parking brake caliper to compliment big brake conversion

Discussion in '308/328' started by wildegroot, Jun 22, 2008.

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  1. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    #1 wildegroot, Jun 22, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Hello fellow 308 hot-rodders!

    About two years ago I posted on this board about various modifications/up-grades I had made to my 1978 308GTB. One of the mods was to install bigger Brembo brakes[link]http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=45920[/link] but as a few other f-chatters have noted, once you do that you loose your parking brakes. I ,and others, searched but could not come up with anything for sale that fit the bill. Only one solution, I decided, make them! It took me a while (spare time: what a concept) but I finally buckled down and finished them last week.

    A few pictures of the machined billet aluminum parking brake calipers I just finished making and installing on my 308. The calipers bolt right to the original mounting ears on the suspension up-rights, accept the stock cables with no alterations and work! The Brembo calipers were earlier bolted to the extra set of caliper mounting ears on the front sides of the uprights which required minor machining operations like facing, drilling and tapping. The calipers shown are on 12" diameter, 26mm thick, vented rotors but a few minor changes to the design would allow them to fit virtually any size rotor that anyone could graft onto a 308, 328 or Mondial as long as the wheels are sized to match. I have 17" wheels because anything larger starts to look too big for such a relatively small car but that's just my opinion.

    Pictures and descriptions of other work done on this 308 can be found at....

    Photo descriptions:

    1) Left parking brake calper on 12" rotor behind 17" wheel.

    2) Right parking brake caliper without wheel and before connecting cable.

    3,4) Left parking brake caliper before mounting (with a set of used, stock 308, rear brake pads installed).

    5,6) Shots of the car at the Reading Ferrari Concours, in the rain.

    7) All 4 caliper halves were carved from this billet (or what's left of it).

    8) Left parking brake caliper shot from under car. Stock actuating cable connected without modifications.

    Other things I want for this car: Lightweight rear deck lid, lightweight front deck lid with large ducted radiator outlet, Strut tower rods, better AC. If someone doesn't supply these parts soon I'll have to make them too.

    Wil
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  2. regisgtb4

    regisgtb4 Formula Junior
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    Nice tools and the Car is bad ass.
     
  3. Mark 308 gt4

    Mark 308 gt4 Formula Junior

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    Fantastic job,
    Well done!

    Mark
     
  4. blu328gts

    blu328gts Formula 3
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    WOW! Very nicely done, Wil!! Where do we sign up? :)
     
  5. bill brooks

    bill brooks F1 Rookie
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    i can see you have copious quantities of greenbacks to burn.
    but... you have a bellisimo ride none the less !
     
  6. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Thank you for the compliment. If you mean, can you buy it, the answer is: not like this. The calipers on my car are completely hand machined (no CNC) and much too labor intensive to make for sale but if there is significant interest I'll look into having some made at a CNC machine shop.
     
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  8. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Thanks for the "bellisimo". Nothing Ferrari is cheap but I didn't spend as much as you might think. The Brembo calipers and the rotors are from a Porsche 996 and I bought them from a salvage yard. I made the aluminum rotor hats, the Brembo caliper mounts, the parking brake calipers, the master cylinder mounts, the intake manifold, the exhaust system, and many other parts. It cost more labor than money really and I don't have to pay myself.
     
  9. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

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    #8 chrismorse, Jun 23, 2008
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
    Will,

    I remember a post long ago about where you said, "maybe i will have to make it" and i thought yah, that would be great, but how many guys really follow through like this??? Verell, MikE, (the crazy guy), Scott and you. This is some amazing fabrication.

    So, tell us about what master cylinder you installed and what was required to make it work.

    What rotor diameters thickness and caliper piston sizes??

    How did you deal with the proportioning issue?

    Does the parking brake really hold??? How is the internal mechanism different from the stock ATE p brake?? It looks close.

    I am dying to know the details, i struggled through a big brake developement, with used calipers, (6), with Martin@Girodisc's massive help and a local CNC machinist of great patience.

    I gotsta know,
    chris

    And last but not least, how does it stop????
     
  10. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

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    PS.

    The car really looks good too :)

    chris
     
  11. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    #10 wildegroot, Jun 23, 2008
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2008
    It was a lot of machining time and a lot of figuring out time before-hand and I started and stopped on the parking brakes several times when other priorities intervened but I finally finished them. They work just as well as the original ATE parking brakes because they basically still are. What I did was to disassemble the old rear calipers, which included the integral parking brake, and eliminated all the parts and sections that did not contribute to the parking brake function. I then reverse engineered the parts from the old iron calipers that I wanted to keep and designed new, smaller and lighter housings to accept the parts that served as parking brakes. I also extended the mounting ears and increased the width to accommodate the bigger rotors.

    The Brembo service brakes have been on the car for about 2 years already and I've posted about them before. I had to go digging in a file to find the specs and figured out that I lied in an above post.

    The front and rear calipers are from a Porsche 993 Turbo. The front piston sizes are: 2 X 36mm and 2 X 44mm. The rear piston sizes are 4 X 28mm. I machined the mounts for the calipers out of 6061 aluminum billet. The front calipers are radial mount. The rear calipers were ear mount which I converted to radial mount by re-machining them. The calipers were painted with urethane enamel after sanding off the Porsche logos.

    The 4 rotors are all front 993 Porsche Turbo. The diameter is about 12" (305mm) X 1.250" (32mm). Rotor mounting hats were machined from 6061 aluminum billet.

    The car has a Tilton tandem master cylinder setup with remote cable brake bias adjustment. There is no proportioning valve and no booster. The master cylinders are both 5/8" (16mm) inside diameter.

    Brake hoses are Goodrich stainless braided.

    The car stops well but it requires a bit of leg force since the tunable tandem MC set-up forced the elimination of the vacuum brake booster. I'm running the stock Porsche brake pads and I'm looking for something softer. I don't care If they wear quickly. The car doesn't get that many miles on it anyway.
     
  12. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Thank you, Wil
     
  13. Protouring442

    Protouring442 F1 Veteran
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    #12 Protouring442, Jun 24, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Interesting and well thought out! Oh, and the car looks beautiful!

    I am building a rather more mundane vehicle, a 1972 Oldsmobile 442, in a Grand Touring style. Sort of an American muscle car meets 1980something BMW M6. In any case, I will be using the C-6 Corvette Z06 calipers and rotors (6 piston front, 4 piston rear). I was thinking of using a CNC (the company) dual master cylinder setup but adapting to a vacuum booster. I don't know if this sort of setup might help you as I would think you have a bit less under hood room than I do, but I thought I would send this your way in case it might.

    Shiny Side Up!
    Bill

    Here's a pic of the setup:
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  15. regisgtb4

    regisgtb4 Formula Junior
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    Like to see your induction set up,intake manifolds,etc. I see in your profile your a pro and those park brake calipers are totally pro.Any chance you have some photos of the brake caliper brackets? Thanks for you and fchat.
     
  16. BigTex

    BigTex Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Very very nice, glad to see you went boldly where others fear to tread!

    Looks pretty, too!
     
  17. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Go to this old post:

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101045

    Page 2 has photos and description of a similar tandem master cylinder set up. Either way there's no room for a brake booster.

    Wish you luck with your project.

    Wil
     
  18. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Go to this old post:

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101045

    I don't have photos of the brake caliper mounting brackets but I'll take some next time the car is on the lift.

    Wil
     
  19. pad

    pad Formula 3

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    #17 pad, Jun 24, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Wil, FWIW, I'm using 1 1/8" master for the front and 1" for the rear. Very little brake pressure / movement to bring the car down at speed.
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  20. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Hi Paul,

    I wasn't complaining about the pedal pressure, just noting that it takes more pressure to stop without a vacuum assisted booster. The car stops fine. I have twin 5/8" diameter master cylinders and would like to try softer pads to reduce pedal pressure more. I can't imagine your pedal pressure isn't greater without a booster unless you've already found a softer brake pad material.

    Did you get your car back together?
     
  21. Birdman

    Birdman F1 Veteran
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    That 308 is one mean lookin' ride! Nice work on those e-brake calipers!
     
  22. pad

    pad Formula 3

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    Wil,

    I got the car back together late last summer and ran Watkins Glen and Pocono in the fall. Will be up at LimeRock this July. Also, been gathering parts to boost the engine this winter.
     
  23. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Cool!
     
  24. Protouring442

    Protouring442 F1 Veteran
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    Well, in any case you have one nice ride there! The work you have done is beautiful, and the detail is magnificent! If you are ever bringing it to a show anywhere near the MD/DC area, please let me know as I would love to see the car in person!

    Shiny Side Up!
    Bill
     
  25. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    Thanks I will.
     
  26. regisgtb4

    regisgtb4 Formula Junior
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    That is pure Factory Tradition.
     
  27. wildegroot

    wildegroot Formula 3
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    ????
     

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