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Discussion in '360/430' started by poyta, Mar 29, 2004.
Anyone know the performance times of the 360 Modena compared to the Stradale?
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I'd be curious to know the 100mph to zero stopping distances between the two. The disposable supplies for the stadale system are more than the cost of other people's new cars! I wonder if the $30k brake job can really stop you that much faster.
Independent reviewers confirm the Stradale's deceleration is 15% greater than the 360. However, this is also dependent on the softer rubber. Manu and co in Egham are helping me fit Stradale wheels and tyres to my spider. I can then post the difference that the rubber makes.
As for the difference the CCM makes - I'm still saving for a CS!!
It's 2 sec faster than the 360 around Fiorano. It uses P Zero Corsa and it's not that much different from the P Zero tyres. It's the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup that's the stickier tyres. Wonder why Ferrari doesn't offer that.
Two of my friends had theirs already and they're raving over the CS. And they were 360 owners, so I believe them.
but are they (performance difference) noticebly different in real world non track day usage?
Actually, this is TOTALLY dependent on the stickier rubber. Carbon brakes hold no advantage over iron with the same tires when testing just one stop (fade not an issue). The limiting factor is tire traction for any single stop. On the track where fade becomes an issue the carbon may have an advantage, if you can stomach the cost of replacement pads and rotors. There are a lot of Porsche GT2 and GT3 owners paying to swap out the ceramic brakes for iron.
True; though the bigger brakes can also benefit you in better modulation and control in threshold braking; and as you up the forces via better rubber, that becomes more important.
True; but the Porsche PCCB's seem to be fairly defective for track use; in contrast, the Stradale brakes seem to be proving themselves so far. Let's hope they indeed live up to their billing... unlike the PCCBs.
In this day of very effective anti-lock brakes, how important is this?
I hope so, too. It does appear there are some significant differences between the PCCB system and the Ferrari carbons. Replacement costs are still gonna be high on the Stradale, though...have you priced pads?
Via discussions with Brembo UK they are looking to put a kit together than will replicate the caliper / disc size of the CS with a steel disc. These obviously require the larger wheels - once I have got these fitted with the larger, stickier rubber I will then look to the brake upgrade and revert.
What about the benefits of the weight savings of the carbon fibre brakes regarding ride quaility and handeling??
Ferrari actually say it's 3.5 secs faster around Fiorano.
Until ABS kicks in and destroys your feel for the threshold.
In threshold braking you are trying to hold the tires at 7% slip* with respect ot the road surface passing under the contact patch (Miliken and Miliken "Race car vehicle dynamics"). This is past the point that ABS want/needs to intervene to save your butt if you are not trying to threshold brake.
*point of maximum traction in the decelerational sense.
Through personal usage I agree fully.
I have attached CS wheels and tyres - the lower profile/stickier rubber gives a dicernable increase in "bite" even when using on the road.
Increased brake discs and calipers to go but the improvement already has made the process worth it anyway!
Actually, besides the stickier tires, there is also the increased downforce to consider. Won't matter when braking from 50-0; but from 100-50, the added downforce will definitely improving braking effectiveness... and on the track 130-100 will have even more effect from downforce. Its amazing the size of that wing they managed to stick under the rear of the Stradale!
As for the CCMs effect, another effect, not mentioned above, comes into play on real-life roads (more so than the track)... their light weight substantially reduces the unsprung weight, which means over bumpy surfaces the tires will tend to stay in contact with the road better. And that of course will greatly improve stopping distances when stopping on a bumpy surface.