Pista or Refresh

And the certainty that they are going to increase volumes is a figment of yours. You don't have a damn clue WHAT they are going to do.

 

It doesn't matter whether I have a clue about volumes when Ferrari themselves are telling the world it is increasing:

Ferrari Capital Markets Day Sep 2018, CFO presentation, slide 8

Relative to the 2017 the approx doubling in profits is driven 50% by volume and 50% by price increase & product mix, excluding R&D, industrialisation, sales, general admin and FX changes. That would point to a plan of c13,000 in 2022 (vs 8400 in 2017, and 9250 in 2018). If you are still imagining your 10k production cap, sweet dreams.

 

The RACE bank analyst coverage I follow has a consensus of approximately 12500 units for 2022. The biggest driver of variance is the ramp up of the SUV.

The big question is how this would affect the brand and the customer. Historically, Ferrari has doubled production in a 10 year time frame a few times and then cut back during recessions, without obvious ill effects on the perception of the brand. So a 25% increase from here is not automatically dilutive to the brand value. On the other hand, a recession would very probably result in a downward adjustment. However, when combined with substantially higher unit prices, increased volumes will probably significantly impact depreciation.

 

Is an F8 wearing a racing stripe, 9/10ths the Pista?

 

The annual report addresses this, and states the increase in production might devalue the collectivity of the brand. I was a little amazed at what all was disclosed in the ~300 page annual.

 

If Ferrari makes 2500 SUVs to get to 12,500 cars as you guys say I don’t see that affecting SPORTS CAR used car values at all,

Put another way, those are entirely different customer bases.

 

The SUV is planned to launch in 2022, so a source of variance around the analyst volume consensus is the 2022 SUV shipments, usually a small number in the first year of a new model. But the majority of the volume growth to 2022 is non-SUV.

 

They'd have to produce more like 5000 SUVs, no? FF/Lusso sales will plummet because who would buy one compared to an SUV?

 

F8 :Inconel check,titanium check, and a few other tasty bits n pieces.

 

Agree. They aren't over delivering from what i can see. Under delivering is more likely. One things for sure everyone still wants one.

 

So it looks like its 100% the same engine and exhaust ? Hence comments sound better. Therefor the other weight savings to the PISTA weight would be more carbon, less or no sound deadening , no carpets and probably alcantara weighs less than leather.

Oh the F8 do have these , rear flux deflectors Too funny

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Yes, at 8/10ths the price or less.Not as sharp on the track but equal or maybe even better on the street.

 

I

i think just depends on how the car is specced, if like for like, then it may be more expensive than the pista, without the “specialness”. But if min spec on the f8, then it is great value cos there will be substantiate savings.
This will be like comparing the 911r to the gt3 touring, at the end of the day, the r will hold its value better. But if the f8 is the finale, hmm, then it’s production numbers may well be less or similar to the pista. That would make it interesting....

 

Looks like the F8 might have adaptive cruise control or something.

The shadowed area between the sunvisors there is a clear section.

 

I believe the Challenge race cars have different engine mapping and shorter gear ratios than the 488.Don't know if Pista also got those,but most likely. F8 probably not .

 

Be keen to hear what the motoring journos have to say about F8 vs Pista re the way they drive and which is the better.

 

Adaptive cruise control would need radar at the front grille, which I didn't notice anything, nor would there be sufficient space to include. I mentioned the trapezoid between the visors, and this will likely be for a camera for a lane departure mitigation system. Not sure if it'll be active or passive, but I would guess more passive/alerts, unless the F8 will use electronic steering like the 812 and Portofino.

 

Agreed.F8 will have a big task to topple the Pista! https://www.topgear.com/videos/chris-harris-drives/chris-harris-drives-ferrari-488-pista

 

From talking with dealer this is precisely the difference. Was told the Pista got "the challenge engine " and the F8 got an "advanced version of the 488 engine" (I assume this deals with the mapping, gear ratios and some internals).

This is what was repeated to me from someone who SHOULD know. Me? I have no idea if this is correct or not.

 

The "Challenge engine" is itself actually "an advanced version of the 488 engine", so that does not tell much...
However it seems likely to me that the work on the Pista's engine is closer to the work on the Challenge's one, with more expensive and racing focussed solutions - because the Pista has been developed with a more "money-no-object" approach, which is reflected in its pricing.
Even in the disclosed figures the Pista's engine has better performance (same power but max torque at lower rev) and it may be more responsive by the use of lighter materials.
Whether it's true or how noticeable it will be for average drivers I can't tell.

 

OP, Has your brother in-law decided yet?

Is he going to keep it for a while or enjoy it and sell it quickly? Keep the F8, enjoy the Pista

 

4700???????
Where on earth did you hear that? That's not even physically possible. It's in the 2500 range.

 

It's a shame they are only flux deflectors and not flux capacitors of Back to the Future fame Then we would have a proper supercar and time machine in one.

 

Just sharing 'info' from ppg70.

Dunno where he got it from. I agree sounds a bit high now after statements from Ferrari .

 

Back to topic.
Ferrari is building more cars, more “special” cars and as everyone has mentioned will experience more normal depreciation curves as a result.
I think people should get back to buying cars they want to drive and enjoy and let the crazy era of garage queen investments fade into the background of a bad memory.
So the fundamental question is, “What does he want to do with the car; road trips, track, C&C, stare at in garage?”
If driving is his goal then get the F8.