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Discussion in '365 GT4 2+2/400/412' started by stuarts, Mar 11, 2012.
Just got a not from Superformance they will have wheels to ship next Wednesday, 2/27.
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Thanks, Ken. Hope I'm next!
I'm still waiting. Chloe says there are still problems at the foundry. I wonder if I want to get the first set of wheels from a foundry that has had 'problems'??!!
The update she gave me was shipping on Tuesday 4/2...
But I'm with you. How safe will these wheels be?
I think they should give us a more precise explanation. While I can't imagine any manufacturer would chance it with QC problems on a wheel I would feel a lot better knowing the issue.
Talk about jumping to conclusions. How does problems with the foundry = problems with the wheels ?
eg The foundry could be busy with other work = that could be a "problem with the foundry".
I've met the guys at superformance at their premises on a number of occasions and doubt you'll have any problems. Very professional setup and very helpful people.
Last time I was there I lent them one of the original air filters from my 400 so they can adjust the design of their aftermarket version to make it fit better.
If you're in any doubt call or email and ask them, I'm pretty sure they'll explain the situation which is probably just a production run delay of some kind rather than a manufacturing issue.
Here is quote from Chloe's earlier email:
"they have been on order but delayed due to an issue at the foundry."
Remember this order is delayed by 2 months. Is business in Italy that good these days? He confirmed they are made in Italy in his latest email.
Everything about a wheel that you can NOT see was done at the foundry. The things you can see were done in a machine or paint shop. Quality control at a foundry is very important. It would be nice to know what "issue" means. I will ask.
That explains it. Knowing how Italians are, a 2 month delay could be due to a long lunch !
Superformance sent this reply today, "went in to administration but we (were?) bought up at last minute by a new owner who relined the furnace etc." I think that is Italian for bankruptcy.
I am still holding out since the options are limited or very expensive. I'm not sure how many miles my TRX's have left in them; they have done well over 25K miles in 6 years.
I agree there's nothing to do but wait. I suffered through 10 years of endless delays with Italians while i was in the bicycle business. At least QC should be ok.
Wheels shipped today from the UK!
Wheels and spacers arrived and fit okay after returning the spacers for an undercut of 1mm on rears. They turned them around in a day and got back in no time.
I set my tire size at 230/60R16 so that I would have no change in rolling diameter. That size is an exact match for the TRX metrics. Fit on the car of the whole assembly is perfect. That size greatly reduced my tire choices; it is a pretty "tall" wheel by today's standards. Instead of going for the pricey BFG RE 04's, I bought Falken FK 452's. This is their "ultra high performance summer tire". Cost only $118 at Pep Boys. They look compatible with the car, not too racy. I have only put about 20 miles on them today so I have no idea of handling. My first impression is that they will give a less harsh ride over bumps and such. However, I think I had the same impression when I put a full set of TRX's on my car 6 years ago!. If Falken's don't work out in a year I can opt for an more expensive option and not much harm done.
I am heading to an FCA 50th year party tomorrow at Central Jersey Ferrari, but that is all highway driving. It will get its first 'rally run' in a couple of weeks.
can you take a few photos? im interested in seeing how much offset you have with the spacers. My wheels just arrived today and tires are in the mail. Thanks
Domani, domani....I heard that all the time. Still they have lots to teach us...(-*
Did you mean to say that you got the 235/60/16s? Should everyone with a 400i have the 1mm undercut done for the rears? Also, could you post a pic or two of your car with the new wheels and tires? Thank you
Yes, 235 not 230 on tire size.
The 1 mm cut that I mentioned is not changing the design. Their machinist just did it wrong and luckily cut too little than too much; it was the cut on the back of the spacer to fit the protrusion from the brake rotor hub.
On the other hand, I had mine made made 12 mm thick as most posters have indicated 12 mm or 1/2". I think 11 mm might be okay but prove it to yourself and don't take my word for it. Reason I suggest it is that I compared the lug bolt insertion on TRX wheel with the 16" wheel plus spacer. I would estimate I am losing about one full thread on the bolt when fitted and this could be gained back with a thinner spacer.
Lets all b i t c h a little regarding the ease or lack thereof acquiring metric rubber for our 400/412's. If your Fcar isn't an '88 or "89 which was fiited with 16" wheels stock and haven't switched to non OEM wheels you are, like me perhaps, stuck in the soup line waiting for TRX's from whatever source you choose.
I would like very much like to preserve the stock look of original wheels. I have found an alternative which would require about 35 firmly interested parties. A local aluminum wheel fabricator has offered to produce wheels identical in appearance to the non dished 412 wheels in 16 inches. These wheels would be race quality. They would not have the Ferrari script logo nor a "made in Italy" raised lettering on the reverse side. They would also be polished aluminum and would require painting if desired.
If enough of us pooled our order for the 16" wheels our cost would be approximately $400.00 per. More demand might lower price but an order of not less than 120 units yielded the $400.00 quote. I never discussed with the shop owner production time or the particulars of track certification. If there is sufficient genuine interest we could pursue the matter. My only reward would be the shared purchase price. Producing a full set for myself alone was not fiscally reasonable.
Waiting for outdated overpriced TRX's from whatever source will become a re-occurring nightmare without switching to 16" or larger wheels and is definitely not a 'Ferrari joy of ownership' benefit.
Will seek answers to any questions posted. 330Guy
Here are some photos of OE metric wheels (left) and the superperformance 16" wheels. I have the spacers described above and the wheels sit properly on the car. Modern tires are so much nicer to use too; I picked Yokahama Avids. I do prefer the dished look of the OE wheel but won't be going back to TRX's any time soon.
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Close up of OE wheel
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Thanks for posting those pictures Christian. While the original wheels look to me to be much finer looking in the casting than the Superformance, I doubt that the differences in appearance are noticeable to the casual observer and certainly the benefits of the modern rubber would outweigh that slight drawback.
Michelin states that the currently sold TRX tires are "manufactured using todays techniques and materials". Does that mean that they can match the performance of today's tires?
I am not surprised that Michelin has updated the compound but the tread is unchanged. I never thought the tread was bad for an all-weather tire, I have done steady 75+ in drenching rains and they held road and no sign of aquaplaning. I have an FCA friend that has a video of my car doing a rally in the snow. The wear rate is quite good too. I got 25k miles and rears were pretty worn and fronts were good except outside edge.
Remember why Michelin 'invented' TRX. Their tires became industry standard for long wear but goodness they gave a harsh ride and if car was not designed for them it was harsh on the rest of suspension. So the 45 degree bead was their attempt for a nice ride and still have long wear. They had to go metric sizes because they feared tire shops putting a 90 degree bead tire on a TRX rim or vice versa. Tires would fall off the rims!
Question... Is it possible to squeeze a 16 inch tire onto one of these Metric wheels? I mean with all the choices out there. I would think there would be a way. I am looking to go low profile and they are not going on a Ferrari, I have Volvo I want to squeeze these wheels on.
Its just a fantasy but please someone tell me I can do it and I will try it....
I have the 180 tr 415 wheels I believe were on the 400.