SCG 003 and SCG 003C (formerly known as "P 33") | Page 12 | FerrariChat
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SCG 003 and SCG 003C (formerly known as "P 33")

Discussion in 'Special Projects & Concept Cars' started by Napolis, Mar 15, 2013.

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  1. jcosta79

    jcosta79 Formula 3

    Nov 15, 2011
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    LaJonathan
    #276 jcosta79, Apr 8, 2013
    They exist. Lotus has the Elise/Exige.
     
  2. MacGeek

    MacGeek Formula Junior

    Oct 4, 2007
    368
    Torino, Italy
    #277 MacGeek, Apr 8, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2013
    Yes, the V6 you see on the Diva has been used on several Alfa Romeos from 1979 to 2005. Its latest evolution is the 3.2L 24-valve version used on the 147 and 156 GTA (250hp version), and on the GT, 166, GTV/Spider, and Lancia Thesis (240hp version).

    A 3.5L version was in the works, and was used on the 156 GTAm and 156 SW Autodelta show cars. It never reached poduction, but a few ex-development units are floating around.

    There was a (single) turbo version as well, 2.0L 12-valve with 210hp.

    No direct injection, no variable valve timing. It would probably be difficult to make one of those V6s meet current emission regulations.

    When production ended, Cosworth reportedly wanted to buy the tooling from Fiat and keep making them, but the deal fell through.
     
  3. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #278 Napolis, Apr 8, 2013
    Cool engine but as we have to meet emission standards it wouldn't work.

    Thanks for info.
     
  4. Bill S

    Bill S Formula 3

    Oct 2, 2004
    1,995
    #279 Bill S, Apr 8, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2013
    Maybe start with a Radical? Seems like it meets most of the criteria out of the box.

    http://www.sr3sl.com/
     
  5. alberto

    alberto Formula 3

    Aug 25, 2001
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    Alberto
    #280 alberto, Apr 10, 2013
    Would it still be road legal of one did that? Is it legal for racing in the particular category it's gong to race? I'm pretty sure F1 requires rear view mirrors, which is why they have done away with them.
     
  6. MacGeek

    MacGeek Formula Junior

    Oct 4, 2007
    368
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    #281 MacGeek, Apr 10, 2013
    Volkswagen is using rear view cameras on the XL1, so I guess it can be done, maybe through an exemption.
     
  7. JeremyJon

    JeremyJon F1 Veteran

    Jul 28, 2010
    7,569
    Calgary, Canada
    #282 JeremyJon, Apr 10, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  8. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #283 Napolis, Apr 10, 2013
    We've begun Engineering studies where we're comparing 20 cars.

    A key metric for us will be weight/torque vs geometrical factor (ratio of wheelbase to track)
    and we're very hopeful that we can get very close to M600, La Ferrari and P1. (Venom is off the charts)

    We think 950KG is obtainable and our engineers think we'll be able to make that in downforce at 125mph. We think we'll have 550NM of torque at 1500-5000rpm's and as we'll gear to VMAX of 300KPH our acceleration will be brisk.

    We're leaning to a manual sequential gearbox.

    On a weight to wheelbase metric we'll be about at a Lotus Elise S just off an X-Bow GT.

    Our working name is SCG 003. (The Third One Off of Scuderia Cameron Glickenhaus)
     
  9. Ferrari 360 CS

    Ferrari 360 CS F1 Veteran

    Dec 4, 2004
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    Jacques
    #284 Ferrari 360 CS, Apr 11, 2013
    I might be well off the mark here but surely to get such a high downforce number at that relatively low speed you will need quite a few spoilers/wings which would increase drag or are you looking at movable devices like Pagani uses.
     
  10. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #285 Napolis, Apr 11, 2013
    We have several interesting ideas we're perusing including active aero but they will be integrated into the overall design nicely.
     
  11. rossocorsa13

    rossocorsa13 F1 Rookie

    Jun 10, 2006
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    #286 rossocorsa13, Apr 11, 2013
    Jim, am I understanding these principles correctly...

    You're studying how the geometric layout of the car's footprint will produce the desired performance (grip under acceleration, lateral grip) given the weight and power you're aiming for.

    M600, LaFerrari, and P1 all have massive power/weight, but they perform well in all performance categories because of proper geometry/size. Venom has insane power/weight and spins its wheels probably in 5th gear, as the chassis wasn't engineered for the given power output.

    Correct?

    Thanks for keeping us updated.
     
  12. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #287 Napolis, Apr 11, 2013
    Geometric Ratio is how square the car is. When the wheelbase is the same as the track it's square. As the wheelbase increases the ratio becomes rectangular. Shorter wheelbases are generally more maneuverable and longer wheelbases are more stable at high speed. The key is to keep the ratio in the best spot and still have high speed stability. The Venom is capable of such high VMAX that for stability it's good it's wheelbase is long but on a short track it wouldn't be as maneuverable. We're aiming for the sweet spot and think we'll be there. By limiting our VMAX to 300KPH we can reduce the ratio but still remain stable at VMAX.

    Torque v weight will be outstanding and our acceleration will be in La Ferrari/P1/M600 territory.
     
  13. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    #288 Napolis, Apr 11, 2013
  14. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #289 Napolis, Apr 11, 2013
  15. TestShoot

    TestShoot F1 World Champ
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    #290 TestShoot, Apr 11, 2013
  16. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #291 Napolis, Apr 11, 2013
    The key is deciding what you want the car to be and designing to accomplish that. Smooth, instant turn in without inducing oversteer for example.
     
  17. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #292 Napolis, Apr 12, 2013
    We're looking into large venturi tunnels though the chassis and making SCG 003 a road going ground effect car on the bottom under tray.
     
  18. f308jack

    f308jack F1 Rookie

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    #293 f308jack, Apr 15, 2013
    That would of course be an 'easy' way to get it to stick, but there are some large downsides to that.
    Racetracks tend to have smooth surfaces, whereas normal roads do not. You notice the difference when you come home from a track-day in your track road-legal car, the road that seemed to smooth in the morning when you went to the track now seems horrific.

    I much doubt that normal roads are anywhere near good enough to maintain a workable constant in ground effect as a main contributor to overall downforce, unless you can somehow keep air from entering under the car.

    2cts,

    Jack.
     
  19. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #294 Napolis, Apr 15, 2013
    We have some ideas about how to make that work on the road. Remember our intergrated three wing design on the topside will be a bit different than what's been done before.
     
  20. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jim Glickenhaus
    #295 Napolis, Apr 19, 2013
  21. TestShoot

    TestShoot F1 World Champ
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    #296 TestShoot, Apr 19, 2013
    tune them so it whistles at speed ;)
     
  22. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #297 Napolis, Apr 21, 2013
  23. NeuroBeaker

    NeuroBeaker Advising Moderator
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    Andrew
    #298 NeuroBeaker, Apr 21, 2013
    Overall, the 4C looks quite nice but the strange headlight clusters remind me of some sort of arachnid. I can't understand how they fit into the overall design. :eek:

    All the best,
    Andrew.
     
  24. Napolis

    Napolis Three Time F1 World Champ
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    #299 Napolis, Apr 21, 2013
    I think it looks pretty good in this video.

    Cheers
     
  25. SVCalifornia

    SVCalifornia F1 Rookie
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    #300 SVCalifornia, Apr 21, 2013
    Cool intro!

    Last Thursday I ran into an 8C at the Ferrari dealership in the same pearl white exterior. I'd never seen one up close and initially I thought it was a 4C due to its diminutive appearance. But it said 8C on the console and I liked the simple lines and elegant curves. Substantially carried into the 4C but more intimately sized, the car appeals. But...

    As near as I can tell Alfa is blowing it big time by having such an obscure US launch. No one seems to know any details about when or where or how a launch will happen. Given the long history of defeat in the US market, Alfa has to get this right to have a chance of succeeding. Can't see any evidence of a plan suggesting they plan to succeed I'm afraid. Marchionne should be all over this with the Alfa management given all the European auto market madness...

    Wish it were better!

    SV
     
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