On Michael's move (Spoiler)...

Er dude, that legally would be your fault. At least in any country I have driven. And I personally consider it pretty important to keep a good distance from any car in front of me on the freeway. If I didn't it would be my fault, end of story.

Secondly, "jams on the brakes for no reason", is also wrong. MS was doing something he was completely entitled to do. No matter how "sneaky and evil-scheming" you think MS's tactics are, it doesn't mean they aren't legal.

Now, on another note. I personally like to see a driver giving 100% on the track, full stop. Not someone who uses arrogance and whining off track to bring interest and attention to his peformance.
People forget that F1 is a sport. If you want to see the battle of the personalities, go watch Wrestling.

 

I'm only trying to make two points here:

1) It was not entirely JPM's fault for touching MS due to MS' unexpected move.

2) JPM is a talented driver and his off the track behavior should have no bearing on evaluating his driving abilities.

Peace said.

 

It's only "partially" JPM's fault if he actually rear ended Michael.....I actually don't think that happened at all. Looked like MS turned into him.

 

Asianbond,
1. I would not consider MS moves unexpected since he was doing them for half a lap and furthermore, they were moves that all the drivers were doing (including Whinny P) and are expected to do. Using your flawed highway analogy, if you were following a car that was maybe having engine trouble, a teen driving erratically, a soccer mom on the phone - would you be on their bumper? NO! You would follow at a safe distance - especially if you were EXPECTING IT or doing the same thing! And as was mentioned before, "Er Dude, it WOULD be your fault!" if you hit them. Just as it IS Juan's fault. Does it make sense for JPM to drag race MS (JPM's own admission) and be up his tailpipe when he KNOWS the next move will be braking?!?!?! And in a "OH SOOOO DARK TUNNEL!!!" as many of you trolls have alluded to. Once again, if it was "SOOOOO" dark, why was he SOOOO close? I'll tell you (since you have not figured it out), he is always/has always/will always risk the safety of others for his own personal gain.

2. The problem with Juan is that his off-track persona directly influences his behavior on the track. He will forever be the little boy bully who must use force over finese to prove his worth. His flashes of brilliance (that give us all hope, by the way) are followed by extended periods of mediocre, and most times dangerous, drives. These less than inspiring drives are followed by endless whinning about the team, the other dirvers, the FIA - but never about him not performing. "No, I am JPM!!! I have big stones, so do not get in my way!" My goodness, do you not get tired of that crap? Had he spent another year in Indy cars, we would not be discussing him now. The US motorsport crowd had him figured out after only a few races the year AFTER he won it all (in a car so dominant it was not even close - think Ferrari and Minardi). His second year he was mired mid field and it was time to pass around the tissues. He could not WAIT to get back to F1!!! Everyone here in the US knew he was a farce - despite all his bravado speak and complaints. The fans and the writers just looked at him and said, "shut up and drive!" Prove you can do it, show some ability, and then and only then will you be taken seriously. THe reason he HATES the US motorsport folks and dishes them every chance he gets. Believe me when I say I followed his Indy career close. I very much enjoyed Mansell coming over here and kicking a few establised butts! I was hoping JPM would do the same.

Bottom line - do not preach to me about discussing only his driving abilities and not his endearing personality. I probably know more about the guy and his (lack of) ability than you trolls do. I DO discuss and make points on his driving abilities. Take the blinders off and look around.
Jim

 

As I've mention in my last few posts, I don't think JPM rear ended MS. That is the only way you can prove he is at fault, if JPM did do that. If you look at the replay JPM's front wheel was even with MS's front wheel before the crash was made. How could he "rear end" him at that point? JPM would have had to turn left in order to hit MS. A much more believable scenario is one which MS simply turns into JPM (because he doesn't see him or just wants to close the door but over estimates the amount of space) or maybe MS speeded past JPM and then brakes (while JPM is literally 2-3 feet behind him)? Either way, how would JPM be at fault?

 

Why would MS "shut the door"? You make it sound like they are racing. And if both cars were side by side, why no damage to JM car? You are full of it. A side by side collision would have left a mark if not, taken out JM too. Get real. And once more, why was JM so close that he couldn't slow down? Too close to the leader and being a lapped car with another 4 minutes to go befor the green = JM being a tool.

 

Bull.....if you look at the replay...non was directly behind JPM,but JPM being onelap behind is that close....bull....he should be deducted his points for the race and be at the back of the grid next race, and a $10,000 fine for not paying attention.

 

Even though JPM may have been one lap back, he still has the right if not the obligation to his team to pass MS and try to win the race. In Monaco, who knows what could have happened to allow JPM to get back on the lead lap. From what I have noted with my TIVO, and knowledge of MS past antics , it seems clear to me that MS was "break checking" JPM and got bite by his own recklessness. poor baby. The question is, how many racess should MS be suspended and how large of a fine should the careless moron pay?

 

Again why would MS "brake check" JM??? This does not make sense. You're just throwing things out there with no thought. And as for jm passing MS. There was a reason he was a lap down, he was slow. The car or jm was not up to par and he was lapped. If he got by MS in the first turn, he would get the blue flags. So passing an winning was never going to happen. Again as for brake checking, he was warming his car up. Like everyone else, including jm. So I guess all F1 drivers use "tricks" and "antics". Yeah ok.
If Moncrya passed MS he would have to lap the field in about 20 laps. Yeah he was tryng to win the race, sure he was. Total B.S.

 

I suspect mS was just trying to knock JPM out of the race like he did Mika in Japan a few years back. While MS is a great driver, he is just a German redneck that has made it rich in F1. You can put him in a mansion, but you can't make him be a gentlemen. Also, FYI, there has been F1 races won by drivers who were up to 2 laps down at a point in the race. A large accident could have happened that would have allowed JPM to catch back up tothe lead lap and who knows what could have then happens. Strange things happen at Monaco, like only three cars finishing the race in 1996 I believe?

 

Simply put, it doesn't look like JPM rear ended MS. The way they approach the kink completely excludes that possibility. How can I rear end you if my front wheel is in line with your back wheel? That doesn't make any sense. And if JPM didn't rear end him and didn't turn into him.......how is he at fault?

 

Which locales of Germany do such "rednecks" come from? I'd like to know, because I'm German, and Kerpen is actually a very nice city. Little did I know. I suppose it could also be said that you can train a man to become an educated attorney, but you can't divorce him from his arrogance, nor his ignorances. What silly irony.

Name them. State facts.

4 cars finished in 1996.

 

Just amazing how you can contradict yourself in your bottom line by claiming to distingush his personality from his driving abilities, yet still give JPM zero credit for his driving achievements. So praytell what better measurement is there in evaluating a driver's effectiveness in F1 racing besides counting their victories? I guess your own seat of the pants subjective opinion provides a better objective analysis than F1 team owners?

Like I earlier stated, even though he won last year at Monaco and even if he wins the driver's championship this year, no matter what, in your mind he will always be a talent-less driver.

Do you even know how to spell prejudice?

 

Btw, can you name the actual incidents where he was "driving aggresively and risking the safety of other" which lead to causing another car into an accident?

Moreover, I personally have no idea what skill level is needed to function at the top level as a F1 driver. So if you tell me one driver is better in taking a turn or braking I have no way of distingushing it. All I can appreciate are lap times and final standings.

I do know that MS is deadly under wet conditions.

 

Something has happened once in 400 years so it's always on minds of everyone??? Give it up. A german redneck? You have no clue at all. And why would he try to "knock" jm out? You're shooting in the dark. In Canada I don't think jm could get a license.

 

parkerfe lives where? Georgia.
I guess he may know a thing or two about "dem rednecks".

 

OK, back to the FACTS.

In the past three years combined (2001, 2002, 2003), JPM has the third most driver's point after MS and RB.

Does that count for anything in your book?

In 2002, the year that Ferrari was super dominant, JPM finished in the top 5 in 13 out of the 14 races he completed, with (4) 2nd places.

Does that mean anything to you in terms of consistency?

In 2003, JPM finished in the top 4 in 10 of the 13 races he completed, with 2 wins and (4) second places.

Again, these facts must mean absolutely nothing to you.

Therefore, relying on the facts, which other driver besides MS and RB can you judge to be a better driver than JPM?

 

Enough with this bull shxt hindsight about he shoulda, coulda, woulda crap!

Any F1 driver in position behind the lead car will stay as close as possible, that is a fact!

No bullshxt hypothetical about he should have kept his distance, if he did then you all call him a wooosh for not being aggressive enough.

MS made a move, JPM reacted, there was an incident and that's that. It was a RACING INCIDENT. Shxt happens!

So stop blaming JPM for causing it, he was only reacting to an initial action.

MS knew the game he was playing and pay the price for it.

 

hey Parker, can't help you on that one, you do live in "ahem" ....Georgia

 

PAY ATTENTION! In your post {156} you wrote, and I quote
"JPM's front wheel was even with MS's front wheel"
And in your post {162} you wrote, and I quote
"How can I rear end you if my front wheel is in line with your back wheel?"

In your last 2 posts you clearly state that JM was next to MS. If MS and jm front wheels are next to each other, than one could state that the cars were "side by side". This of course was not the case in said race.
Even if they were side by side, which they were not. Then jm is at fault for trying to pass under caution. You are fighting a losing battle. And I am done trying to explain it to you. Yeah MS has crossed "the line" a few times in his career. He has also been driving for 30 years. So things happen. In 97, he may have "lost it" and turned into JV. He also had to turn the wheel to get through the turn so I will say he "Sennitized" that turn. In Spa with DC, DC was totally at fault. So that is done. Now tell me how many times JM has been under "the microscope". He has had more than his share of convictions from his "dealings" on the track. In only a couple of years in F1. However mean or "foxy" you think MS is, he has never been accused of cheating or endangering lives. Even in 97 in Jerez. As you may recall he was part of the "Grand Prix Drivers Association". I'm sure most F1 drivers think they are the best in the world. Maybe the car or team makes them slow, but they are all the best. If you drive on the edge of physics and you think you are in over your head, look out! Because at any time or point in the race, you may think "O no!" And as soon as that thought crosses your mind, you are done. I have seen many hours of crashes and many many hours of drivers making corrections. There is no time to think, leave alone the possibility of crying to mommy. You are in that car alone, no one can help you ever and "the end" is always near. If MS confidence comes across as cocky, too bad. Kimi seems like an @**hole, but at home I'm sure he's a good guy. It's his way of focusing on th track I guess. Making fun of drivers you don't like and "spinning" words and phrases are just fine, just dandy. But to try and make others belive it, is nutty.

You also say the way they approach the kink, excludes the possibility. Possibliity of what? jm being behind or beside? Because he could do both. I'm not sure what you mean with that.

 

1 No. If you are up his tailpipes, then you aren't warming your own brakes and tires and you are waiting to crash. You can't say you know that somthing is fact when you don't understand it.

As for {jm} "being aggressive enough" He was a GAWD DAMN lap down! He doesn't have to be aggressive, besides they were in for 1 1/2 laps of yellow flags! When was he going to pass?!?!

3 MS didn't "make a move" He locked a wheel, and when it freed up, the car jolted to the side. If jm was BEHIND MS like a normal distance, then nothing would have happened.

4 If jm had enough distance, he wouldn't have to "react" to anything. He could have just slowed down. But I guess he wasn't paying attention to where he was or how fast he was going. And you say MS is dangerous?

5 What "game" he was leading and was "struck from behind" by a lapped car. If MS did this to JM you and the Anti Schumachers would want his head on a stick. Juanny has a very large percentage of the blame here. Michael could have chosen not to warm up in the tunnel, although most drivers if not all do. Too bad for the lock up, he of course did not do it to on purpose {He had nothing to gain from a flat spot, could have even been caused by debris from the wreck}. But if jm was behind AND paying attention, then MS would have looked silly flat spoting his tire and that would be that.
I bet JM gets into more trouble this year than MS from now on. And that is a bet!

 

Even if Frank is as "redneck" as they get, I'm sure he doesn't follow all of those "redneck" joke stereotypes. So making fun of MS for being a "redneck" seems a little odd to me. It almost seems like a redneck would make that joke, not realizing it may apply to him as well. Happy Huntin'.

 

You missed my point, when you are in real world race conditions, you are at a full 100%, you don't take it easy and cruise. That explains why JPM was up MS butt. The F1 drivers are always on the edge pushing as hard as they can....unless you're sleepwalking like RB letting Sato jump you at the start.

How come no one lays blame to RS for causing Alonso's crash? I guess because he's a Schumacher and gets a free pass.