Schu in Another car

If all of the cars finish the race right?
I think if MS was in a different car, he would have to use his skill to close the gap, instead of last week where he opened the gap. It would make for better racing, that is a fact!

 

I would say it would take at least a year to have consistent wins. reason being, his huge success being strapped into ferrari belts has a lot to do with his feedback on the car and the teamwork that strives for excellence. as for a one or two race win - maybe. but if the manufacturer starts with a "J" or an "M", probably not.

 

Schumi is great and all, but those other cars seem to really be behind the curve. Ferrari is fast because of Schumacher and Schumacher is fast because of his team. They go hand in hand. You can take away the team, and Schumacher may still be fast, but I wouldn't expect him to be dominating like he is now.

 

We already live that case when MS arrived to Ferrari in 1996, he drove fantastic races like Spain 96 with a less than perfect Ferrari.

Regards,

Jorge

 

Given 2 years for MS to develop a car without unuseful budget constraints, and the same for JPM. MS would still drive away from JPM.

 

How are JPM's car developing capabilities? How does this compareto the other top tier drivers car developing capabilities? Furthermore, how does one "develop" a car in today's F1 environment. I can understand 8-5 years ago things might have been different.........but in today's computerized environment? Could a person like JB be credited for the enormous performance increase in the BAR car? Or Webber making an average car a points contender(especially with a shoestring budget)?

 

Mr. Payne,

It has to do with giving the proper feedback to the team to develop the car correctly. One person might go out there and say it twitches. One person might say it gives a little understeer. But to give the correct assessment of what the car is or isn't doing, allowing the team with Michael's inputs to make the changes is critical. Believe it or not, not all teams work this way.

 

Those are statements of drivers who CANNOT develop cars.

{A contrived example} The driver who CAN develop a car will say "after I add steering input in Turn 2 and feed in some gas, the inside rear tire won't take the same kind of forces that it will take in turn 7 under identical inputs". An engineer can then look at the track data, telemetry, and other stuff and decide that the rebound on the front shocks is greater than optimal.

Michael understand the physics of car performance and is articulate in telling the engineers what he feels and what he thinks and is clear on which is which.

 

All the computerized models in the world and the weathermen still routinely get it competely wrong. It may be less complicated to model an F1 car, but there is still an incredible amount of variables to consider. Think about all of the different conditions they face. Different weather, different tracks, differnet track surfaces, "normal" corners, double apex corners, hairpins, tightening corners, opening corners, long straights, short straights, and on and on and on... Having a great development driver like MS is invaluable in dealing with all of this. He takes the car out, he pushes it to its limit, he brings it in and says "We need to adjust the whatsamathing so that the whosits works better." A driver that is not a good development driver comes in and says "I don't know what is wrong with the car, but something isn't right, so fix it." See the difference?


This is what happens when you take too long to write a post, someone like Mitch comes along and says essentially the same thing you are, only better!

 

Actually I believe the BEST test drivers are the drivers that can simply say what is happening and leave the required adjustments to the engineers.

Thus the driver comes in and states it is pushing in turn 3, etc. and the engineer converts this into the required adjustment.

If the driver comes in and says 3 turns up on the left front spring platform, then the engineer is not getting much information at all to work with, and thus has to do what he is told ... the pushing comment gives him far more to work with.

Bruce McLaren was very, very good at this, because being an engineer he really understood what the car was doing ... the whole physics thing.



If you put MS in a Williams he would be fighting for the lead in his first race. Remember 1996, he performed miracles in that piece of ****, and the Williams is twice the car that the then Ferrari was.

Pete

 

How is MS better than JPM...or JB or MW...seems like that is required in order to make your arguments valid.

edit: Not to be contrary, I'm just wondering where everybody is inferring that Schumi is the only person that has car development skills.....or even that he is the best.

 

Please go and watch the 1996, 97, 98 and 99 F1 seasons. When you have done that then I will discuss this with you, but you will 100% agree that MS IS far better than JPM, or JB and even MW (but I give JB and MW a bit more crediance because they are young and still learning).

We do not see MS drive anymore because his car is so good ... but in those years we were given a great demonstration of his car control.

Pete

 

So where can I buy previous tapes? I can only find highlight tapes...

 

As well as developing the car Michael has great mechanical sympathy and he can get a crappy car to do things it shouldn't do. Remember when he won in Spain with just 5th gear?
His other great attribute is the ability to motivate and inspire a team. The Ferrari team are all proud and honoured to be helping him win and he repays their loyalty in spades. Michael is always first to congratulate and thank the team (not the sponsors) for their efforts after every win. The guys love him and are more than willing to push themselves harder to get the wins. A mechanic working on Ralf Schumacher's car is going to look at his watch and wonder when he can get to the bar a lot more than a mechanic working on Michael's car.
If JPM and MS swapped cars on the grid at Imola MS would beat JPM.

 

at least we know he can't do it in a minardi..... here in his own words:

http://www.planetf1.com/Home/story_15041.shtml

 

Schumacher is without question the best driver in F1 of all time, and I believe the best that we will all see for a long time to come too. I personally think that he is one of the key forces to thank for pulling Ferrari out of their major mid 90s slump, leading them to five world titles, but he himself is the first to say it is a team thing.

However, from what I have been told from a friend who is lucky enough to have access to the Ferrari pits during testing, he is very demanding to work with - no picnic at all. He pushes the crew very, very hard, confident in his skill and what he wants from the car, able to motivate and communicate what is best for every aspect of the car. This is the best you can ask for from a pilot, and something I firmly believe that no other driver in F1 is capable of doing the way MS does.

Think back old Ferrari F1 and you think Enzo. Think modern Ferrari F1 and you think Schumacher. Strong, driving leadership is what makes Ferrari great, after all, you have a pit full of rowdy but passionate Italians - someone has to channel them

 

If MS had joined Ferrari before Prost and said they were sh*t and got fired and then Prost had joined and said they were **** and Ferrari had said "hey, that's the second guy who's said were sh*t, maybe we won't fire him we'll listen instead" things may have been different.

If MS is so good how came he hasn't got the balls to do a Rossi..........

 

Remember 1997-1998 when Schumacher clearly did not have the #1 car, yet he took Villeneuve and Hakkinen to the final race of the season for the WDC. Michael has an uncanny ability to get a cra to the finish, nurse it through techincal difficulties and sort problems out during practice and qualifying. I think he would give JPM a run for his money right off.

 

He may have been being modest. (something he is very good at)

 

He did when he joined Ferrari.

Man some of you do not know your recent history ... ??? WTF.

Ferrari were **** when MS joined, far worse than Yamaha ... and MS actually won races with them!

Before posting stupid things do some research. Ferrari has only been dominant in very recent times, infact since 2000.

Pete

 

Just read that story and I disagree.

What MS was saying is that with the present company and NO changes he could not win.

What we would see though is a very, very fast Minardi probably qualifying in the top 5 or 8 and the car probably would not finish a race ... as it would break due to the strain

What would happen though is that Minardi would get BIG sponsors and then Paul would be able to build the team in to a front runner and eventually Minardi would start winning.

Pete

 

I'm always hearing comparisons between Rossi and MS. They both dominate their sport and are awesome athletes. But I side with Michael when it comes to the "wow" factor. MS brought Ferrari out of the biggest drought they've ever had, 21 years without a championship. That isn't to take anything away from Rossi, but he sure isn't doing that with Yamaha.

 

Who stole the cream out of your donut. They won 6 (I think) in 1990 so they weren't quite as bad as you make them out to be.

 

1990 - 110 points 6 wins
1991 - 55.5 points 0 wins
1992 - 21 points 0 wins
1993 - 28 points 0 wins
1994 - 71 points 1 win
1995 - 73 points 1 win
1996 - 70 points 3 wins - Schumacher's first season with Ferrari
1997 - 102 points 5 wins
1998 - 133 points 6 wins
1999 - 128 points 6 wins -Constructor's Championship
2000 - 170 points 10 wins - Driver's and Constructor's Championships

Yeah, 1990 wasn't so bad. 1991 to 1995 is a different story - 2 race wins in five years. Ugh!