Oil consumption issues 812SF | FerrariChat

Oil consumption issues 812SF

Discussion in 'FF/Lusso' started by stteale, May 10, 2023.

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  1. stteale

    stteale Rookie

    May 9, 2022
    11
    UK
    Full Name:
    Stephen Teale
    Hi.
    Travelled through the forum and it seems I should be expecting about 1-1.5 litres oil consumption, is that correct?

    just picked mine up and it’s done 11, yes 11 litres in 2000 miles with only minimal “spirited” driving

    anyone seen issues like this?
     
  2. jaapio

    jaapio Karting

    Feb 19, 2016
    155
    Bruinisse, the Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Jaap
  3. Eilig

    Eilig F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Aug 31, 2001
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    Tänzelndes Pferd
    ~40% of engine friction is generated by piston rings. Friction produces heat and reduces hp. Building engines "loose" w/lower ring tension reduces heat and increases hp - at the expense of increased oil consumption! i.e. "cheap" hp.

    F12/F12tdf don't consume oil. It's arguable Ferrari got it wrong w/812SF engine. i.e. had they built it w/enough ring tension to prevent oil over-consumption, how much hotter would it have run, how much hp would've been sacrificed?
     
    JTSE30, stteale, day355 and 2 others like this.
  4. Emirateshills575

    Feb 1, 2023
    152
    UAE
    Full Name:
    X
    Absolutely not normal, more than 1L per 1000km, most of oil consumption is after 5000RPM, but mine Gtc4lusso has not any consumption. And V8 porsche 4.8 Litres have cons around 1Liter per 5000km. So go to check engine cylinders condition with endoscopy immediately
     
  5. Emirateshills575

    Feb 1, 2023
    152
    UAE
    Full Name:
    X
    V12 ROLLSE ROYCE - ABSOLUTELY nothing.
    V8 G63 - 0.1 liter per 2000km
    992 GT3 - almost nothing
    Petrol V8 4.8 - 0 liters per 15000km
    575m - 0.5 liter per 3000km
     
  6. rjwheels

    rjwheels Rookie

    Oct 24, 2021
    42
    London UK

    My last 812SF, after 23k miles, used (on average) 1 litre every 550 miles .... my current 812SF about the same.

    Handbook suggests max 1 litre per 310 miles, suggest talk to Ferrari workshop.
     
  7. day355

    day355 F1 Rookie

    Jun 25, 2006
    2,578

    very good analysis !
     
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  8. Eilig

    Eilig F1 Rookie
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    Thanks! Years ago built some of my own engines, used wrong rings, engines very oil-thirsty. Learned the hard way. :)
     
    day355 likes this.
  9. stteale

    stteale Rookie

    May 9, 2022
    11
    UK
    Full Name:
    Stephen Teale
    thanks for the input all, I have returned the car to the dealer :-( waiting on options from them.
     
  10. jaapio

    jaapio Karting

    Feb 19, 2016
    155
    Bruinisse, the Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Jaap
    I have been looking inside the inlet manifold to check if there was an excessive amount of oil being sucked in from the crankcase, but this does not seem to be the case, so I think it must be either leaking past the valve seals or the piston ring package.

    As mentioned above I think the last is the issue here, not sure if it is really an issue as the dealer I bough the car from is driving an 812SF himself with 170000km (105000 Miles) on it and he did mention to check the oil level every 1000km as they are known to be using a lot of oil.
     

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  11. jaapio

    jaapio Karting

    Feb 19, 2016
    155
    Bruinisse, the Netherlands
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    Jaap
    By the way how many smiles has your car now ?
     
  12. Eilig

    Eilig F1 Rookie
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    Could it be that the car has a factory-installed catch can that we don't know about?
     
  13. MaranelloAllTheWay

    Apr 30, 2023
    243
    At this rate, you guys will need new catalytic converters. This is such an enormous amount of oil that an engine burns. The problem is, oil passing around the pistons into combustion chamber also means gas is entering into the oil pan therefore mixing with oil, diluting it. I know this is a ferrari forum and probably not a lot of you change your own oil, but if you did and get an oil sample, I’d be curious to see the analysis from blackstone. My money is on the oil has excess amount of gas in it. When this happens, oil viscosity will drop and oil wont be able to do its job. Thinned oil due to gas will escape even more from the piston rings increasing the already bad oil consumption. Its a pretty bad cycle, once it starts it doesnt end well.
     
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  14. stteale

    stteale Rookie

    May 9, 2022
    11
    UK
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    Stephen Teale
    Had 7600 when I collected. still under 10k now
     
  15. MaranelloAllTheWay

    Apr 30, 2023
    243
    Oil might also be passing through valve stems or valve guides not just piston rings. Best way to know is to take off the intake manifold and look at the top of the valves. Not all oil consumption leads to oil being sucked into intake.
     
  16. jaapio

    jaapio Karting

    Feb 19, 2016
    155
    Bruinisse, the Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Jaap
    Ok, then it can't be blamed on "being in the break-in period " I assume, I am very curious to see what the dealer will find/say about it.

    I put 250km on my car today, so a total of 300km since the last oil level check, and I could not see any drop in the oil level before and after, I took the measurement at approximately 84-85 degrC.

    The car has 28000km's on it now (=17500 miles)
     
  17. AEHaas

    AEHaas Formula 3

    May 9, 2003
    1,465
    Osprey, Florida
    Full Name:
    Ali E. Haas
    Make sure you check both sides of the oil stick after you pull it out. I do not know why but on my car one side is always without any oil on it and the other side is always at the right level. No oil consumption for me. This is with around-town driving as I do not track cars any more.

    Ali
     
  18. Solid State

    Solid State F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 4, 2014
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    Maximus Decimus Meridius
    It definitely can but pretty sure no one here is going to tear down their manifold on an 812.
     
  19. stteale

    stteale Rookie

    May 9, 2022
    11
    UK
    Full Name:
    Stephen Teale
    Hi

    update, Ferrari have said new engine required.
    My concern now is “and what else” ie what will fail next, has the car been tracked heavily in its past etc.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
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  20. 350MH83

    350MH83 Formula 3

    Jul 11, 2014
    1,180
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    ok well it's good you got a confirmation that this was not right, and that they will fix it. I wouldnt overthink it. Many issues can lead to oil overconsumption, and they are not necessarily related to poor maintenance or track use. **** happens. Getting a new engine is a good thing! That definitely takes the most expensive failure point out of your car, at least for the new warranty period (I assume you would get one on the new engine). Is the replacement covered under warranty?
     
  21. MaranelloAllTheWay

    Apr 30, 2023
    243
    I dont think any of these oil consumption numbers here are good. Engine shouldn't consume 1 liter of oil multiple times every 1,000 miles. Ferrari's 300 mile standard is just to reduce their warranty liability but I wouldn't keep a car long term if my engine was going through 1 liter of oil every 500 miles. That engine will not last long.
     
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  22. jaapio

    jaapio Karting

    Feb 19, 2016
    155
    Bruinisse, the Netherlands
    Full Name:
    Jaap
    I would go for the engine swap if I had to make the choice, it is a nice car and I think very little of these 812's see much track action, it is just not the right tool for the job, they might have a trackday in them but most of them just for the weekend cruise.

    With so little miles on it, it makes sense just to stick a new engine in it.

    I have now put on about 500km on mine since the last oil check and no sign of any drop in the oil level, car is 2018 and around 28300kms.
     
  23. rjwheels

    rjwheels Rookie

    Oct 24, 2021
    42
    London UK
    You might find this thread of interest..... lots of posts about 812 oil consumption rates, but very little, if anything, about resultant replacement engines.
    For me, the checking and topping up oil process is a small price to pay to maintain the glorious sounding V12 engine.

    https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/812-oil-consumption.628081/
     
  24. MaranelloAllTheWay

    Apr 30, 2023
    243
    I m not sure this is a sustainable model. That much oil going through the engine will foul the cats, sensors, engine itself at some point. I dont think these cars are driven long enough (yet) for this to become a problem.
     

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