    Obviously I am not very strict. How strict are you guys? Do you focus on macro nutrient mix or do you also detail micronutrients?
     
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  4. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

    Dec 4, 2004
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    Eat Clen, Tren hard, Anavar give up. lol jk

    I've gotten out of shape the last year and need to go back on my old diet which was pretty strict with the calorie source breakdown: 40% from protein, 40% from carbs, and 20% from fat. That worked for me, but I had access to a good gym back then...not anymore. Would probably be a waste to do that and not have my old workout routine.
     
  5. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    Gyms are open here and I would expect them to open in most places over the next month or so. Get a trainer and go for it. I just finished a deload and Friday I hit a new PR on bench.

    My trainer keeps telling me to eat more. I am 6'6" 205lb. Overall my body fat is low and muscles are ripped but I could drop a little around the middle. I really need to clean up my diet to get that into shape. I tend toward macros like you but am wondering if there is benefit in considering a bit more detail.
     
  6. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    I cut out some of the junk (like the occasional chocolate chip cookie, or 3) and tightened up the diet some (reduced the portions a tiny bit). Went back to protein and two vegetables (no starch) for dinner. Dropped back from 208 to 202.5 in a matter of about 2 weeks. Been boosting the protein intake some as well. The overall results definitely show in lower body fat. Still have a little flab at the middle but it mostly shows more since there is very little other body fat.

    Do you guys measure body fat? If so, how often and how do you do it?

    The results in the gym show as well. Yesterday move my PR on bench from 230 to 245. Did warmup, 225, 235, 240, and 245. Probably can do more given that the 245 went up smoothly and we beat the PR several times. The 240 even clipped the catch on the way up but I didn't stall and put it up clean. Pretty happy with those results given that I turn 60 in July.
     
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  7. Jo Sta7

    Jo Sta7 F1 Rookie
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    No great way. Mirror is what I use.
     
  8. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    Fair. I also pay attention to the notch on my weight belt. Pretty obvious when the middle expands.
     
  9. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    So do any of you use supplements? If so, what? Let's stick to legal things here :)

    I use whey protein and make smoothie, fruit, protein powder, water, ice. I use Isopure because it doesn't come with a ton of other junk and as a result is low calorie. I also use BCAA as a drink during my workouts. I am considering adding Creatine Monohydrate to my smoothie. I do think the protein helps. If I skip my smoothie the lifts are harder. I recognize that could be placebo as well but that is how it feels. It also appears to help with gains.
     
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  10. TexasF355F1

    TexasF355F1 Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Haven't been back to the gym since covid started, but you pretty much have the same thing I did. Although my smoothies changed to a protein bar because after close to 10 years of daily smoothies I got bored of it.

    BCAA's were a must for me when working out. Water never cut it, especially when I started to doing heavy cardio days.

    If you haven't, maybe consider starting a joint supplement. It became a necessary thing for me. Not constantly, but I could tell when I needed to get back on them.
     
  11. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    Yea, I was using collagen for a while because I was having a lot of tendonitis issues at both elbows. I also started using versa grips for heavy pulls to reduce the pull on the tendons there (for deads I use chalk, not versa grips). The problem has slowly been getting better and I have been reducing the use of versa grips. I also avoid certain bars, like straight bars for curls. That REALLY aggravates the tendons so I stick to a curl bar and dumbbells.
     
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  12. rdefabri

    rdefabri Three Time F1 World Champ

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    I have the same problem and it's getting worse with age. So I avoid certain grips and don't grab the bar or dumbbells so tight (as I'm prone to doing). Right now, my wrist is killing me, and it's definitely more of a tendon type pain than something else. It takes time to go away, but if I'm smart about how I lift, it should go away.

    It SUCKS getting old!!
     
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  13. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    I feel you here. But, I still put up a couple of PRs for my 60th last week.
     
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  14. TexasF355F1

    TexasF355F1 Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Not sure it will help, but possibly seeing a PT to work on your specific troubled areas may help.

    My cousin worked on my arm when I had some sort of tendonitis in my forearm area. It pretty much went away. I still had to be a bit careful for a month or two afterwards, but I was able to return to normal.

    I also had stopped trying to lift heavy and just focused on muscle contractions.
     
  15. rdefabri

    rdefabri Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Mine usually goes away if I care for it (wear brace or sleeve, change my grip, etc.). One thing I have been doing is alternating high reps / low weight with lower reps / heavier weight.

    To be fair, I don't do "heavy" weights, but heavier than when I do my light day. I learned this technique from John Meadows (aka "Mountain Dog"), he's a 50-year old bodybuilder that does what he calls a "200 rep set". It's basically 2 sets of 25 reps, 4 different exercises per body part.

    Man, does the lactic acid burn kill you. It's hard but a lot of fun. It's also much easier on my elbows, knees, and wrists!

    I'm almost 53, so I have to be mindful I'm not a spring chicken!
     
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  16. italiafan

    italiafan F1 World Champ
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    I’ve learned a lot from the following Youtube “trainers.”
    You pick up ideas for different exercises to keep it fun, great tips on correct form to minimize injury, and good “scientific” basis for some exercises and nutrition.

    Jeff Cavalier from Athlean-X.
    Ryan Humiston
    John Meadows, “Mountain Dog.”
    Jeff Nipard.

    I think people tend to over think it. After years of lifting here is my take on it for long term success (in order of importance):

    1. Consistency. To accomplish this you need to have FUN in the gym, and AVOID injury. This is a marathon, not a sprint; it is a lifestyle choice over years and years.

    2. Intensity. If you don’t push at all there will be no gains. Over time you need to play with and alternate: frequency, volumes, progressive overload, rep ranges, going heavy, and going light (this also keeps it fun). I do 4 days on and 1 day off per cycle. Most of the time I go to (95-100%) failure on every set, with 8-15 rep ranges depending on muscle type. About every fourth cycle I change it to “Century Sets.” Those are sets of 100 reps. Usually with first weight try to get 20-30 reps, and then drop set all the way to 100 without stopping. Really shakes the body up, big burn, and a fun change. Vary isolating and compound exercises.

    3. Nutrition. You have to provide the body with fuel, or you will just tear things down and increase risk for acute and chronic injuries. Prioritize natural foods over supplements. High quality protein targeting at least 1g per Kg of body weight per day. I do use Whey Isolate from Muscle Feast 1-2x per day. Don’t forget quality fats. Carbs I try to minimize and avoid simple sugars but get carbs from complex sources like starch (potatoes, rice, breads, etc.). But your muscles do need to rebuild glycogen stores, so carbs are very helpful.

    4. Rest. Get your sleep in (though we all know how difficult that is especially as you age, 3am anyone? :)). Sometimes it is hard to convince oneself to stay out of the gym when on a “gym roll.” It is important to rotate muscle groups and be mindful of not doubling up on a muscle too much in combining isolating and compound exercises; and also be mindful that the joints keep working each time and that is when chronic injuries creep up. “Push day” back-to-back with “pull day” means elbows and shoulders were stressed on both days back-to-back. Not good when you are in your 50s and above. Also, every now and then take a week or 10 days off entirely. Just relax, allow muscles to recover and grow, and allow your nervous system to adapt. This also feeds into keeping it fun. I think if you go at it too long the nervous system starts to fatigue and you begin to dread starting in the gym that day. Above all, listen to your body and know when to back off.

    Now that I read what I wrote...it appears I made it complicated after all! Lol. :D
     
  17. Skidkid

    Skidkid F1 Veteran
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    Nice summary @italiafan I don't think I ever do the same workout twice, my trainer keeps it mixed up really well. He also brings a lot of new stuff to the table because he watches other trainers, lifts himself, and is always hunting for something new. Deload weeks are one of the hardest for me; I tend to go at it hard so running at something that feels like I am not doing anything is difficult for me. BUT, we are doing them more. Last week I turned 60 and over the next several sessions I set 3 new PRs. Now we dropped back to a few days of deload, then working sets at various weights and reps to build up the base again. I do like drop setting to very high numbers, that will make you VERY sore but really helps build. Your rep counts are WAY higher than are typical for strength training. Depending on what part of a cycle we are doing reps are typically 3, 6, 8, 10, or 12; of course PR days have reps of 1 but that is different. I tend to work at a very high pace as well, one exercise to another without breaks. I work opposing groups to allow a bit of recovery and a circuit will often be 3-5 different forms. Overall, it makes a good cardio workout if you do that.
     
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  18. italiafan

    italiafan F1 World Champ
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    Very nice!
    What do you drop for the deload weeks? Do you drop both weight and volume, or just one?

    I’m not so much going for strength per se, but rather hypertrophy.

    I have found with myself that if I push too much: no breaks, heavy breathing, heavy sweating....that I’m not having as much fun and thus longevity gets compromised because of the ‘ol *groan* it’s leg day...:)....I use a rowing machine and go for vigorous walks to get cardio.
     
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  19. Skidkid

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    We do a few different things. We will deload at about 30% off for a week or so, no change in reps. I struggle for that one because I feel like I am not working hard. But that is the point, let everything recover. We also do periods of several weeks working at 80-85% of max and do working sets of 6-10 depending on where we are in the weight spectrum. We also do a week or so where we go at 90-95% for 3.

    Personally, I think of it like a pyramid. I need a deep and strong base to push the peak up. If you can do 3x3 with 1 rep in reserve you can probably lift about 20% more than that as a PR. BUT you need a 6 or 8 x 3 10% below that. At least that has been my experience. Also, when we started building a deeper base of working weight we then crush the PRs. Not by 5 lb but 15-20 lb. We generally do 2 main strength/power exercises and a bunch of auxiliary exercise for any given muscle group. I think this approach reduces the risk or injury.

    Recently we have been working really hard on the tiny last adjustments to form. I found that my right pec was a bit underdeveloped compared to my left; same for my right shoulder. I am right handed (mostly) so that is pretty odd. We started to investigate and work on that issue. I found that there was a slight variation in my form from side to side. I mean a 5 degree tip different in the arm and 1/2 inch more raised elbow. Correct those and magically I had to work VERY hard on the right. Of course it won't be fixed overnight but it has been a couple of weeks and there is significant changes. I would say VERY closely look at your form as well. Tiny changes make a difference over time.

    I have a long and lean build, 6'6" 195lb. I am getting much larger muscles and a LOT of definition but I will never be big and boxy, it just isn't my build.
     
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  20. Maximus1973

    Maximus1973 Formula 3

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    High protein low carb generally works best for me. I never count calories as I want to enjoy my life a bit and have left my dreams of being a Mr Olympia decades ago.
    Protein is always more or less the same at 200-250gr per day depending on if I’m training or not. Also a lot of focus on veggies and I try to steer away from carbs. I do generally 1-2 refeed meals in the weekend; aka eating out! If I want to increase weigh tI simply add carbs. Fat is also a bit higher as that generally makes me feel so much better and energized.
    Truly big difference was when I switched my obligatory oatmeal and protein as a breakfast for 5-6 whole eggs with some bacon sometimes. I have 2x more energy, no crash, and tons of focus in the morning. Have my cholesterol checked every few months and it actually dropped since eating those eggs.
    Main focus is real foods and some fat free yoghurt as well every day. I hardly ever use a protein shake as after 30 years of drinking them I’m done.
    I do use a ton of supplements and keep on tweaking to whats new and what seems to work for me.

    For joints and tendons I see amazing results from using Cissus quadrangularis and high quality Curcumin (taken with food and black pepper exract) as well as 3gr of Omega3 per day.

    As far as protein shakes I would drop the Isopure right away. It’s total bogus. The reason why it’s clear is that the manufacturer filters out all the good stuff like immunoglobulins and IGF-1 for example. AKA why you want to use Whey Protein in the first place! I ‘m not fixed on brands, but that one sucks doggballs and I would debate with the manufacturer (actually I have!) on why it is even allowed to be called protein!

    Creatine is of course tries and true and has greater benefits as one ages.

    In fact as we age our protein utilization drops so we should increase protein actually. Especially as we are 60 and over….

    Tons of other supplements one could use and try based on personal preferences:
    Aswagandha
    Rhodiola Rosea
    Multi vitamin
    ZMA before bed time
    Glucose disposal agents as I get fat from carbs are also great for me.

    When weight training I love to use a preworkout and mix in a bunch of other ingredients like additonal Citrulline + Epicatechin + Creatine Monohydrate + Glycerol.
    Intra workout I always use Highly Branched Cyclic dextrin (unusual carbs!) + 20gr of EAA’s (ditch the BCAA’s!)

    Post workout is about 30-60 minutes after workout with 50gram of protein. Carbs you don’t need to recover but just protein and preferably within 1 hour.
    There was a controversial study that some over here might reference to stating that “ the anabolic window is a myth as protein synthesis stays elevated for up to 36 hours” yet that study was done on novice athletes aka newbie gains. Even intermediate trainers should stick with the 1 hour rule; it’s been proven to work….

    Just my 2 cents a bit… ;-)
     
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  21. italiafan

    italiafan F1 World Champ
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    Very nice thanks.
    Question about creatinine. I was usually it daily for months and I was getting annoying arch of foot cramps pretty regularly, but I could put up with those.
    Then I started getting abdominal wall cramps and a couple times it felt my muscle was tearing it hurt so much! It actually hurt for days after. In fact, scared the **** out of my teenage son lifting with me, he thought I was having a heart attack. Then it happened while driving and that was really no bueno.
    I stopped the creatinine and haven’t had one since.

    Any tips would be appreciated...
     
  22. Maximus1973

    Maximus1973 Formula 3

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    I’m sure you mean Creatine as Creatinine is a toxic by product.

    Creatine actually increases cellular hydration. It’s been a fable that Creatine can cause muscle cramps.
    Creatine merely highlights that you might have a mineral imbalance/deficiency or simply drink not enough water. Perhaps using more salt (preferably pink himalaya) could help prevent those.

    Creatine has been proven for decades to be not only beneficial but extremely healthy on so many levels.
    Again, Creatine causing muscle cramps would technically not be possible…..Problem should lie in other areas.
     
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