And steel rain gutters… need those in case you’re doing LeMans in a downpour. Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
I love my 996.1 gt3, what a car. 140plus k kms with plenty of previous track time in there, not one oil leak. Jump into this straight after driving any of my air cooled cars and feeling on road and behind the wheel is very much the same but on a different level. It's narrow for a modern take on the early car silhouette (10mm less width than my 930s) and fairly light in comparison to the later cars (1380kgs with half tank of fuel and factory cage). Ac and heating works well. The car is ageing well imo with many people looking at it not believing it's 22 yrs old now. Fried eggs have really grown on me too.
I was hoping to get a 2018/9 gt3 touring, but prices are too strong for me at 225K+ A friend who is a former past pres of porsche club of NY has me looking at 991.1 Carrera S manual 2 wheel drive. I like NA cars. Have been looking for a month and they are in short supply for what I want - lowish miles, not more than 2 owners, not black or most of the white I see(not a fan of pano roof) and no black wheels, wheels can be changed. Hoping the market will change. Have a 308 and corvette to play with, but now that I'm 64 I really just want one toy car and never had a Porsche. The entire car market is insane IMO right now. But it is what it is.
You seem a little light on your price for a 2018/19 Gt 3 Touring a year and half ago a 2.5k mile car lightly optioned was priced at $265k and that was before things got really crazy. You might look at 997.2 Gt 3 cars which are well liked. Little smaller body and more sports car than the more GT cars of 991 & 992 vintages. I believe the hp is a bit less as well but plenty enough to get you into as much trouble as you want.
265 is all tge money. I saw a 1800 mile car in NY for 250K. There is was a 9K car on pelican for 235 last week and another with 6K for 235 last week on BAT. I could have bought one in 2020 for 185K, but did not want to sell my BB512i for one. Nice 997.2 GT3s with a manual are in the 150K + for a car with low mileage. I like them a lot. I'm okay with the 991.1 if I can find what I want. It's more than enough for what I'm going to do with it. I'm not wanting a PDK yet in my toy car, but that may change in several years and they can be had anytime I want one. 991.1 GT3s with PDK are 135 - 150K for low mileage cars every day, but there are engine concerns with the older cars.
FYI - I believe the engine problems on the non turbos 997s (turbos had no engine issues) were resolved in the 997.2 models. You are pretty correct on the pricing on the GT3s of that vintage. I have never owned any 991.1 so I really haven’t an opinion but did test drive one, owned 2 997s both turbos a gen 1 and gen 2 turbo S, I enjoyed both but the gen 2 turbo S was a fav. Tried test driving a couple different vintages of GT 3s and thought the car wasn’t as comfortable especially for longer road trips which I do a couple per year. So I skipped to 992 TTS. I don’t track my cars so never really thought a GT. 3 filled my driving mission. Still have my 930 for times when I want the vintage driving experience.
Yes you're right about 997s. I meant turbos are getting really expensive with manuals. And the Metzger engines are the ones to have. Oh well I'm just going to resolve myself to carrera S standard and I'll be happy for quite a few years. I don't track cars either. Have vintage go karts for that stuff. I can't afford the vintage driving expierience any longer ;-)
Just noticed new style 17+ panamera turbo are $20k more than the 4S. Basically $100k in extra options for 80 percent off. Not sure if that is normally the case.
The reason people start to become attracted to the "lower bar" cars like the 996 is because there are more people with less money. Stuff gets expensive, people can't afford it, so they go for the next best stuff which they can afford. Then people start inventing reasons to talk them up. I think it's a little ridicuous how fractured Porsche "generations" have become. They used to denote a physical style, a paradigm shift of sorts between generations. Now there are .1 .2 .3 generations full of little stupid details, random capital letters denoting so and so "handling pakcages:" and option packages. Porsche themselves picked this up and release "limited editions" that are limited to the number they can sell (to steal Seinfeld's line). It's ridiculous. It's also not going to stop. They made a boatload of most 911's, their prices should reflect that. The fact they are good cars to drive is meant to be a bonus, not a value driver. Next thing you know Porsche will be making bad to drive 911's just so they are different. And charge more for the privilege. Maybe they've already done that who the hell knows.... rant over
Agree with all of this till the last part — Porsche are relentless about improving the performance of the 911. I don’t love the 992, but if I had to pick a track weapon today the 992 GT3 would be hard to pass up. With regard to the 996/986 — yes, the pricing makes them attainable, but having driven a couple of them, as well as a 993, 964, and 911s from 1973 up through 1987, my sense is they were Porsche’s rare misstep. My brother’s 997 was vastly better, even the base model. Rubbish interior plus IMS, etc. The problem is a good 993 or even a 964 is close to MSRP for a new 992, and the new ones are still hard to buy without dealer markup. So the 996 starts to look less bad because you can actually buy them. As far as the .1 and .2, it’s an enthusiast nomenclature for the usual mid cycle updates Porsche has always done. The long wheelbase, external oil filler on 1972, chain tensioners, OBD II, head gaskets on 964.2, etc. Now we give it a name with a decimal. Ferrari often gives their .2 cars a new model designation such as 328, 512TR, etc. But to your point, if prices recede on 997s, I think enthusiasm may wane for the 996. No crystal ball here, though. Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
I understand the enthusiasts started the naming conventions but as always in the car world, following the enthusiasts are the used car salesmen who jump on these differences to mark up prices. It's the way of the world, which doesn't make it less annoying. To me, at least. Just use the model year.... Anyway, if you read up on Porsche history, the reason the 996 and the early Boxster are how they are is because of where Porsche were financially. It's quite simple. They were worse because the company was in worse shape. Thankfully that was temporary. As for making the 911 better, I agree, but even Porsche know that there is a wall fast approaching. I say this because their current RSR 911 is in fact mid engined. Electrification will be their excuse to keep the 911 in play without ever having to admit that its rear engine design has had its day. They've been making them since 1963, it's incredibly impressive, although I would argue once they added 4wd the cars were already no longer the same proposition they started out with.
It’s a good point. With heavy IC engines, the 911 was born with a flawed layout, overcome through heroic engineering. Electric motors don’t present the same challenge, so theoretically the 911 could escape its original sin. But then the world would end if the 911 ever lost its flat six… Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
If you are talking Porsche prices. here's more grist for the mill. The "entry" level 911 or 718 may well be a thing of the past for mere mortals. https://www.thedrive.com/news/porsches-future-depends-on-higher-dollar-variants-of-high-dollar-sports-cars
I’m a ****ing idiot. I ordered a 2021 GT4, yellow, the ONLY option was better seats. Drive out was $115k. It was at the dock in Houston, and I passed. I’m a ****ing idiot. Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
That is interesting. My Porsche salesman just told me that as far as he can tell, they seem to be focused on Macans and Taycans and not so much the sports cars... even though the sports cars are what is in demand. They, and Ferrari, have been focused on the options for years. That is nothing new. I expect they will keep some products like the Cayman T around for the entry level enthusiasts, though. Not so sure about a new 911 T though, even though it has been rumored for a while.
They already announced the next Boxster generation will be 100% electric. I doubt they will keep a petrol version alive post 2023, 24 at the max. Especially after the IPO.
I am betting they will keep an ICE version of the Cayman around. They sell a lot of Cayman GT4 racecars so they would need an ICE version for homologation purposes. Are there really that many people that would actually buy an electric Boxster though??
Based on 0-60 times… probably yes. It raises questions about how 911s with ICE will compete, performance-wise. Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
I think there will still be a big market for people looking for the traditional sports car experience, and don't care about that missing tenth of a second. The demand for manual transmission Porsches is an example of this.
now it looks like you are from California which may have a different view then the east coast I do not see where they would sell many electric caymans here if there is an ICE version ... now if you eliminate the ICE version I would guess some people would buy but more would move on to other cars. ... but who knows..
I’m in California, but Porsche is in Europe, where it seems the EU is taking the lead in the transition. I doubt there will be an ICE version for some of the U.S. if California follows Europe. Europe aside, there may not even be a Mustang sports car or Camaro to choose from - not much investment in the recent Mustang reskinning. Again, I think the problem will be that an EV Boxster/Cayman will be far more than a few tenths quicker than the ICE version, which is why I suspect Porsche would just go with one power train. The trick will be how a brutally quick Boxster/Cayman can slot below an ICE 911. Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
