Penske to buy Mercedes ? | Page 3 | FerrariChat

Penske to buy Mercedes ?

Discussion in 'F1' started by Mitch Alsup, Nov 15, 2019.

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  1. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jun 3, 2006
    25,549

    You may be right.
    You may not have to make profits but there is something in English law that prohibits companies to present a balance deficit for more than 3 years.
     
  2. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Bernie Ecclestone wouldn't be surprised if "Mercedes stopped" ahead of 2021

    http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/702214/Bernie_Ecclestone_wouldnt_be_surprised_if_Mercedes_stopped_ahead_of_2021/

    Bernie Ecclestone says he "wouldn't be surprised if Mercedes stopped" after the 2020 F1 season.
    Ahead of the Brazilian Grand Prix, Ecclestone told The Daily Mail his opinion on Hamilton's future within Formula 1. He also suggested that Mercedes might leave the sport, adding to Toto Wolff's comments earlier in the week. The boss of the Silver Arrows said "it's not a given" that Mercedes will continue to race in F1.

    "I wouldn't be surprised if Mercedes stopped. There has been change at the top and the new people are not so enthusiastic about Formula One as the old people used to be. They might think we have won seven world championships — which they will have done by the end of next year — so why stay?" the 89-year-old said.
     
  3. blkfxstc

    blkfxstc Formula Junior
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    Eric
    Mercedes can’t stop, Lewis needs 8 titles...
     
  4. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran

    Oct 13, 2001
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    Mark
    There you have it......This is how Lewis moves to Ferrari for his eight title and ends Ferrari’s long drought ;)
     
  5. Jack-the-lad

    Jack-the-lad Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Jun 22, 2004
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    Moot Pointe
    Nobody is irreplaceable. Mark was a brilliant engineer and a great driver but Penske would have been Penske, regardless. The greatest asset Mark brought, I think, was his utter compatibility with Penske.
     
    pilotoCS and 375+ like this.
  6. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
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    Brian Crall
    They were a team in every sense. Roger however has a great gift as a leader in his ability to find and recruit great talent. He chose a desert racer to drive his Indy cars to the chagrin of many. He said "I picked Rick because he knows how to win". Rick Mears became the 3rd and last man to win Indy 4 times.
     
    Jack-the-lad, william and 375+ like this.
  7. #57 lorenzobandini, Nov 17, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2019
    PD was not discussing losses (your "balance deficit"); 'just your not profiting (break-even), for which I believe he is correct.
     
    Patrick Dixon and william like this.
  8. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Mark Donohue filled up 2 roles: he was a competent hands-on development engineer in the workshop and a brillant test driver on the track.
    People like him are hard to find in the motor racing industry.
     
    Rifledriver likes this.
  9. Simon^2

    Simon^2 F1 World Champ

    Oct 17, 2005
    12,313
    At Sea Level
    And Bernie states publicly that the 2020 WCC is already over...
     
  10. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I think Bernie just says that to spur the opposition.

    I have serious doubts about Mercedes and Hamilton repeating their success in 2020.

    The cracks in their domination have started to appear this year.

    I don't think 2020 will be a walk in the park for them.
     
  11. #61 lorenzobandini, Nov 17, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2019
    Indeed. However, we lost another very successful, great, ex-Penske man, just a decade later; Al Holbert. :(

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  12. johnireland

    johnireland F1 Veteran
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    Mar 19, 2017
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    John A Ireland
    How do you explain that the Mercedes-AMG F1 team declared a profit last year again?
    They have to balance the books to provide a dividend to their shareholders (MB, Toto Wolffe, the Lauda family and and a few others).
    Being registered as a British company, they can not fail to declare a profit for more than 3 years under Company Law.[/QUOTE]

    It's called cooking the books. And all the teams do it to one extent or another.
     
  13. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Al Holbert drove for Penske ? First I have heard of that.

    I thought he had his own team racing Porsche.

    Did I miss something ?
     
  14. #64 lorenzobandini, Nov 17, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2019
    No, he did not. Where did you hear trhat? ;)

    He did, and a bunch more, following in Penske's footsteps, being meticulous. (Sorrowfully, not in his last flight from Ohio back to Pennsylvania. :()

    Yes you missed something...Al worked for Rogere before going his own way.

    William - 'PMing....errr....'Conversationing....you.
     
  15. TurboFreak650

    TurboFreak650 Formula 3

    Jul 10, 2004
    2,365
    Atlanta, GA
    I'd rather see them buy ANYONE other than Mercedes. Mercedes need to be dethroned for a while....
     
  16. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Why ? Penske has already worked successfully with Mercedes in the past.
    He seems to like efficient partners, like Porsche too.
     
  17. TurboFreak650

    TurboFreak650 Formula 3

    Jul 10, 2004
    2,365
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    Do you want to see the same team dominate F1 for ~13 years in a row like Audi did at Le Mans? I don't even want to see Ferrari unchallenged. Bad for the sport.

    I'd rather see Penske buy Williams and make them Champions again.
     
  18. Awesome isn't it?

    Penske has his Indy 500 dynasty and Merc has it's F1 one (I won't leave out Audi's in endurance racing...).

    And a bonus.....we are privileged to be living in the times of, and witnessing, this historic excellence.

    Fantastico!!! Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
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  19. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I don't like the mentality that blames a repeat winner and tries to undermine its success.
    As long as a team does a better job, it is entitled to win, in my book.
    I had no problem with Audi winning year after year at Le Mans; the others couldn't catch up.
     
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  20. If that's the result of the aforementioned excellence, yes. ;)

    Watching and waiting for someone to knock them off the thrown is the suspense. :)

    (If "real" (close) racing is such a necessity, that series already exists. It's called IndyCar)
     
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  21. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    If F1 was racing on ovals, it would see close racing too.

    Close racing is determined by the type of track, not by the formula.
     
  22. Au contraire, Mssr.

    Ala the Sylvester vs the Kangaroo episode..."Oh father, I'm so ashamed...". Check the IndyCar schedule, kind sir; 12 road courses and a whopping 4 ovals.
    https://www.indycar.com/News/2019/09/09-01-Cavin-Schedule-2020?sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirg5Od1fLlAhXcCTQIHVplDcIQ9QF6BAgLEAI

    IndyCar is such "real" (not; close is more accurate) racing because all the chassis and bodies are the same. A whole 2 engine options. In other words, spec racing.

    But surprise surprise, the cream still rises to the top and there are still three teams that dominate. ;)
     
  23. My goodness. I stand corrected.
    Five ovals.
    For shame, for shame. :oops:

    :)
     
  24. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I said "ovals", with no mention of road courses on the Indy schedule.

    On ovals, cars tend to stay together in a bunch, so you have close racing, but the field inevitably spreads on a road circuit.
     
  25. #75 lorenzobandini, Nov 18, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
    Oooohhhh Grasshopper......so much too learn. ;)

    Below, I've taken seasons and races a decade apart, to illustrate the fact that it is not the circuit that makes the racing "real" (again...bs...close...)(and of course they're even "realer" (closer) on ovals where there's less driver discrepancy (skill) involved), but, rather, the "spec" race cars that are employed.

    The following links, season results and the most famous oval race (Indy 500) results, illustrate the change in racing from real racing to "real" (again, tsk-tsk, close) racing when Indy car racing (CART, 1979, 1989) made use of semi (IRL,1999) and spec cars (IndyCar 2009, 2019) as opposed to earlier.

    Note the discrepancy of the closeness of the championship points, and, the closeness of the finishes in the 500 (and if you do more research, all the other races, road courses included) between the years when teams had choices and when not.

    REAL racing was the display of car AND driver excellence; NOT just a great "show".

    If this vehicle "parity" is perfected, all cars exactly equal, and a driver emerges dominant (ala, let's say Fangio, Clark, Foyt, Andretti, Senna, Schumacher, or Hamilton) and doesn't allow "real" (close) racing....what then for THE show?

    BoP them?
    Ooooopppsss. No, that would not be parity of car....

    Tell them to "slow down"? ....No?

    Literally script the races period?....No?

    Then....exactly what?

    When it gets to that point for the ignorant (no, I did not say stupid), and short attention span, masses, as I've said before, let's REAL (literal) race fans just go to the movies........:(



    Remember, 2009 and 2019 were the mandatory spec racers; 1999, semi-spec; prior, not spec at all (HOORAY!)...
    Also note, the Indianapolis Motor Speedway did not transition from road course to oval in the transitioning years of non to spec racers.....it's always been an oval. ;)

    2019 (spec)
    http://www.champcarstats.com/year/2019.htm
    http://www.champcarstats.com/races/201906.htm

    2009 (spec)
    http://www.champcarstats.com/year/2009.htm
    http://www.champcarstats.com/races/200904.htm

    1999 (semi-spec)
    http://www.champcarstats.com/year/1999i.htm
    http://www.champcarstats.com/races/1999i03.htm

    1989 (NOT...HOORAY!!!)
    http://www.champcarstats.com/year/1989.htm
    http://www.champcarstats.com/races/198903.htm

    1979 (not)
    http://www.champcarstats.com/year/1979.htm
    http://www.champcarstats.com/races/197904-u3.htm

    Enuff? 'Make my point? If 'still not convinced, you can do the rest of the research yourself.... :p

    Back to F1.... If "semi" scripting of the venue becomes the norm. It will no longer be what it was intended to be; the pinnacle of automobile racing. The (once again) exhibit of the very best of ALL of the sport of auto racing, displaying their skills untethered.

    Which is why I suggest, and hope, that those that just want "real" (close) open wheel racing enjoy IndyCar rather than expect F1 to lower it's bar.

    I'm done. :)
     

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