SF90 owners, now that you have it,,, would you trade for a PISTA

I had a 458 Speciale, then a 488 Pista, now a SF90 Spider. For me personally the SF90 is the easiest, safest, and most enjoyable car to drive, also because it is my first convertible. The 488 Pista was a damn good-looking car, but in my opinion the least desirable of the three. I would rather go back to a 458 Speciale than to a 488 Pista if I had to. Emotion-wise nothing beats the naturally aspirated engine. You could feel the mechanics working in your back. The sound of the 488 Pista is very sonorous and a little bit dull. Also the road-handling is not as good as the two others. But I stay with my SF90 anyway…

 

Personally, no I would not. I actually prefer the F8 over the Pista, but having had a F8, the SF90 is simply on another level in terms of overall performance. I don’t like the dated looks of the Pista (488) all that much and I think it tries too hard to be “hardcore”, when it really just has a less compliant suspension and uses r-compounds.

Now, all that said, a lot of enthusiasts like the Pista which helps its resale value. So in terms of adding it to a stable, I can see the potential financial attraction of owning one. But if it’s one or the other, the SF90 is a far superior car in my opinion. Lastly, as Anubis stated, I’d choose a 458 over a Pista as well.

 

I went from a Pista to trading it in for a lower mileage Speciale, and then a few weeks later my SF90 AF Spider was delivered. I love the looks of the Pista, and I enjoyed driving it, but something was missing to me even after swapping the exhaust. Having the spider SF90 is far more enjoyable to me than a coupe Pista, though I'd like to do away with the GPF and get an X pipe exhaust, or a valve remote at the very least, but everything seems to cause problems with these new cars. As mentioned above, the SF90 is point and shoot. I only have 250 miles on it so still breaking it in, but so far I've been craving to drive it when I can. It looks more exotic than it is given credit, I'm surrounded, and I mean SURROUNDED by carbon fiber (I ticked every box for the interior), and it feels like I'm sitting in something so completely different than the Speciale. That is what I like, the fact that I can have two insane experiences, in two very different ways. I happen to like the hybrid tech, with it being my first car that has any kind of electrical propulsion. If I had to choose from these three cars: the Pista, Speciale, or SF90, I think I'd go with the Speciale, then SF90, then Pista. To me, my Pista was achingly beautiful and it was sad to see it being flat-bedded off, but once I drove the Speciale, most was forgotten. And now with the Spider I'm open to a new world of turbo V8 experience.

 

FWIW. I have found the 458 and 488, especially Pista, needed a bit of tweaking to get to my own personal taste. I find my own personal opinion on the SF90 is somewhat in line with Chris Harris: it's tremendously awesome as a point and shoot machine- but- for me- the extra layer of digitization, the muted exhaust, the lack of storage, left me just a little bit cold and had me similarly confused as to what to do with the car. At least the spider lets you enjoy driving in open air with a wild abundance of power.

I think there is a great car lurking just beneath the surface of the SF90, but in factory form, AF or non, it's just not quite 100% there- for me at least. I suspect some tweaking would get it there. I suspect they had to setup the SF90 to be extra safe for novice drivers. It is, after all, extremely powerful. The problem is, you can still overwhelm the systems. (to be fair, this goes for any car we are discussing, its just that, with the SF90, you will get there a lot faster, and with more mass, so the consequences are bigger)

I thinking the XX will resolve most of the subjective issues. For me it definitely looks even better and more exciting. I think the standard car looks good but, like the driving experience, it's just missing a little bit of the "Ferrariness" for me.

Thats OK, not everyone will get on with every car. That's why there are choices.

I would rather pilot a 458 or 488, especially one of mine which I've made some tweaks. I appreciate their ethos more. I would say my Pista has it all for right now. But that's just me. And there is no contest in terms of speed. In fact, I had heard some people refer to the SF90 as the "Super Pista" - and it really is super fast. Point and shoot- wow, the SF90 is tough to beat. But, for me, to drive with some brio and passion, I find the Pista a more trustworthy partner.

I think these newer cars are better with the AF suspension as it seems more up to the task of keeping the masses in check- it is superior in that regard. I think the Pista actually has the best ride out of any of them- but not as good body control as the AF cars. Going back to back, I can tell, but I am also impressed at how good the relative comfort is in the AF suspension cars and also at how the body control of the older cars just feels last generation. This does not make them poor handling, it's just that the newer suspension is that much better.

For a new buyer, out of the box, I would probably recommend an SF90 or 296 over the older cars for obvious reasons.

In the end the most important thing is to find out what really connects with you and what is fun for you.

 

Always well articulated. I agree with the AF suspension. Is it bumpy at times? yes, but it is never jarring, like race mode in a 458 or 488. If I spec a 296, I suspect I’ll do AF as well.

You’ve got your Pista dialed in nicely. I still need to work on the Speciale. Maybe Novitec springs and exhaust. The SF90 screams for an exhaust. I just don’t know if it’s safe to do?!


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Thanks! You have to see what will fly in terms of compliance in California. I think the AF suspension is really amazing, but, for some the lack of lifter is a real issue. Hopefully they will find a way to include the lifter function in the future.

 

SF90 is IMO a beautiful car in person.
Presence with interior space and comfort and record breaking speeds.
Personally chose 765LT Spider over Pista but sold LT and kept Senna far more raw.
Likely sell 16M or Speciale and keep SF90 Spider and XX - imo best V8 combo.
I would go back and grab V12's vs V8's.

 

Yes, I don’t think I’ll touch the cats, but do a non-valved inconel x pipe on the speciale, and if people stop having problems, at least the x pipe inconel Novitec on the SF90. I think it would sound pretty good without GPF and getting those exhaust banks playing with each other. I have always specced a lifter, and not having one has been fine so far. There’s always the Novitec option, but I definitely wouldn’t lower the car without one.

 

It’s a very hard question really, and depends on your mood, your preferences and what you want to drive. If you want to drive something that is highly engineered, complex but still organic, with relentless pace, the SF90 is like no other, whether AF or non AF. However, sometimes you might be in a simpler mood. Wanting a car with huge torque and driveability, great looks and drives like an extension of the Ferrari V8 line - where you can feel the progression from the 360 to 430 to 458 to 488.

The Pista is super-responsive, quite a serious piece of kit and a great car. One of the best in terms of being old-school at heart but clothed in the ‘latest uniform’. Despite its brilliance, the SF90 is less of a car that you just pick up the keys to and go. You have to think a little bit more. You have both the manetino and the e-manetino, instant torque from the batteries giving instant response and lots of power with the combustion engine mating seamlessly as part of the powertrain. Plus ‘active’ front wheels with torque vectoring that keeps the front end dialled in to a sharp corner at speeds other cars just could not manage or even get close to. There is a lot to really enjoy because the beauty of the SF90 is that Ferrari managed to meld all this together into an organic driving experience, feeling natural and wonderful. But you have to think more. And that does influence its character. Which mood takes you more will be quite an influence over which car you would enjoy more of the time.

AF or non AF is more nuanced. The AF suspension is definitely better when driving on average to smooth surfaces. Call it 10/10 to 9/10. When the surface is a little more uneven, the non AF car is better, despite the AF car handling such surfaces well, given its level of stiffness. The AF suspension is certainly brilliant. But so are the magnetorheological dampers. And for us (we still have both AF and non AF, as well as Pista and Speciale) the lifter has meant that we don’t drive the AF car anymore, except track days. For roadtrips, what you lose in response, for us, is more than made up for in other areas with the non AF car.

The Speciale v Pista v SF90 is the same thing. What mood are you in? The Speciale has always been an amazing car. Playful, a car that is really fun to get to know and with a more visceral powertrain. Therein lies its brilliance, and its Achilles. The Pista on the road is more tractable, more dynamic and less tiring to drive at pace over long days. For many it will be a ‘sweet spot’ car. Much more torque than the Speciale, less assaulting on your senses and therefore tiring, faster with an insistent character - it wants you to get into the flow and just keep going with the pace up. But less of an occasion than the SF90. Simpler, less to deal with and understand. An old-school driving tool with a powerful combustion engine and a brilliant chassis. There are good reasons why you would choose a Pista. Our garage will have a Speciale, Pista and SF90 spider in it, at least in part because they are each different and cater for different moods and occasions.

 

That's why the answer to that question, on the Internet at least, is all three.

 

Great topic and feedback, I never owned a Pista but I have a bit of experience with one since my best friend owns one and I got to drive it few times, such a beautiful car but IMO it’s not at the level of the SF90, I don’t know why the SF90 seems to be the most hated model in the Ferrari modern line up LOL I have a sneaky suspicion that majority of the people who are bashing the car don’t own one, haven’t been in one or only drove one very briefly and possibly around town without the ability to use it properly.

I think I might’ve mentioned this before, the SF90 is my first new Ferrari I used to have a F355 20 years ago (damn time flies ) I have a lot of other sports cars from P and L etc, the only brand I don’t own is McLaren.

To me If you could only have one the SF90 is the most complete car you can buy at the moment, if you go for the Spider in order to add the open top experience there is nothing else you would need in a two seater exotic.
I have a Revuelto on order and I just saw the Huracan replacement at the factory in Italy and that car blew me away, I can not wait to drive it but until such time I get to experience these cars I will maintain that the SF90 is the perfect exotic.

My comparison which I find most relevant to this discussion comes from driving the SF90 and my F488 Challenge back to back on a race track, same track, same conditions, temps etc.
All I can say is that I was faster in the SF90, it was easier to drive, it felt equally or as planted it actually blew my mind after I outlapped myself in the Challenge car I just drove home in the SF90 with the top down.

Few detractors, my Challenge was almost out of tyre I had about 50km left on those slicks, after few laps I would say around 10 or so of an approx 3 km track the SF90 was struggling with the brakes, there is no hiding from its weight but still the performance of the car is mind boggling, twisty mountain roads, long highway stretches, race track and boulevard cruising it does it all effortlessly, honestly I have the most mileage on this car I can’t put it away.

If I was to relate the experience above to the differences between the SF90 and the Pista considering the fact that the F488 Challenge is a very hardcore Pista to me Pista would lose every time to the SF90 and I would never chose it over the SF90.

IMO if you can only buy one car which you want sometimes to be chilled in, take your wife or girlfriend out and hit the track after you drop her off you must have the SF90 if you want a screamer just for yourself and you aren’t into the latest hybrid tech take the Speciale, to me the Pista sits in the no man’s land in this comparison.

 

I wish I could’ve liked this brilliant post 10 times! As much as I started to hate cars forums the reason I come back is that from time to time you get these nuggets of brilliance, thank you!

 

May do X pipe - asking dealer to install after market and make sure no warranty is void and not detectable for emissions.
Lambo SV offered factory race exhaust / tune - perfection. First service dealer / factory had an update software eliminating tune. 15,000 wasted.

 

Fantastic posts! Well done!!


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In my experience with other road cars, this is mostly due to road biased brake fluids. Draining the fluids and putting in DOT 4 fluids solves the overheating issue. But these fluids need to be drained again, before normal road use is resumed.

 

that makes a lot of sense but I won’t be using the car on the track, it was just a one off because I wanted the compare them when the XX gets here I will use that on the track.

Pardon my ignorance but what would be the issue using DOT 4 on the road ?

 

wow wow wow and I am not into red Ferraris but this is just perfect! What combo is the interior?

 

This is actually a very good question. In theory DOT 4 is perfectly suitable for road use, but in practice it tends to absorb moisture quicker, making it dangerous if not drained regularly.

 

thank you for your reply.

 

Glad to hear this as my Speciale will be joined with an SF90 spider shortly. I like the comparison you made of a raw NA V8 compared to a more technical hybrid turbo V8 with immense power.

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Do you have any renders of your SF90 you want to share? I love white Ferraris, I am thinking to go white on my XX