owners Vs non-owners

I can't comment on your question, but I have found that all non-Ferrari enthusiasts are more than excited with this car, while a lot of Ferrari enthusiasts, mainly on this forum, disagree with that.

 

I am not an owner, but there is a 430 owner in my family. I am someone who loves Ferrari, but has yet to be able to order one. I am working on that. I do own a 911. My initial reaction to this car is that it is truly a beautiful work of art just like every other current Ferrari. They are all different in form and function and the California is no different. It serves a different purpose than the F430, 599 and 612 yet IMO is absolutely has a place in the line up and is deserving the badge. That opinion may change when i see it and perhaps drive it one day. If I had the cash on first sight I would order one no doubt.

 

Maybe I don't count because I own a 355.

But, I really dislike the new "California" from several different standpoints.

But again, I don't count because I own what has been proclaimed to be "the best car in the world, ever".

Nevermind that it is a fat, bloated, hideously ugly abomination on the face of a world-class racing and automobile manufacturer.

But this owner does not count.

 

I don't think that this thread was meant to disenfranchise people on the basis of being a buyer/owner.

So everyone counts as you have chosen to put it.

A 355 is a nice car, but you can't really say it is the best car in the world and be taken seriously. It may have been proclaimed as such 10 years ago. 2008 is a much different place.

Don't get me wrong, you are entitled to love your car and to dislike the California.

But like it or not the new generation generally out performs the old. 308<328<348<355<360<F430<California<...?

 

I didn't post Clarkson's quote as a fact.

A little tongue-in-cheek, really.

I know that the performance of the California will likely blow away my 10 year-old car. I would be very disapointed if it didn't.
I mearly stated that, as an owner of a Ferrari, I feel the company has lost its way with this car.
I understand why they are building it, I just don't like how it dilutes the marque.

I am sure this is the same argument the "purists" had when the first non-twelve cylinder cars were proposed and produced.

BTW, the title of the thread is "owners Vs non-owners", so, as an owner, I felt it apt to speak my piece.

-rant over

 

This I will stand by without fail.

 

+1

355 is as pure and experience as there is, IMO. Do not discount yourself for the fact that your car is a decade old, I would take a 355 any day over a California, regardless of performance figures.

My disdain for the California cannot be expressed with language so much as a fart in its general direction.

 

Not a curent owner. I am interested in replacing my SL500 with the California.

I like the California, but it's not really what most people expect from a Ferrari.... It's a Ferrari with more usability but less exotic DNA.

Is it worth spending $250k for a California? I am not sure, maybe it's better to buy a 360 Spider AND a SL55AMG (<$200k)- both beautiful cars, neither have identity crisis.

 

How in the heck is this car diluting the mark? If anything it is adding value to it. Sure if they cam out with a 60k Ferrari you might have a point. If they build an F car sedan at 80k or something you might have a point. They built a new front engine V8 with a retractable top that people can actually use. It is still a 140k+ car and has allowed the F4XX to move even further up the price chain. this car is not and will not dilute the brand.

 

Your answer right here:

Is this where Ferrari is going?

Downmarket (at an admittedly higher price point, a la DB9) to compete with the Merc SL and Lexus SC?

I have nothing against either car (SL, SC), I just think that to compete in this market dilutes the marque. Then we will see sedans and SUV's, not to mention a (gasp) Hybrid!!!

 

OK, let's get a little perspective here, shall we? When Porsche went from air-cooled to water cooled 911's, people went nuts debating it and decide that it was the end of mankind as we knew it (that included ME, by the way). It would destroy the brand.

It didn't.

Then when the Cayenne came out, EVERYONE said it would dilute the brand and how could a sports car company as pure as Porsche do this to themselves and to their loyal fan base. It was going to destroy the brand!

Fast forward a few years.....Porsche is the most profitable independent auto manufacturer on the planet, and they are still able to sell every single 911 they build. The Cayenne has ADDED to their profitability and exposure, and has not in any way diluted the brand...if anything it's brought more folks into the Porsche fold that might not have otherwise gone there. And it did not devalue the 911 or the brand at all. And they sell fewer specialty cars (GT3, GT3RS, GT2) COMBINED than Ferrari sells in one year of F430 production....and that doesn't make them any more or less special than Ferrari or vice versa. One could argue that Ferrari is already over-exposed due to the large number of F430's it manufactures and sells. Yet they manage to sell cars with fractionally better performance than a GT3/GT3RS for TWICE the amount of money even though Porsche makes only a relative handful of those cars vs the thousands of F430's in the world. The mystique will be there as long as Ferrari wins races on Sunday's. Ferrari knows what they are doing. They have shown a knack over the last ten years for business and marketing on a global scale. Don't count them out because they want to market what they have admitted is a car targeted at women. Hell, why shouldn't they. Last time I checked there were more women in the world than men. Why let MB catch them all with SLK's?

Let's face it, the world is a different place than it was when Enzo ruled the sports car world. I love the fact that he only built road cars to finance his racing, but he also had to sell half the firm to Fiat at one point to stay in business. Yet another thing that was going to destroy the marque as I recall. Expanding the brand is something that any company must do to stay in business in this global economy. Get over it. Be happy that they are trying to secure their future by expanding their line-up. That will give them more profit to spend on product development and hopefully give us better, faster, lighter, more agile cars as a result.

OK, I'm done. You are now being returned to the seemingly endless debate about how the California will impact Ferrari. Carry on.

 

Exactly. At the end of the day no matter what it is a business, and that business is accountable to shareholders. This is a very different day and age.

 

I respect your point of view, but I fail to see how selling a Ferrari version of the SL for a quarter million dollars will dilute the marque. The car serve similar purpose as the SL/SC but it's hardly in the same price range or in terms of production number. By the same token you wouldn't compare a F430 to a lotus Elise.

I loved Ferrari all my life and this is the first time I think they have made a car that's actually feasible to take up a space in my garage. Sure I could buy a 360CS, but it'll end up being a garage queen with 1000miles on the odometer every year. No one in their right mind would drive the Enzo anywhere other than a car show or service. For the same money the F430 spider is a nice car but it looks 'disturbing' with the top up - it's also a 8 cylinder. The 612 makes little sense next to the Maserati QP, and I find it hard to argue the 599GTB looks much better than the California. Now the California I can take family and friends for a nice cruise down PCH and close the top on the way home at night.

I am not so wealthy that I'd take a F430 Spider to a track and road race the heck out of it, so what does it matter the California is 'soft' compared to other Ferraris. I would have more fun tossing an used S2000 around corners sideways than say a $300k 599GTB. I am pretty sure the California will be faster around most tracks compared to the bread-slice styled 612, and I don't hear anyone complaining the 612 diluting Ferrari brand.

 

I first had an SLK AMG (or was it my wife's?) which was a great concept but a very wishy washy car to drive - it had to go. Then a Porsche 911 C4S which was boring, then a Maserati Gransport which converted me to the passion of an italian porn car and now I'm as 'bout as contented as I've ever been with a 430 spider and a 599. Will I buy a California? As each day passes I think I might. How often does a new car turn up and you think nah! In 6 months time it will be just another member of the 'happy family' - trust me.

 

I like it very much......just like every other Ferrari past/present. Except MY 355...I love it!!

Good for Ferrari for expanding their horizons and looking at the big picture.