Price for Major Service **SHOCKER**

As an independent or dealer we can only suggest a price estimate, we arrive at that figure from experience of the labor and parts cost, plus our cost of doing business. How do you arrive at prices in your business?

I start at a figure which seems average for a particular year/model and then revise as needed and discuss with the customer. With many older cars, people want a "brand new" car when they pick it up after a $5G bill!

You should all enjoy the 3x8 cars while they are around because the newer cars will be ridiculous to fix when they get past 10-12 years old. Used to be the only Vette any good was 1-2 years old before it became a bucket of nuts and bolts, now they are a good car for much longer, plus the volume ensures an aftermarket support. Never happen with F-cars, they are going opposite, great when new then too expensive when 4 years old.

 

The bottom line is trust in the mechanic. I feel that if the mechanic is honest they have free reign to do whatever they see fit on my car. I took my car to Tim Stanford 11 months ago and had them do some routine maintenance and change the A/C compressor. They said I should consider doing some electrical work and I said to go for it. I am happy now to not have had any problems since that visit. It is not cheap to own these cars, but getting a good mechanic that you trust makes you feel at ease knowing that the costs are all just related to the car you are driving and not to a mechanic looking for something else to charge for. And this forum is one of the best ways to find a good mechanic.
BT

 

It was and may still be the case that "service" actually is the main $ earner in a dealership whatever the make. Local Fraud/Crapillac/etc dealers around here charge 30% more per hour than I charge for exotics! i am my own worst enemy because I love to work on these things, but as Tom B says, it would be much more profitable to have a Toymota/Riceburner shop.

 

I just paid $1500 plus parts for the 60K service on my 308QV

 

And the breakdown of labor was? We have all documented the long and short versions of a 60/30K. It can be done very quickly if wanted.

Brian

 

I've been using this independent mechanic for a decade... the labor isn't broken down into separate items. If you want more of a feel for what I had done, it's in this thread.

 

My guy did a full service including valves and belts-no replacement of water pump or tensioner bearings(they were checked) for a fixed menu price of £1260, and he had the car for 4 days.Extras were cam seals and a few other things, but if he did not find anything wrong and just did the service that is the price i would pay plus vat at 17.5%. He is an excellent mechanic, who left the main dealer last year to start on his own.A basic service or an "annual" is £270 plus vat...I feel i get value from him!

 

I think the cost of service on the older cars has got a bit silly, particularly for the less mechanically inclined.

The first "30K" service on my 308 was $9K at an independent. This was inflated by adding electronic ignition, replacing as many hoses as we could, replacing carb gaskets, accel pumps and so on.

Next up was adding P6 cams (and re-doing all the valve shims, cam seals etc) plus replacement cam gears. $12K including $1K to correct a couple of lobes with the cams. Performed by a main dealer in the Midwest. Rate in 2003 was $109/hr. It is now $150 or $159/hr at the same location.

I can continue (e.g., re-do all suspension [bushes, shocks, springs, alignment], 3 or 4 sets of tires, upgraded brakes and more) but you get the point. The total bill on the car would make anyone's eyes water. It did mine.

Many of these were known "non-economic" decisions at the time. Others [like the cam installs] were just nasty surprises ("should be 30K service money" [which at the time was usually quoted as $4000 - 4500]).

I progressed to do most of the work (including a dry sump conversion) myself, with lots of help from others, including those here. Part of the fun. Doing it yourself gives you a good appreciation for the car's engineering and why certain things were done a certain way (look at it long enough with the books, ask some questions, it does become clear).

The reality is the authorized dealerships do make good money on service. The newer cars make the market ($1000/day target per tech?) and on a $100K car, a $12,000 service bill is 12% of the MV, rather than 30 - 40%, so people pay up and regard it as a cost of ownership. It is a profitable franchise, although I suspect those with long memories will opine it has not always been so.

I remember asking an Acura tech the cost of the "equivalent" belt replacementon an NSX. As I recall his answer was 6 years/90,000 miles and $1200 or something similar, which, as I recall, included the water pump.

So, there are cheaper "alternatives" out there. Buy one, pay the piper or learn to do it yourself.
Philip

 

Ok so we all pay the piper..but what about when you bring it in & during the process of lifting it, they dent the rocker panels, or they dent the bonnet when they close it..I know this has happened to me. Of course it gets fixed but when my 308 2v had the bonnet dented, the body shop scratched the targa, broke the key off in the ignition & didn't match the paint (Red of course). My concern is paying the price & not getting "white glove" treatment. I do drive my car!! & briskly..but I don't lean on the body panels, shove floorjacks under it to dent the rocker panels, or park it in a parking lot where a runaway cart can run into it...
As far as working on it myself..ahhaaaa!..My mechanical skills are limited to maybe removing a wheel & putting it back on.. I believe in letting "professionals" do what they know best. It just seem like maybe they don't.
I know the price of the cars, the parts, it just seems like the same knowledge is not available to those that work on these cars...or perhaps they just don't care!...

 

Are you saying there is no one on planet earth that cares or does a good job?

I can assure you there is but maybe you just don't want to pay that price.

 

Brian..Not saying absolutely...just generally speaking.... Also as far as paying the price..these were not shade tree operations..specifically the 308 2v was dented three times @ Ferrari of Denver....one time passenger door, another the front end when it was "washed"..I later specified don't wash it...third time when I was having the AC converted, & the front bonnet was dented...

 

I have never suggested shade tree operations. I just don't understand how anyone can accept that there are bad doctors, lawyers, plumbers, electricians etc,etc,etc and you experience a bad repair shop or two or three and they must all be bad.

I went through many machine shops before I found a good one, I can point out far more bad dentists and resturants than I can good ones.

I had a discussion here the other day with a guy who went on and on and on about all the bad work that had been done on his Lotus. It was all the same guy? Why go back. There are alternatives.


Go to Dave Helms. He is universally accepted as better than FOD. If you did not know that you did notdo much research. If you did not do your homework who do you have to blame?

 

BTW When I say price I mean more than just money. The price may be convienence. Good resturants are very hard to just walk in to and get a table. Good Doctors or Dentists can have very long appt lead times. A good mechanic may be the one 50 miles away rather than the one 5 miles away.
A great criminal Lawyer may cost 5 times what one picked at random from the yellow pages charges. I drive (in a dense metro area with a lot of people that call themselves machinists) about 75 miles one way to a shop that does my machine work if it is any more complex than resurfacing a flywheel.

I have clients from Oregon to Arizona. Dave I know gets flown to Montana occasionally to see after some cars there.

That is what I mean about paying the price.

Thats modern life. It ain't easy, not if you have standards.

 

Philip, you are indeed one of the few willing to go the extra mile to take what began as a $30k car and throw another $30k into it (or thereabouts). Have long followed your threads/work and highly admire what you have done. Color me jealous is some respects! You bring to the table a deep passion and the willingness to go the extra mile for performance (or should that be km since we are discussing an Italian car?).

You, kind sir, deserve all the best life has to offer.

And yes, thanks for ALL your posts and help for guys like me who are trying to also tweak their car. Perhaps one day we can all get together and make a single site where our knowledge and experience is documented. Sure the Fchat search function helps, yet wish there was a single website where we could all chime in with what tweaks worked, what did not, how to do such tweaks, approximate costs (not including blood... or selling first born child LOL) etc.

Thanks again Philip. You are very much appreciated!!!

 

"Go to Dave Helms. He is universally accepted as better than FOD. If you did not know that you did notdo much research. If you did not do your homework who do you have to blame?"

Brian, this was before Dave Helms opened his place in Boulder, which now is actually more convenient (closer) for me. I sold my 308 2v & bought a 328 last summer..Now I deal with Dave Helms.

 

I just moved to Oakville, Ontario, Canada and I own a 1984 308 GTSqv. Does anyone know any good shops in my area?

Georgios

 

Honda's have some of the lowest water pump Remove/Replace scheduled intervals of all cars.
Attests to the quality they put in their cars ...
(make no mistake, that was a slam!)

 

I agree completely, I take mine to a well respected independent who specializes in pre-90's cars.

 

Exactly!!