Post / Pre Enzo Cars (Values) ?

The common belief among the snots is that ferrari's stopped being ferrari's when FIAT took over in 69. Tough to say, it boils down to personal preference I think. Im not stuck on any specific era of ferrari, I like the older ones for the styling but like the F40 too for its brute power and looks. A dino was never a real ferrari (right from enzos mouth), its slow and has a FIAT engine in it yet its very expensive and collectible. There's no logic in it.

 

All-

My 2-Cents. I think they have a point. The man with the vision (and the name-sake Ferrari) is dead.

From what I have read Enzo wanted to put his energies into racing and so he probably had minimal to medium-level input into the models introducted after Fiat took over and especially later in his life. Regardless, he must have had some input and the cars left the factory with his living name on them; his Ok; his blessing; his honor. Each car was his and carried his good name into the world.

Now, Ferrari is more or less a faceless corporation like many others with, albeit, a world-wide recognizable name. A friend of mine thinks any car that came out after his death, just ain't a Ferrari; it is a Ferrari, but "The Man" did not bless it himself.

Although to a degree I do agree with my friend, I personally do not think that that line of reasoning will effect values or anything else for many years. Even then, Ferrari will probably have to "go bust," first or change hands so many times that "Enzo's" hand can no longer be seen in the product. Allot like what has happend to Lamborgini I think.

Ask yourself this simple question: IF Enzo was alive, would it have been called an "Enzo?" Just guessing, but I think probably not.

V/r,

mwr4440

 

Your friends are brilliant!

 

The endless "real Ferrari" conversation. All I can say is that I personally am more interested in the cars designed during Ferrari's lifetime. "Snots" bore me, I am unimpressed.

 

Personally, I believe that the real dividing line is between Enzo and Luca. During the old man's era, Ferrari built many gorgeous, but practically flawed, production cars. (Ferrari also build a few less than gorgeous cars too, but let's not go there.) Have a few beers with anyone who brought a new Ferrari back in the day, and they'll probably tell you that the car as delivered was not ready for prime time. But as coach built cars, no one expected them to be. It was all part of the mystic.

Then along came Luca, the heir apparent. Anybody remember his comments about the 348 he personally brought? After this experience, Luca was determined to bring Ferrari into the 20th century. And so began a line of cars -- 456, 355, 550, 575 -- and finally the capstone of modern Ferraris - the F360 Modena. I predict that the F360 will be Ferrari's equivalent of the Porsche 911 because it made Ferrari the modern, profitable, car company that it is today. Said another way, the production cars finally caught up with the racing cars.

Yes, annual production has doubled and tripled during Luca's era. And, yes, the company is no longer what it was. But I do think that it is safe to say that Ferrari might not have survived if Luca had not grabbed the reins.

Your thoughts?

Dale

 

I hope not. I've always thought it was a sort of tasteless name -- kind of like the 'Edsel'.

Well, who knows. I'm not overly smitten by any of the post-F40 cars. The F40 is the last one that really exudes an exotic aura and raises a Nomex-wrapped middle finger to video game dashes, cupholders, etc. More generally I think we're in a technology-centered era now, and there isn't anything out there today that touches the cool level of a Daytona, Boxer or 308/328. Prior to the '70s, most of the cars are temperamental high-six-figure History Channel feature material at this point: rolling automotive art that is gorgeous and but largely irrelevant when it comes to driving.

It's hard to credit or blame Enzo Ferrari for all of this. If he were alive, I think we'd still have a lot of wind-tunnel designed, robot-assembled Ferraris simply because you can't compete by building cars based on nostalgia. In a way, you could say Enzo left this world at the right time.

Speaking on behalf of my wallet, at the moment I don't think I would spend significant money on anything newer than an F40.

How did the poker game go?

 

Good post, but I would say the 308 locked up that role a long time ago. The 360 is an heir.

Photo posted elsewhere on FChat, but these are the two sports cars that matter for our generation (assuming you're under 50):
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Actually, I meant in an economic sense. The 911 made Porsche the wildly profitable company that it is today. The F360 is what turned Ferrari around.

Dale

 

The company had to change or it would no longer be in business. The regulatory barriers are just too high now. EPA/DOT type compliance adds alot to the cost of the car-making business. Lamborghini without Audi would have gone under too and probably more quickly.

 

Tru dat. Tru dat.

Dale

 

Also the point of view of a good part of the owners of F. Club Italia
is that the "value" cars are till Enzo was blessing them - so 328 and F40 -.

But the Company was compelled to go on, to stay alive/profitable, in the plate way of the high technology.

And so, I think, is day by day more relevant the penell drawing of Pininfarina, to give a strong alive and personal soul
of our F cars!!!

Because, for me , the hi-tech flattens a lot the modern cars, only sound and shape will keep alive the mith of Ferrari
in the people's mind.....

Oh, my GOD ! this is a new thread.....

CIAO
ALEX

 

True. Have you driven an AMG car lately? Pretty darn good.

To me, there is no question that the Luca cars are much better cars to own and drive than the ones built in Enzo's day.

However, I would sure love to see a bit edgier styling. While it is pretty good looking in the flesh, for example, the 599 certainly doesn't get your motors running the way a F40 does, does it?

Dale

 

It is not going to happen due to new EU rules for safer front-end design to minimize injuries to the legs and heads of pedestrians. In Europe the leaping cat on the Jag is already extinct. Even more stringent regulations are to take effect in 2010. Angular front-ends like those of the 308 and F40 are gone and will not return. Ferrari's current bulbous designs will only get worse.

 

The lambos seem to be able to retain the angular look, see the new LP640 or whatever its called? It looks awesome, pointed, angular and I think ferrari should do something along those lines for a breath of fresh air. Turf the rounded 99 taurus look.

 

I think to look at this from a view point of what will be more valueable, the post or pre enzo era cars you have to look at the situation from a pure personal and emotional stance. I remember when watchin Barret Jackson a view years a go (puts flame suit on) they were talking about how the value of cars from the 20s and 30s was going down, and the interest and demand just wasnt there. This is due to the people who grew up with them and seeing them new dieing off. Why are Hemi Cudas six and seven figure cars now? Because the guys in their fifties who grew up in the muscle car era have that kind of disposable income where they value the memories of their favorite childhood car enough to justify the price. The same is true with cars like the 250 gto and all the SWBs. However as the years go by and the people who have grown up seeing 360s and F50s as the "new" ferraris that is where the money will be going. Now I'am not saying we will ever see a 250 gto being donated to a HS shop class again, but 30 years from now i think there will be cars that ferrari buyers value more. As a 19 year old kid i know my generation doesnt know these older cars well at all. And as many of them are very technology minded people i cant seem them regressing to cars with no power anything that leak oil just becasue it won le mans 3 years in a row. I worked at a shop all throughout high school and have been around all sorts of vintage Fcars and have developed a strong appreciation for them and this is just my prediction for the future. Its also my hope that the values will drop significantly so i can afford a couple of 60s ferraris as well though.