Well, howdy, folks! This will be my 9,000th and probably last post on FChat. Yes, I was banned for 7 days by Ryan LAfun for calling a certain ambulance chaser from San Francisco, whom I will henceforth affectionately refer to as the Cowardly Lyin King, a dooshbag. Never mind that he is, and that it was in response to the Lyin King repeatedly labeling me the moron from Austin .for which he was not punished (of course). I take responsibility for my actions. Yes, as Ryan & Rob indicated, I was warned about this sort of schoolyard jousting (which most MEN can handle without crying to mommy, but apparently this leaves out the Cowardly Lyin King) in a different thread .and I toned it down. There was, however, no warning in the thread in question. It was give & take with the Lyin King. But never mind---I did the crime, I did the time. Ryan LAfun is not a bad guy, and I do not hate him for banning me. By his own admission, he gets the difficult disciplinary tasks on FChat. But, contrary to his claims, I believe he actually sort of likes this sort of conflict. In fact, I believe he thrives on it. Why else would he allow himself to deal with all of them? Why else would he purposely & repeatedly profess lascivious lust for various posters wives? Why else would he put himself in these crosshairs regularly? Very Freudian. Heh ;-)) Oh, and Ryan? Your claim here that you received no complaints or whines about my alleged offending post before you banned me seems contradicted by the facts. Some folks make very poor fibbers, son. However, as for the site administrators claims that Cowardly Lyin King and I have both been banned 5 times, and that discipline here is fairly administered, etc etc etc lather rinse repeat? Well .Rob, thou doth protesteth too much by half. I mean no insult or offense by saying this, but nevertheless it is true. It is irrelevant how many times each of us has been banished. For you to play that card is specious at best. What is relevant is what specific behavior got us banished, and what specific behavior seems immune to banishment, at least for one of us. You see, I was banished 5 times for gentle name-calling & schoolyard jousting, which seems the realm of P&R. As was the Cowardly Lyin King. However (and here is where it gets really interesting), I was NOT banned for challenging anyone to a fistfight. I was NOT banned for making overt threats of punitive litigation against various posters, against FChat, against its administrator, or against any of its moderators. I was NOT banned for making fun of anyones looks, weight, physical handicaps, and spouses or significant others, or any other unsavory behavior of this sort. Why? Because I have never engaged in that sort of over-the-top behavior, as far as I know. And yet, the other player in this melodrama has done most if not all of those things, and yet is still on FChat, taunting away right before he runs & cries to mommy (or has his surrogate, Martin, do it for him). Could this obvious double standard exist due to fear of the aforementioned threats of punitive litigation (which, rumor has it, have been leveled more than once)? Different rules for different people?? You be the judge. As I said, the pattern I see is not why we were both banned 5 times, but rather why one of us has been allowed to repeatedly engage in behavior staggeringly more serious & damaging than simple playground name calling, with seeming impunity. Different rules for different people. In addition, recently Asianbond was banned for 3 days for name calling on a chronic level against many users. Yet I was banned for 7 days for going back & forth with the Cowardly Lyin King, who, as I have mentioned, was not banned for same. Yall starting to see a double standard here? Guy who threatens litigation is essentially immune. Guy who jousts with the aforementioned, but threatens no litigation or anything else, is banned 7 days for calling him a name. Another guy is banned 3 days for calling a bunch of people a bunch of names. Hmmmm .yeah, discipline is fairly administered here. Right. Tell me another one. More like different rules for different people. This is a very interesting business model, Rob. Yknow, I have successfully turned around quite a few small & medium sized businesses. I have learned that any that repeatedly crap on some of their most loyal patrons, while immediately acceding to groundless threats from bullies, are destined to be time sinks & money pits forever. Youre spending $65,000 a year on FChat? I suppose you want to turn a profit significantly in excess of that? Good luck with the approach you are taking. Again, not trying to insult here---none intended---but rather trying to inform what seems intuitively obvious to many, many people. Word to the wise. Now, that said, I did not get banned for labeling the Cowardly Lyin King a tax cheat, as some suspected. I personally do not know whether he is one or not. I hope not. However, much to my surprise, the State of California is EXTREMELY interested in investigating & pursuing the apparently common crime (if Dom is to be believed) of evading their vehicle registration tax. And they are ESPECIALLY interested in cases involving high rollers with expensive exotic cars like Ferraris and planes. I think I will FedEx some Depends to the Cowardly Lyin King .at his age, he may need them very soon. Remember, folks: integrity is doing the right thing even when no one is looking A few other things: Recently, the site administrator responded to a question about the whereabouts of a guy named Frogman, who used to post on FChat. He is in harms way 24/7 in Iraq, risking his life for others. Last year, he asked me to beg Rob, IN CONFIDENCE, to have his FChat account removed to avoid compromise by murderous islamofascists who are actively tracking US agents and their families (no jokethis is really going on). I did so, and his account was removed, with Rob agreeing to keep the reasons private. So much for keeping that requested confidence, Rob. Nice ethics you displayed there, hoss. Maybe you should ban yourself and learn the meaning of integrity. That was seriously, SERIOUSLY not cool, and in EXTREMELY poor taste. Are you really sure you want to so thoroughly piss off a guy like Frogman? And then we have a moderator here who recently impersonated another (banned) FChat user, and changed the title of a thread not flattering to the Cowardly Lyin King. AFAIK, impersonation is grounds for immediate removal based on the TOS. Again: Nice double standard, guys. I know it was done in good fun, because the moderator is a good guy. This is not an attack on him. However, given the context & when it happened, that was way outta line. And no one did a damned thing about it. Denial is not just a river in Egypt Since I am on a roll here: Joel Miller MD, how on earth do you make it through the day? It is absolutely priceless that you totally refuse to take ANY responsibility for your being a putz and a half, and yet you keep blaming all your chronic self-ownage and epic immaturity on me and my alleged gang. Been paranoid and delusional for long, zippy? Keep dancing to my tune, cupcake. Despite the fact that it has been months and months since I so royally schooled you, you still remember it & talk about it incessantly, and blame all your problems on it. What does that say about you, son? And Martin ah, Martin. You are so FOS, your ears are brown. Maybe, if you are able to disengage your mouth from the Cowardly Lyin Kings backside for 5 minutes, youd realize that the only reason your communist-leaning, Holocaust-denying, hateful one-sided tripe is even tolerated here is solely because you are a big-paying FChat sponsor. Nuff said. You are a genuine POS. How the hell do you stay in business?. So .maybe it is obvious by now why this will be my final post here. I will not remove my user ID, as I still like to come here to pick up on tech tidbits, racing lore, and cool pictures (especially the bikini thread). But I cannot countenance the way this site operates, and have chosen to spend my time, and my attention, elsewhere. If you have rules, they should apply EQUALLY to EVERYONE. I have always said that its Robs site---private property---and he can do with it as he pleases. No one forces any of us to be here, despite the considerable hours some have invested posting here. But my time is valuable, and it is better spent elsewhere. I take full responsibility for my actions, as I always have, and take my lumps like a man. Others here whine to mommy at every tiny slight. But when a bully gets his way again & again, and is allowed to make threats without sanction, yet others get pounded for some back & forth playground language with a guy who engaged in the very same sort of language ..well, with different rules for different people, its not the sort of place I want to invest my valuable time any longer. It has been my great honor to have become friends with many of you and an even bigger honor to have met some of these friends in person. That will not end. I am much richer, and a much better person, for having met you. By the way, anyone here who wants to can reach me at [email protected]. I will not be responding to any more PMs. Most folks on here are wonderful. I have learned so much from so many of you smart, talented fellow Ferrari fanatics .and I hope I have given some of it back. Some of you, as I have mentioned, I am now proud to call my friends (whether on-line or in person). But a few of you are so low that you look up to the scum of the earth. What goes around comes around. And for that special someone who played the Glen Westminster game a while back & overtly threatened my wife: I know who you are, where you live, everything about you & your family, all your phone numbers, your passport number, how your cars are registered, etc. Pull that crap again, cupcake, and you had better hope that the country where you were born has sophisticated DNA matching technology. Capisce? I will conclude with a cliché that is SO true: we are judged by the company we keep. I like to keep company with (to name but a few here) Darth, Mike550, Dr. Who, Rivee, Rifledriver, Sfumato, Bobafett, Redhead, Wax, Korr, Redcar, TexasMike, Jim Muise, Bob Callahan, dm_n_stuff, Sunny, Scuderia San Antonio, etc. etc. etc. I am honored to be judged in their shadows. Contrast that with the following bloviation from the sort of company the Cowardly Lyin King keeps .namely, one Faisal Khan aka Spicy Butt. The Lyin King got off Spicy Butt from allegations best left to your own Google searching. This has been acknowledged here by Spicy Butt, and is why he gave the Lyin King the moniker Will Get You Off (among other reasons, perhaps not that there is anything wrong with that ). One day recently, OUT OF THE BLUE, I began getting barraged by Spicy Butt with unsolicited, unexpected PMs, regurgitating an old discussion we had had about what would happen if Pakistan, a full bona fide nuclear power, were to be taken over by the islamofascists in its midst. Im not gonna argue that issue here. But pay careful attention to his repeatedly stated desire to relieve himself inside part of my anatomy. One example of it is posted belowthere were 2 more. Ryan buddy this may ring a lot of bells with you, as IIRC you also received these sorts of homoerotic come-ons from Faisal. And this gomer is a friend of that certain ambulance chaser from SF?? Too funny. Attention, Cowardly Lyin King: you are judged by the company YOU keep, old man. A small sample of the PM barrage is pasted below intact, with no editing, additions, or removals. Yall keep the shiny side up, ya heard? -Dave ************************************* QUOTE=tvrfreak Yup I miss you, sweetcheeks. Come here and give me a big wet kiss. Then let me pee in your butt. Quote: Originally Posted by maranelloman You remember wrong, dingdong. What I said was that Pakistan, AFAIK, had ballistic missile technology capable of carrying nuclear weaponry, and, should Pakistan ever fall to islamofascists, there would be a huge risk of that being used to target American & allied interests.....not necessarily directly from Pakistan, but from wherever the missiles were taken. But, by all means, keep thinking about threads in which I posted long, long ago. You obsessed or something? I could have sworn I remember you demanding that I stop PMing you. You miss me now or something? Too funny~ Quote: Originally Posted by tvrfreak http://msnbc.msn.com/id/7237312/ I remember you being concerned about Pakistan's ability to lob missiles at Europe and America...here is proof that their longest range missile only has a range of 1,250 miles. Maybe now you will admit you were wrong, but I doubt it.
Gee, looking over shoulder, welcome back, Dave. Dale ps I suggested a long time ago (well, a long time in Internet years) that most large boards have discovered that moderation doesn't work due to its inherent inconsistancy. What does work is peer ranking where all the users vote on the quality of posts. With this, for example, you can set your screening to include only those posts with a 3 to 4 star rating. Maybe it is time to go back to the well?
After taking the time out to read your post, Dave, im sad to see the end of MM as we know it. I hope its still a temp thing, but i can 100% see your reasoning behind all this. I wish to stay out of matters which dont directly involve me, so i wont comment of most things in your post, but i can understand where your coming from. Adios Brother, and let the good times roll.... /tear
Dave, don't stop posting, don't let 'em get the best of ya ! Besides we NEED your entertainment factor around here
Dave this is a sad day for F-CHAT, you are one of the true characters on here, there are not many of you left, just off the top of my head apart from you we have NNO, Bruce, and Uro/Kitty left, there are one or two others but you four really make me happy to be here, i understand your reasoning and agree with you mate but i truly hope that this is a temp situation and that i will see more hit it's in the bikini thread, if you decide that you truly will not come back well all i can say is i wish you all the best mate for you and your family, i hope that we havent seen/heard the last of you. Steve
Dave, Although we butted heads a couple of months back I believe that you are correct with what you said in this post. Take care and remember to have fun.
Dave, I agree there are issues. We will stay in touch, even if to swap pron and hit it pics...I see ya liked the dachshund pic Keep up the integrity. People may not always agree with you, but they should respect you. If not, their loss. Keyser Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Dave, I hope you will stick around. It was hard slamming Asiandork without your assistance. Regarding the issue(s) at hand, I have seen inconsistency in moderation and I can see where it could be a problem for users. I don't blame any of the moderators, but I think there is a key problem here. That problem is that when communities grow, the moderation is generally handed off to "trusted" and well known members. These members generally know a lot of people, are friends with lots of folks, and through longevity probably have their fair share of folks who do not like them. I think its impossible for such moderators to be unbiased in their application of the rules. I've seen cases on this site where it appears someone received special treatment because of who they are, or where moderators "jumped into the fray" of an argument which immediately makes them biased. If Lafun (just picking him randomly, since he's the moderator whipping boy of late ) get into a heated thread with others, then someone on the "opposition" breaks a rule, and Lafun bans them, how could it be seen as anything other than abuse of power? Even though it may be perfectly legit, it would still appear this way. I think the removal of the mere appearance of a conflict of interest is an important thing. Choosing moderators is VERY hard, because it can't just be the guy everyone knows. It has to be someone who can apply the rules as fairly as possible, even if it meant banning/reprimanding another moderator. On another note, are personal attacks/name calling not allowed? I didnt know that. Personally, I don't think Asiandork should have been banned, since I don't think he's trolling, rather just has whacked out opinions. Some with 3 posts saying the US sucks is a troll, 200 posts and a starting controversial topic is not a troll, IMO. I've been a member of a LOT of sites. I think a reasonable rule set is the following... -No attacks on a persons family. Gets too personal, too heated, too vicious. -No real world threats. "I'll beat you up" or even "you better hope I dont meet you" or even "this is not over, you'll see what happens" is, IMO, unacceptable. Personally, that would include legal threats (not sure if such threats were made, just put it in because MM mentioned it) -No disclosure of personal info. Posting someones home address, phone #, pictures they did not intend to be posted, where they work, etc, should be forbidden. Even if you know someones name and can google their info, just don't post it. There is NEVER a reason to do that, it's an implied "real world" threat and should never happen. The only exception would be someone breaking the next rule who needs to be 'found out'. Even then, it maybe shouldnt be publicly disclosed, just determined and taken care of with that specific user. -Attempts to harm the community with forethought are grounds for permanent ban. Spamming PM's, DoS attacks, hacking user accounts, impersonating other users, spamming threads with ads, etc, etc. -Try to keep on topic, and in the correct section of the site. Mods can help with this, a heated religion discussion in General gets moved to P&R for example Ideally, paid professional moderators would be best. Failing that, I *always* think that people who actively participate in a community are probably NOT good moderators, especially those who are "friendly" with many members. Its like your boss or your teacher... the relationship kinda has to be a professional one and if it transition to a friend one, when friends take action against friends, feelings get hurt. I also don't think MM should have been banned. We don't need to like everyone we meet in life, be it real life or virtually. Grown men should be able to disagree (and even rib each other, or even say "you're an idiot") without stooping to violation of the rules above. I like Art and I like MM. I don't see any real world harm in their bickering. Art is into Ferraris and has posted plenty of interesting things I've read, whether its about cars, planes, motorcycle racing, travel, legal stuff. Dave is the same, just the flip side. Lots of entertaining reading on P&R, great racing advice, interesting discussion on topics of motor racing/F1, and more. Both of them are valuable members of the community, who, like fire and ice just dont go together. I think it would be a shame if the community lost either, but I think both should (and can) abide by the rules I listed above. Hope you stick around Dave.
To a great-egg - I'm just as tall, so put your hat back on! What need not be said, won't be, good friend. I'm honored. --Dan
This is an unfortunate end to an unfortunate situation. Moderation on a busy message board is no easy task; there will always be objections to how its carried out. I do give Rob et al. credit for doing their best. I'll miss your posts, MM. While I've never really talked to you, your pictures, humor, and opinions (even the ones I strongly disagree with) brought a flair to the board that I respected and won't forget. Hopefully this won't be a permanent thing, even if it seems that way now. Take care.
A very, very sad day for F-chat, indeed. I'm saddened by your decision; I hope after some time you may consider coming back.
Dave, if you leave Fchat you let the minority that didn't agree with you win!!!!!!!!! there are more people on this site that appreciate you more then the few that wanted you off the site.............. you are a martyr in a unholy land.........spread the gospel about 'hitting it' to the none believers............. don't let them win.......you will if you quit the site.......you have more supporters then detractors.............
Dave can't leave now we need to get work only 1293 days, 11 hours, 37 minutes, and 58 seconds left until 2008 US Election
Too cool, going out on 9000. What timing! I can never think of you Dave without remembering an orange traffic cone. Sad, huh?
No matter the sentiments expressed by maranelloman, (whom I have dubbed "Snoopy," as he is the wind beneath the wings of the Red [oft-mentioned] Baron) I like Faisal, as I do Ryan, Martin & Rob. BUT, the ethically-challenged ******bag can kiss not only maranelloman's ass goodbye, but the long overdue $12,000. At least. That price tag alone makes the 9,000 posts worth it. As the ******bag's favorite punching bag rides off into the sunset, a thundrous fart is cast in the Red Baron's general direction, no matter which way the wind blows, it lands squarely in his smug face all the same. I am proud to have fought the good fight alongside Dave. He will be missed.
I think that this quote exemplifies the inability to see a good thing when one has it poured over one's (inability to see the light) head. What has helped to bring many paying members to Fchat, and has continued to keep paying members at Fchat, is being allowed to leave unchallenged by it's administrator, in fact, is pushing him out the door. I have thought seriously for awhile about doing what MM is doing, and absolutely agree with his perception of Fchat and it's mods. I can be repeatedly called names like "weight challenged" (still don't know why he fabricated that) and "mentally challenged" (possibly) and "draft dodger" (another fabrication) by MM's nemesis "Ol' Yellar", yet because I don't run to the principal and complain, nothing is done about it. I can handle the remarks and jousting without crying foul, but return the favor and look out. He pulls out the libel wand and begins to threaten litigation. Double standard? You betcha. MM leaving=Fchat's loss? You betcha MM, see you next week.
