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RM/Gooding's how to monitor the auctions?

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by elads, Jan 16, 2009.

  1. WJHMH

    WJHMH Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 5, 2001
    21,240
    Panther City, Texas
    Full Name:
    Will
    I just checked another thread, $560k hammer, $616k out the door.
     
  2. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,234
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    I do want to comment that Gooding's website was awesome for this auction. The live feed was quite fast, the picture quality excellent and the fact that you could thumb through the catalog all on the same screen made it fun to watch on line. They've just set the standard as far as I'm concerned.
     
  3. readplays

    readplays Formula 3

    Aug 22, 2008
    1,637
    New York City
    Full Name:
    Dave Powers
    Thanks Cris and Bill for the coverage throughout.

    Granted, there were some strong sales today bucking the group as a whole trending in the other direction.
    Nonetheless, I'm

    Astonished

    that a 250 Cal is bringing this kind of money. It made absolutely no sense to me when they were $4-5MM (ignoring the CE $10MM car) last year in a wide-open market. I love the car and am a huge fan of barn finds, but still... just don't get it.
    I'm just a guy on the sidelines who is still receiving a failing grade in 250 Cal Valuation class.
    Cheers.
     
  4. targanero

    targanero Formula 3

    May 31, 2005
    1,647
    New York
    Full Name:
    Simon
    #229 targanero, Jan 17, 2009
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2009
    275 gts trend at RM Auctions:

    2003: $159k
    2004: 220k
    2005: 253k
    2006: 242k
    2007: 562k
    2008: 511k
    2008: 441k
    2009: 350k

    these are the cars that sold including last night's.
     
  5. DF1

    DF1 F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 10, 2007
    16,473
    BaWü
    +1 they set the standard. Barrett is pathetic
     
  6. Tenney

    Tenney F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2001
    3,454
    Same car?
     
  7. 355michael

    355michael Rookie

    Sep 1, 2006
    41
    Phila Area
    Can some one let me know what that car goes off at if anyone is there
     
  8. Tenney

    Tenney F1 Rookie
    Consultant

    Feb 21, 2001
    3,454
    Agreed. Cool they're discreet w/bidder coverage, too.
     
  9. premieram

    premieram Karting

    Jun 10, 2004
    208
    All over the place
    Full Name:
    Joseph T. Seminetta
    That is very interesting that you know that for sure. Now I can not bid with confidence.
     
  10. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jan 11, 2008
    41,186
    Sarasota
    Full Name:
    David
    The folks at B/J seem to love being seen. Different crowd.
     
  11. regaliaconcours

    regaliaconcours Formula Junior

    Jul 6, 2006
    307
    Sun Valley
    Full Name:
    MICHAEL REGALIA
    I

    Hi Jim, I represented my client for 90120 last August. It was a 1939 T150 CSS With Marcel Pourtout coachwork(only 3 known). That particular car had a very good and extensive period racing history with many, many wins to it's credit. It was in largely as raced original and very good condition in my clients hands for nearly 50 years. I believe the reason it did so well is because, (1) it's rarity(much rarer than the Figoni bodied cars), (2) it's racing pedigree, (3) it's original condition, and (4) this car is one of only a handful of custom coachbuilt cars that was actually a competition car. Not to many cars(especially pre-war can qualify as a comp car and custom coach built show car. Best Mike
     
  12. SCantera

    SCantera Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 4, 2004
    1,760
    Living Falls NC
    "I'm just a guy on the sidelines who is still receiving a failing grade in 250 Cal Valuation class."

    You are not alone. Think about the 250 cab II that goes for 10% or less of the Cal. Is it much different of a drive? Doubt it. If one is wealthy enough to garner the cream of the crop then the Cal is part of the collection. If you are a driver and enthusiast that gets the blood flowing when the oil warms then the cab II is every bit of the car even if it does not have as much sex or $$ appeal.
     
  13. Vintage V12

    Vintage V12 Formula 3

    Aug 11, 2004
    1,438
    #238 Vintage V12, Jan 17, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 17, 2009
    It is interesting that many people are thrilled that Vintage Ferrari prices have come down. Why is that? Is it because they are dreaming of purchasing a car at some point or just like to see other people lose part of their equity? Are these the same people who will go to a concours this year and laugh and point at the guy who bought say a 275gtb for over a million last year? What is it? I would think if you had true passion for the marque and understood how special each of cars were, you would be upset that the monetary values were dropping. just a thought......
     
  14. DF1

    DF1 F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 10, 2007
    16,473
    BaWü
    IF the cars are special then the value doesnt matter at 1$ or 10mil$ does it? I enjoyed the atmosphere today as its a great CAR event. The values are just that values. I see cars I love and others Im just amazed anyone would love at all :) Its just cars and some of the most special cars to me were the least exspensive I owned. My 76 Alfetta GT was the first car I put any restoration work into and was also my car to serve me my last year in college. I met a nice Italian girl and spent many weekends on the road to her place. Worthless in this market but I made it perfect and taught the girlfriend how to drive a stick in it. Rust bucket that it was, and became again, but memories of that little 4 cyl injected motor, nice red paint, the hot Marelli distributor, factory header and Isabella Patricia Simini were all good :)

    I do not take pleasure in loss but these are cars, subject to market values, and loss is part of the game at all times.
     
  15. Vintage V12

    Vintage V12 Formula 3

    Aug 11, 2004
    1,438
    #240 Vintage V12, Jan 17, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 17, 2009
    Sounds perfect. Memories like that are priceless.
     
  16. readplays

    readplays Formula 3

    Aug 22, 2008
    1,637
    New York City
    Full Name:
    Dave Powers
    That's a no-brainer. Having had the extraordinary fortune of riding in and driving my friends' 250 GTO (in college!) or one more drive in my $4k clapped-out Sunbeam Alpine with Isabelle.

    Isa :)
     
  17. Mang

    Mang F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Rossa Subscribed

    Jul 11, 2007
    4,206
    Tahoe
    Full Name:
    Mike S.
    Alfa's will do that to you :)
     
  18. Cris Bertschi

    Cris Bertschi Formula Junior

    Mar 3, 2005
    788
    Buenos Aires
    Full Name:
    Cristián Bertschi
    It´s been great fun today!
    Hope this live coverage sets the new standard.
    See you in Paris for Retromobile!
    Regards.
    Cris.-
     
  19. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Honorary

    Oct 23, 2002
    32,118
    Full Name:
    Jim Glickenhaus
    Werd!
     
  20. shill288

    shill288 Formula Junior

    Feb 24, 2005
    899
    West Coast
    Full Name:
    Steve Hill
    Bill,

    You're not kidding. I inspected the car for a few hours when it was still in Scotts Valley and made an offer for $3.5M in the September time-frame when things had started to turn South and I wasn't sure just how far South we were going to go. (And, no, I don't know now either.) It needs the full blow, but it's real, has the important stuff, and time & money would fix it.

    Steve
     
  21. richardowen

    richardowen Formula Junior

    Apr 2, 2004
    837
    Montreal, Canada
    #246 richardowen, Jan 18, 2009
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2009
    Your example of 90120 is misleading, as this is a 1 of 3 Pourtout-bodied car.

    Of the Figoni cars:

    90105 fetched $3 ,535,000 in 2005 and $3.52 million today, it hasn't dropped 30% in value.
    90117 sold in 2006 for 3.55 million
    90034 sold in 2005 for $3 685 000
     
  22. Ashman

    Ashman Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Sep 5, 2002
    27,713
    MA
    Full Name:
    John
    I could only monitor the auction online until Lot 37 the Lusso s/n 5215 but what a pleasure to watch it live! A fantastic contrast to the circus at Barrett Jackson. Many of the selling prices in the early going seemed to be well below the low estimates but were hammered sold anyway, indicating to me that those reserves were also pretty low. Examples were the 1937 Olds sold at $82K vs. low est. of $120K, the Daytona coupe sold at $260k vs. $300K low est. (probably just over the reserve as auctioneer announced he was selling the car just before he hammered it), the RR Silver Ghost at $725K vs. $800K est, Alfa TZ-1 sold at $400K vs. $550K low est., Duesenberg J at $740K vs. $950K, and of course the Lusso at $640K vs. $700.

    Seems as though at least some of the sellers had realistic views of the current market and set their reserves appropriately in order to make sure their cars sold.
     
  23. richardowen

    richardowen Formula Junior

    Apr 2, 2004
    837
    Montreal, Canada
    If the Ministrelli collection had had reserves, and those top cars didn't sell, how many people would scream apocalypse on their rooftops and blame the economy?
     
  24. velocetwo

    velocetwo F1 World Champ

    Dec 11, 2006
    12,461
    Left Coast
    I tuned in and was disappointed. The transmission was spotty. The screen size was too small and the camera angle didn't show enough cars. It felt like I was watching TV back in the 50's! How is this setting the standard?? Auction houses really need to get with the program.
     
  25. richardowen

    richardowen Formula Junior

    Apr 2, 2004
    837
    Montreal, Canada
    #250 richardowen, Jan 18, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    "1960 Ferrari 250 GT SWB California Spider IS Top Selling Lot of the 2009 Scottsdale Auction Week AT $4.95 million REPRESENTING SECOND HIGHEST PRICE EVER PAID FOR AN INDIVIDUAL CAR IN ARIZONA AUCTION WEEK HISTORY"
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