1998 F1. 26,900 miles. I bought the car as a project that stalled from a friend of mine. I got the car running after a few days and was able to drive it. But the clutch was slipping under load. After taking it apart I noticed the pressure plate was new and the flywheel had just been recently resurfaced. The clutch sensor and throw out bearing looked new and it spun freely. Paper work I had with the car showed a recent service on it as well. I ended up replacing the disc and the triple seals. After assembly the car refused to go into 1st or reverse. Thinking the disc was faulty I put the original one back in and it immediately went into gear and drove. So thinking there was a issue with the new disc, I had the original one re-lined. Once installed, it did the same thing and refused to go into gear. After reading about every thread on the F1 system available online. I came to a conclusion that the accumulator could of possibly been at fault. I replaced the accumulator, same results. I’ve bled the clutch several times. My wife’s changes the gears while I crack the bleeder. I close it mid way thru the cycle. It’s pure fluid. I’m certain. I’ve tried the WSM PIS reset procedure. There’s two versions of this. I’ve done both. Neither worked. I can’t do the IO procedure because it won’t go into gear. It does successfully cycle the octopus procedure though. I took it to Cleveland (North Coast Exotics) to be scanned and reset. He set PIS and all that, but for whatever reason the clutch position would not accept his input to change the parameters. It kept rejecting the values he put in. The position was off and it explains why it won’t engage the gear. He Spent two hours messing with it. Each time the computer rejected the command to alter clutch position. All other functions communicated properly. I brought the car back home with me. He wanted to talk to the Leonardo company and see if there’s a software reason why the car wouldn’t communicate. If there’s no issues with software then idk where to turn. Also had a code for transmission output sensor failure and it refused to delete, however, there’s no issues with my Speedo working. Again it was a running, driving, shifting car other then the clutch had slippage. There was a couple incidents where it would not shift to 3rd and beyond. This is a issue of a bad out-put sensor, but could that sensor have any affect on the clutch position sensor? I attempted to order the replacement sensor and received an email stating that part was limited and currently unavailable. Also my battery is 7 years old. It always been on a tender and holds 12.8 voltage just fine. Is there any possibility it could be a battery issue? I’ve had Porsches that acted real funny when it didn’t like the battery voltage even tho the battery was fine. Change battery? Does the output sensor on the trans affect the PIS and clutch sensor at all? Anyone have the specs on both sensors so I can test them? I’ll definitely replace the output sensor. I’m trying to avoid just throwing parts at it to fix it. I’m sure it’s something silly, but I got no leads. thanks for your input! Dave.
Having the battery checked, or swapping in a known good one, is an easy check and a good idea. It can not hurt. However, battery issues usually rear their ugly head in the immobilizer first.
Sometimes I have to press the button a few times before it disarms. I figured it was just old. Symptom? And I’m just tossing around and idea I can to figure out why.
That's pretty normal. The antenna for the immobilizer is behind the drivers seat and occasionally doesn't pick up the signal. Something else is off on that F1 system. Disappointed the computer connection did not work because that's usually the holy grail.
Do you only have one fob? If you have multiple fobs, do you alternate their use? Do you know if any of your fobs are cloned? How often do you replace the batteries? How clean/ tight are the battery contacts on the fob? If it's a car immobiliser antenna issue, sometimes you can re-route the antenna. Do you have a rivetted cover on your immobiliser (or has it been removed)? No need to answer this question in public, of course. Mine was absent when I bought my car, and I don't know if it interferes with the signal.
From From what I’m told, Earl at north coast is where the dealers take their cars when they can’t figure something out. Earl looked for a different F1 TCU on his stash. Just to swap and try, but couldn’t find it. Again, tho. Why would it run and drive in first place is what I don’t get. I was thinking of just replacing both sensors and taking it back up there. I’d be pretty upset if it still wouldn’t work. I’m hoping there’s something I’m over looking and it can be resolved. I wish I knew the specs on the sensors so I could bench test them. Thanks again, Watson! You been a big help since I joined the group.
I I just have one FOB. There’s no issue starting the car. It always starts, it just won’t go into gear with the new clutch. VS. it drove fine before the new clutch. I believe is a clutch position issue. The clutch isn’t disengaging enough for it to go into 1st gear and the Leonardo was unable to change the value. Kinda frustrating to be honest. I did consider the battery voltage in the car may be low, and not accepting the command, but it allowed all other modules and computers to communicate.
What is the clutch position number you are trying to put in. If you are trying to put in a number that is out of range it won’t work. You need to install a clutch and ensure the mechanicals are good and the clutch pack is correct mechanically. If all of that is good then you should be able to input your new clutch PIS number. The computer will do the rest I think you are correct that you are out of range If everything mechanical is good then it should work. The sensor under the transmission that tells the f1 that the transmission is in motion can be partly damaged and it will run As mine did. It will not shift properly but at the time I damaged mine my clutch worked and it still worked perfectly from a standstill but gave issues once moving and trying to shift Will reread and see if I missed something
When bleeding the clutch I would not change gears but just turn the ignition on so the f1 system pressures up. While it’s pressuring up open and close bleeder quickly Turn car of and back on and repeat You only have a few seconds Not sure when your wife is changing gears But if you are bleeding during that but I would not. if the clutch mechanically measures good for tolerances of individual components and the pack it could be the position indicator inside the housing. I have not had a problem with mine before so *unsure of the symptoms If when using the Leonardo it shows the position sensor changing then that sensor is likely good. I am also unsure of the total range but did read it on here some where.
I’m assuming you are using a factory clutch, pressure plates etc. I have heard of problems with aftermarket clutches and when original put back in end of problem. This is especially true with carbon clutches.
Old clutch worked New clutch disc no work Relined clutch disc no work What spec did you use to rebuild? Since you only replaced the disc did you check the pp and fw and note the setup height spec of the unit? No amount of electronics is going to work if the mechanicals aren’t right.
My standard practice now is ... buy the factory clutch components no matter how expensive they are. I have had a real bad run with non OEM parts last few times.
I was paying attention, but not trying to hover over Earl as he wad screwing with it. But the registered value shown was 1.875 for the clutch and he tried to change it to 2.225 iirc. It rejected the command each time. He may of tried smaller increments leading up to 2.225.
The new disc measured 8.9mm thickness. The original disc was 6.9mm thickness and it was slipping. I gave the specs to the company who relined my OG disc. 9mm thick and 8.3 compressed. The disc is actually only 8.7mm not compressed, but still failed to engage. I ended up installing the first new disc which is 8.9mm thick. So from the worn original disc(6.9mm) to the new one(8.9mm) i only added 2mm of thickness. Seems trivial to me. I did not take any measurements prior to installation of the disc. I just cleaned everything and used a straight edge to check if the surfaces were true. I ordered a new clutch position sensor and I’m working on ordering a output sensor. If anything, I’ll have spares.
Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Question is the buzzer going off ??? And after read the manual there’s a few sensors that read input , output speed, clutch and shifter positions, hydraulic pressure and etc You should check each one at the TCM and there is a relearn / clutch wear check in the pics did you try that yet It seems that this system will make sure it’s always in neutral if something is not right Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
I installed a new battery. It did not fix the problem. I got the new sensor today from Ricambi. I’m headed to the shop now to install it and reset the PIS. Fingers crossed. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Had the car up on the lift to change the sensor. Found this. Apparently I have replaced the wrong sensor. Apparently this is the electro magnetic F1 sensor. Is this sensor capable of causing the issue I have? Image Unavailable, Please Login
Looks like you changed the vehicle speed sensor (not such a bad idea as they do tend to break down a lot). The sensor with the broken lead is the "Gearbox input shaft revolution sensor". Image Unavailable, Please Login Sounds like this would contribute to your your problem. It was noted recently that this sensor is not shown in any of the F1 wiring diagrams, so it would be difficult to check the wiring between the harness and the ECU (if the problem wasn't so obvious like yours).
It was a bit of a relief to find something that’s actually a issue. I read about 30 threads involving the trans sensor. All were related to the suspension light being on and not shifting into 3rd. If anything now I have a spare, but this other sensor I was completely unaware of. I’m going to order one immediately. I really hope it’s the issue here. Was this a last minute revision when build time came? I wonder why there no diagram for it? On the bright side, I’ve read soo many threads, that if anything pops up in the future, I’ll know the symptoms immediately for the F1 system. I might of wasted a few bucks in parts I didn’t need, but it wasn’t all in vein.
It's funny. Something happens and everyone screams the worst possible scenarios. We start sweating. Checking maintenance reserve accounts. Preparing for the worst. But in the end, it is usually something simple. Let's hope that was it.
