Ron : Hamilton the best in F1

beating your teammate is one thing - beating quicker cars is something else altogether. Anyone remember Schumacher in a Jordan ?

 

+100

 

The reasoning I think is reversed. Senna, Schumacher and Alonso achieved results in cars that weren't supposed to be able to produce those results. The same can be said for someone like Vettel in a Torro Rosso. The car is a great part in the total package. If a driver does things beyond the capabilities of the car, it really shows how good that driver is. Hamilton did not get a chance so far to show how good he is that way. The same arguement has been brought up numerous times when discussing Massa. He's only as good as the Ferrari according to some. Put him in a lesser car and he's nowhere. The current results of Alonso show that this is evident for all drivers, even for a two time WC.

If someone claims - like RD does - that a driver is the best than it's only normal that people don't judge him only for the achievement that you mention (beating his teammate) but for other reasons as well. QED is a bit too soon IMO.

 

As you say LH hasn't driven a lesser car (and may never do so) so we don't know for sure what he could do in one, but to suggest, as some on here appear to do, that he could never be considered a great driver unless he has done that is, in my view, nonsense. Wringing the very best out of a middling car might be an indicator of a special driving talent but not having done it does not exclude a driver from being great. If Schumacher had only ever driven the best cars would we be suggesting he wasn't a great driver?

 

Thing is Pete, and this is IMO, I believe LH would be showing the exact same skill in a mid pack car, and there isn't any real reason to believe otherwise. You see in the wet it evens up the playing field up a bit, and we know how good is his, you see I remember last year on here folk we're saying erm I wonder how good he is in the wet, someone posted a youtube clip of him in the karts, flooded track ,and woow the feel he had was simply stunning knowing how far to push it, its a natural born talent IMO, he won it from way back.

We probably won't ever be able to solve this until such a time he is put in a back marker, or Mclaren make a crap car thats if he doesn't retire, hope not but we shall see.

 

WAY too soon!! Good post. Alonso is only human afterall and so is LH. Felipe is currently thrashing both the former 2xWDC, the current WDC and LH of late. RD is only a bit biased!

 

In time we will be able to solve this Steve. There is no doubt about his talent and achievements in the lesser formulae. He will be in F1 for some years to come. We will see how good he is in all sorts of circumstances (like you said he has already shown to be good in the wet) and if he deserves to be called the best. Right now it's too early to make such statements. What we *can* do is predict he will be the best. Or better put: one of the best. RD's statement is too absolute and biased.

 

I can go along with that..

 

I feel there is a bit of a difference between finding sponsorship to finance your racing and being signed at 13 by McLaren and having the resources of a formula one team at your disposal. LH hasn't had near the struggles that many other drivers have had. Humble beginings? Maybe, but the Hamiltons haven't had to worry about money for Lewis' racing for over 10 years now.

 

Luis, this thread could run for ten years, and you still won't like him............

 

Yet he is right.

 

(In your opinion) not mine.

 

So your denying that Lewis has NOT been under Ron's wing and watching eye since he was in kart's? Hey I think Lewis is the best thing to happen to F1 since Senna passed and he is an amazing driver so I am in no way dissing him.

 

Anyone that knows anything about Hamilton's family and background knows that he comes from a very humble family. Without question, there is no way that he would have been able to pursue any form or racing career without the backing they received. And lets' not forget that sponsors are demanding. If Hamilton had not delivered every year, McLaren would have terminated his sponsorship in a heartbeat. Even with sponsorship, his life was not a bed of high octane roses. I met Hamilton only 4 years ago. He was a lowly staff driver at the Bedford Autodrome driving normal punters like me around in hatchbacks. He wasn't doing this job for fun - he needed the money.

 

Lewis has a great work ethic imho and he will be a WDC someday I just wish his car was red and not silver lol!

 

Luis makes some good valid points overall, I wasn't being specific with the one your referring to. I'am not denying Ron D has been a great help. LH has a natural talent, RD invested in it and it paid off, he wasn't born with a silver spoon in mouth, like some would want to believe.
Why folk want to dissect every element of his life what he say's and what he does, to try and justify what he has achieved is beyond me. How about he is just damn good.

 

+100! I also think Lewis deserve's everything he has achieved and I apologize if my previous comment was taken as I was dissecting his achievement's, that was not my intention.

 

No prob's Gregg ..

 

LOL maybe, but I'd say what I'm saying if I liked him or not.

 

How long they HAVEN'T had to worry about money isn't the issue, it's how long they HAD to worry about it that tells a story. Lewis was karting for quite a few years before he was picked up by McLaren and for a family with little money that will have been a big drain on their limited resources. A lesser father might simply have told Lewis they couldn't afford to do it, but his was prepared to do three jobs to enable his son to keep going.

 

Yes it is very expensive to rise up through the rank's of karting these day's. I dear friend of mine just won the Scottish Association Karting Club Junior Rotax title and it was a HUGE financial struggle/burden for him and his family. We are worried that he will not be able to progress and I'm currently trying to help him secure some sort of sponsorship help. I can provide a link to his website to anyone that may be interested.

Sorry to go so o/t everyone I tend to ramble so carry on! lol

 

Sam Moffat?

The son of an acquaintance of mine has recently started karting at the age of ten and is already showing promise, beating the lap record for his age on the Larkhall track in his first year. Fortunately his family can afford to support him, but it is an expensive business.

 

Yes Sam Moffat, what a small world! I'm gonna try to help him secure some sort of sponsorship so his very promising career does not die due to sponsorship reason's.

 

He seems to be good, it would be a great shame if lack of money forced him to give up the sport.

 

The internet makes it a small world indeed, good luck to him.

You getting much rain up there Ian, its non stop here I mean it, terrible.