Pista- Dead Lithium Battery Solution | FerrariChat

Pista- Dead Lithium Battery Solution

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by gthompson, May 10, 2024.

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  1. gthompson

    gthompson Rookie

    Apr 15, 2008
    17
    Dallas, Texas
    Full Name:
    George Thompson
    Last week, I found a solution to my dead lithium battery in my Pista. I found a lithium battery expert in Florida that could refurbish my current lithium battery manufactured by A123 Systems. Andy was able to replace all of the lithium cells in my current battery with the exact same cells that A123 uses while leaving all of the proprietary Ferrari electronics in the top of the battery. I just received the battery back from him and I am going to install it this Sunday.
     
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  2. Mrpseudonym

    Mrpseudonym Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 7, 2020
    448
    Sydney, Australia
    This is pretty awesome. This guy could make a fortune refurbishing McLaren batteries too. They are more expensive than the ferrari ones, and in every Mclaren..
     
  3. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Aug 25, 2004
    5,418
    Dallas Texas
    Full Name:
    If you know you know
    How much?
    What’s the warranty?
    What’s the turn around time?
    Asking for a friend…..

    S
     
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  4. Nsd991

    Nsd991 Formula Junior

    Jul 19, 2012
    496
    Thanks for sharing
     
  5. Thecadster

    Thecadster F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 27, 2017
    6,769
    Looks like a solid solution. Any concerns about the combustible nature of lithium batteries? Any margin for error with respect to installing the new batteries in the old housing?
     
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  6. Gooey

    Gooey Karting

    Jul 28, 2018
    59
    Full Name:
    Gooey
    This is great
    Did you install?
    Do you contact for Andy?
     
  7. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed Silver Subscribed

    May 23, 2013
    11,143
    AUSTRALIA
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    ANGELO
    Not to crap on anyones parade. But this is ballsy given Lithium batteries like to catch on fire. I wonder what Ferrari would say. That is if a claim were to arise ?
     
  8. Bkclients

    Bkclients Karting

    Nov 30, 2010
    112
    Should a claim arise it might alert Ferrari to start using batteries which actually last, all jokes aside and knowing that would never happen, swapping batteries every 2-5 years or less on the Pista for around $8k is certainly not fun.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
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  9. Pat488

    Pat488 Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 4, 2023
    102
    Melbourne, Australia
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    Pat
    The factory electronics within the battery will protect the cells, and hence the battery from fire.....as long as they're not the part that has failed!
     
  10. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed Silver Subscribed

    May 23, 2013
    11,143
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    ANGELO

    Certainly not fun what so ever how 488 GTB full factory warrantee and my battery was changed and upgraded free of charge.
     
  11. popsmuf

    popsmuf Karting

    Jun 20, 2006
    141
    SoCal
    Curious to hear how much this is
     
  12. gthompson

    gthompson Rookie

    Apr 15, 2008
    17
    Dallas, Texas
    Full Name:
    George Thompson
    Sorry for the delay in responding
    I am installing the battery this weekend; I did not have a chance to install it last weekend
    To answer a few of the questions posted here since my original post

    1. My understanding is that the lithium battery used was the exact same as A123 uses
    I asked about the fire issue based on stories like hoverboards exploding and/or catching on fire. What I was told was that the lithium ion battery is very stable, it's the lithium phosphorus that is unstable and catches fire and since all the electronics in the battery are untouched and the lithium cells were just replaced

    2. Andy is ordering addition lithium components, he mentioned a 2 month turn around, once he gets all the supplies in, my guess is that the turnaround will be faster

    3. I paid $1995 for the refurbishment

    4. I did not ask about a warranty

    5. This refurbished battery should last 8 years, even though my Pista is a 2020, I thought the battery only lasted 4 years, but if you look at my pictures, the battery is stamped 2016, so it appears that the original battery did last 8 years.

    6. I removed the battery and will reinstall it myself, there is a lot to remove to get the battery out, my advice is to take pictures because I am having trouble remembering where all the parts go back in Lol There is a chance that I will have left over parts. Lol

    Let me know if I missed anything or have any other questions
     
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  13. Pat488

    Pat488 Karting
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    Sep 4, 2023
    102
    Melbourne, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pat
    The cells used are Lithium Iron Phosphate, or LiFePO4 and that chemistry is safe and stable. It is not the same chemistry as is used in most EV’s, E-Bikes, phones etc. They use Nickel Manganese Cobolt, or NMC chemistry and it are those cells that like to catch fire.

    At a refurbishment cost of $2k, it is well worth it.
     
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  14. Art138

    Art138 Formula 3
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 22, 2007
    1,495
    Ft. Lauderdale
    Does the car need a software reboot given that the OEM battery was removed while getting refurbished (lapse of time not connected to the system)?. Also,if all is good, please share the shop contact info.
     
  15. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,625
    socal
    Why does the battery need to be lithium? A battery is just storage. How does the car know the electrons are lithium derived?
     
  16. MANDALAY

    MANDALAY F1 World Champ
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    May 23, 2013
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    Spot on , best question. It doesnt however the Standard batter has a wire tap to the battery and obviously the battery needs it connected.

    As an investor I wouldn't invest in changing the cells I would be looking at the electronics so any battery could be added. I dare say Ferrari and Mclaren really wanted to screw their customers.
     
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  17. Pat488

    Pat488 Karting
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    Sep 4, 2023
    102
    Melbourne, Australia
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    Pat
    There are significant benefits to lithium batteries over lead acid. Transitioning over to lithium started batteries is a wise choice for these types of cars, but I agree, at the price they're asking for them......Yes, Ferrari and McLaren want to screw their customers.
     
  18. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,625
    socal
    I see no benefits in auto applications on ice. I also see negligible benefits to battery management systems. Bmw for example has used this for years. You change a battery and you need the tool to synch the new battery to the car. Reality is BS. You Don need to do it and battery performance and car performance don't suffer in the least. I assume ferrari now has a battery management system but they all work on same simple concept.
     
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  19. gthompson

    gthompson Rookie

    Apr 15, 2008
    17
    Dallas, Texas
    Full Name:
    George Thompson
    Thank you for clarifying the whole lithium chemistry breakdown, I am not an expert in lithium, but I was told that this battery was very stable and safe
     
    Pat488 likes this.
  20. gthompson

    gthompson Rookie

    Apr 15, 2008
    17
    Dallas, Texas
    Full Name:
    George Thompson
    I asked the same question
    The issue is since this A123 battery is no longer available and if it was available, Ferrari charges $7,000

    The only alternative at this point, is to convert to lead acid, which cost $7250

    One of the issues with the conversion is the charger needs to be replaced from lithium to lead acid and the magnetic connector has a reverse polarity
    The conversion includes the new charger and battery as well as the wiring change for the lead acid battery
     
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  21. gthompson

    gthompson Rookie

    Apr 15, 2008
    17
    Dallas, Texas
    Full Name:
    George Thompson
    I was told that when the lithium battery is changed out with the refurbished battery, I will need to drive the car for 20-30 minutes then plug the charger in for 6-8 hours for the car to "learn" about the new battery
     
  22. daleleemartin

    daleleemartin Rookie

    Wednesday
    1
    #23 daleleemartin, May 15, 2024 at 11:11 AM
    Last edited by a moderator: May 15, 2024 at 11:17 AM
    Can you please give us Andy’s contact info
     
  23. sfcarguy

    sfcarguy Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Mar 9, 2018
    341
    Earth
    Installing a lead acid battery, reprogramming, and buying a different CTEK charger with a Pista specific adapter (which I can make for anyone interested) is not $7250. Ferrari's don't have on battery BMS so it's just a question of reprogramming the DME for a different charging profile.

    Once could also just install one of the easily available Lithium batteries from the likes of Antigravity and Braille.
     
  24. sfcarguy

    sfcarguy Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Mar 9, 2018
    341
    Earth
    correction: lead acid equipped Ferrari's don't have on battery BMS
     

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