Question on Buying 812 - fun and emotions

Greetings,

I been admiring the 812 for a long time and I am probably coming close to deciding on buying a 812 gts. I wanted to get some answers confirmed before starting my search for cars.

First is the emotions. What I find with my prior cars, the reason I kept changing them is that they get boring. I think the v12 and the way its setup (as heard from many people - it requires lots of effort to conquer the car when driven hard, which is exciting), will keep the fun alive. Maybe the mid engine/track cars are too precise, losing its character of fun. However, I also heard contrasting opinions on the transmission. Some says that the transmission is aggressive on race mode, sort of like the f12tdf, mimicking the aggression of the old single clutchs and f1 with modern dual clutch speeds. On the other hand, people claim that compared to the mid engine ferraris, it is softer and not as aggressive. I wanted a confirmation on this aspect. This is probably the most important question for me and the rest are only some assurance.

Also, what other aspects of excitement does it provide, other than the v12, high horsepower that requires control, and the transmission (if it is actually aggressive)? I wanted to understand from a long time owner, that if any aspects help the car not feel old. I have owned various track focused cars, but they are too precise and lacked that "fun character".

Lastly, how do people think about the 12 cilindri? It has the sp3/competitizione engine that revs 600rpm higher. The engine is the biggest sensory feedback for me, thus I worry a better experience could be had with that. This question also relates to the second one - because I heard the new car is more of a touring car and is less aggressive, maybe the overall package and "fun" of the 812 would make up for the 600 rpm difference. However, I personally think that any NA v8s or v12 sounds good after 5000 rpm, so maybe that last 600rpm does not matter. Only on porsche gt3s I feel the last 1000rpm being important, as it brings additional mechanical sounds.

Appreciate any answers, thank you for the insight!

 

Basically, they were too track biased. Only for track and not too fun on the road (could be a perception thing) I would say I dont have much experience, and the 812 would be quite a big jump for me, since I was trying out cars before planning to get something expensive. If considering only true sport cars, not sport sedans or sport suvs, two true sport cars I had owned extensively is the amg gtr and new c8 z06 convertible. Those as you can see are more bang for the buck, but you get what you paid for, so I wanted thing to go beyond now. I have driven other cars as well but I am talking about two that I owned and driven extensively.

For the amg it sounded cool with the burbles but definitely not as lively as a high reving NA motor. It drived good (very planted) but I didn't have an opportunity to track it, so only road experience made feel feel bored. Its not just the monotone exhaust (although that burble helped), it was that its hard to drive on the road. For example, there is no front lift, the car is designed for track that on the road it feels too fast (does everything well but doesn't really make you feel excited during turns since its designed to produce precision on track). The biggest problem is that other than the one trick, that is loud exhaust and burbles, there are no other exciting parts (steering felt race car though). Interesting, the gtr use the same transmission company as the 812, but I am sure they are tuned quite differently. The gtr didnt have responsive shift until you press the gas or brake very hard (but once at it, its fast), and if driven calmly, the transmission is not responsive. Im sure its the engine, but on downshift you only get the burbles and no emotion on the exhaust. It sound like a monotone rev plus some burble and pops, and if the burbles were not added, it won't sound any good. I forgot how hard the shifts were, I think they were slightly hard, but it wasn't too memorable. I know the f12tdf shifts hard, and some mid engined ferrari shifts hard as well. If the 812 shifts much harder than what I remember on the gtr, as well as emotional downshifts (that I am sure its there), the car has more elements to play at least. So for the amg, the problem was too little element that triggered the senses (or I would say, there are a lot, but you get used to it quick). People who own amg gtrs sell them later as well, you dont see people keeping them forever.

In terms of the z06, its a massive improvement. The pros are that the sound is there (copies the 458 so of course, very vibrant and tones change, not monotone), fast, drivable on street (flat plane NA motor so not too much torque, front lift, camera). For the cons of why I might not be keeping it, its because its still a chevy, so comfort is maintained and some emotions are lost. The shifts are quick and doesnt sluch when driven slowly. There is a "bang" on upshift but it doesn't punch me like the aventador. I heard ferraris give that bang, fast shift, but also a punch, which is what I wanted to confirm. The downshift sound good but needs to be higher than 4000rpm. Any low rpm shifts dont sound emotional, and it could be a gearing thing for fuel consumption. Another problem is the steering might be too comfortable. The gtr had hydraulic steering that was decently fun, so although the car was too precise and not as playful, the steering at least make it feel like a racecar. The corvette didnt have too much connection to the road which I feel like driving a very good handling and sounding Bentley. Good for daily but I wanted more fun. I heard the 812 dances around and is playful to drive, thus I am considering it.

Sound is also very important, thus I wanted to pick the GTS. The z06 had a reflector on the exhaust tip and in convertible form it sounded like the exhaust is right beside your ears. I liked that feeling and it felt similar to the gt4rs with the intakes behind the ears. As with my sound preference, I didnt consider the avendator. The sound is loud, FROM OUTSIDE, but inside the car, it sounds muted. I want to enjoy the sound for myself, not to annoy others. I think if any owners car touch upon the sound deadening as well, it would be preferable (if anyone read to here anyways). I do hear that the 812 sounds closer to the exhaust and also got some induction sound as well, so I should feel the v12 closely vs the aventador.

 

Thank you so much. F12tdf would be my dream if it wasn't 1 million something. I will be sure to try the f12, and see if rawness is something im missing out, then ill go from there!

 

I see, what do you think in road speeds and highways? I do canyons and tracks but it is not as often. I like to take my cars on any good road if possible. For the shifts, does the aggresion comes in a "bump" or "punch"? The amg I had with the same transmission company had a slight bump but nothing aggressive. All those sensory feedback adds to thr experience for me. For the exhaust, I did hear one in person and its quite tame for sure. I wonder however inside the car, is it the type of car that sounds pretty filtered(due to sound deadening and exhaust placement), or more raw (intake noise, clearer exhaust note)? I personally dont like the avendator for the reason that its filtered in the cabin, Its only loud outside.

 

Thank you for the information. How would you define emotional on the older ferraris? Personally I find a great exhaust "emotional", which is why the v12 and induction noise helps. Maybe its the front engine thing, like the old m3csl making great induction sounds, since the sound wave is going towards the driver. I find some mid engine cars and 911s are lacking the induction fun, since the sound is going back and leaving the car (the gt4rs is the only good one, although I understand the 812 wont sound like that).

On the other hand, thanks for the clarification, since the "dramatic shift" was what I wanted to confirm. I think other than the avendator, and maybe mclaren, no other competitors do that. People had different opinions and focuses, so I couldn't get a yes or no answer confirming whether the drama is there. I only know that the t12tdf shifts quite dramatic for sure.

Speaking of rawness, I think its very important for engagement and fun at any speed. But too raw maybe too tiring and makes driving the car a hassle and not pure enjoyment. I sold my hydraulic steering amg because it was way too hard to do lane changes and just dashing around the highway through slower cars as it felt "unsafe". However with the c8 z06 it had the mid engine and good suspension feel that made it steer close to a supercar and moves with high agility, but the connection to the road is too vague like a game. Thus, I wish for something that drives well like the z06, but still has a bit of rawness like gtr. I do think a Ferrari would of course drive well, has a bit of road feel, but the new electric steering would not make it a hassle for day to day?

For the induction, I wonder if you have a superfast or gts? I heard some people saying that the gts is softer, and maybe sound deadening is added? However supposedly Ferrari only changed the areo and gear ratio, so its not slower than the sf.

Thanks for your import, and anyone else as well. Its really hard to find a test drive or rent a ferrari in Canada, we have such limited choices. I also just wanted to make sure I make the right move for such as price jump from my previous purchases.

 

Thanks for the suggestions, I totally understand what you mean. I have considered the gt3 greatly but they are not very usable on the street and after the z06 I wanted something to sound better. The gt3 also isnt as good as a mclaren in handling i believe. Also, now that the z06 is based on the 458, and people online kept mentioning that the only thing better than ferrari v8 is the v12. The reason I leaned toward the 812 was the transmission and handling improvements, as well as those "cool" bits that the f12 didn't have. I think a LT mclaren would fully satisfy the excitement and raw handling, but the engine wont sound good. Im leaning a little more towards the sound and also unique bits, like a different upshift feel with the "bang", or a front engine car with crazy horsepower feel. As it is difficult to test different cars due to limited amount of cars and needing dealer relations, I think the best I can do is gather information here. So far what I heard is quite convincing. I appreciate those feedbacks!

 

I plan to keep my car for a long time, its a dream to own a v12. I dont have any Ferrari history, so I would really just buy from others or a dealership for the first time. Of course the newest isn't what I wanted. I heard the 12cilindri lost its excitement for comfort, which is not what I want. However that 812 comp/sp3 engine is tempting...

 

Thank you, I would go do a novitec header if I picked the gts. I prefer the gts for the open top, because I do realize how much more sound and engagement open top brings. However some people said here that they believe the gts somehow felt softer, and it had less induction noise, etc. If so it would be a hard choice. I might need to go to Vegas and rent both if I cannot get an answer here haha.

 

Thank you for the information. Being in Canada (with limited cars vs the US), and no dealer relations, it is quite hard to drive all those cars. Here we even have an special insurance, which any risk is not insured If I attempt to drive someone else's private car over a certain price.

That being said, I experienced the gt3 passively, and what I didn't like was the sound compared to the gt4rs. I feel like that engine unmodifed sounded too tame, but any modification makes it too rasy and metallic. The gt4rs I can simply let the intake take over, and it feels like the sound is in my head. With v8s and v12, I noticed even catless, they make a mechanical symphony. In addition, a v12 is a v12, no matter how good mclarens drive, I couldn't stand losing the sound. I think in the future, I will keep a v12, and add on a mid engine track car or gt3 to pair. But I still needed to make sure the v12 is something worth the premium, so that other than the v12, there are still many more to enjoy. Again, appreciate all the imputs.