Sharing a Ferrari | FerrariChat

Sharing a Ferrari

Discussion in 'New York Tri-State' started by kmadden, Jun 21, 2011.

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  1. kmadden

    kmadden Rookie

    Jun 10, 2011
    2
    #1 kmadden, Jun 21, 2011
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2011
    I'm thinking about joining forces with a few other likeminded people to buy a 328 or similar, with the aim of sharing its use along with the purchase and maintenance costs. Does anyone have any experience, positive or negative, with something like this? Or otherwise have an opinion?
     
  2. Eli355

    Eli355 Formula Junior

    Oct 12, 2010
    678
    Long Island, NY
    Full Name:
    Eli
    How many former friends do you plan on sharing it with?
     
  3. ClydeM

    ClydeM F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 4, 2003
    11,938
    Wayne, NJ
    Full Name:
    Clyde E. McMurdy
    And how many arguments do you plan on having like
    "Does it really need ALL the suspension bushings replaced for $2K?"

    Who is going to own/register/insure it?
    WHo is going to house it?
     
  4. Lenvo65

    Lenvo65 Formula Junior

    Apr 3, 2005
    293
    Bergen Cty NJ
    For all the reasons Clyde points out, never mind the first time someone comes back with damage to the car, maybe your better off joining one of the car sharing clubs. There are a number in the area, Gotham Dream Car, Vulcan, and in Manhattan the classic car club has a 328 in its fleet (http://www.classiccarclubmanhattan.com/ourcars.php)
     
  5. dailyferraridriver

    dailyferraridriver Formula 3
    Owner

    Nov 12, 2010
    1,402
    New Jersey
    Full Name:
    Erik
    I don't see this as that big of an issue - people with planes do it all the time - split the cost of the plane, hangar, maintenance cost, insurance, and split it depending on the # of hours they used the plane.

    I'd be up for something like this - on an F40 or California. (odds of finding anyone to split these are slim to none).

    Erik
     
  6. pad

    pad Formula 3

    Sep 30, 2004
    1,426
    Tequesta, FL
    Full Name:
    Paul Delatush
    The concept seems to work with boats and planes - not so much with cars and wives....
     
  7. FerrariRFan

    FerrariRFan Karting

    Mar 1, 2010
    118
    Basking Ridge, NJ
    Full Name:
    Richard Fan
    I agree. How often does someone come back with a damaged plane? Cars on the other hand is quite different. I think this is a quick way to make your friends ex-friends. I wouldn't do it.
     
  8. ChipG

    ChipG Formula 3

    May 26, 2011
    1,762
    Santa Monica, CA
    #8 ChipG, Jun 22, 2011
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2011
    Sounds like a nightmare but if you HAVE to do this think about setting up a corporation for the car, say there are 4 people sharing it, each will own 25% stock in the corporation.

    Each person will put in $5k more than the cost of the car, example: the 328 you want to buy costs $40k so each person puts in $15k then $2k a year plus $ X amount driven per mile per member, you use the extra $20k at the beginning to register it to the corporation and PRE pay sales tax, property taxes and insurance and have a reserve left over for maintenance.

    You will also need some sort of clause where if another member can not pay for the expenses his shares will revert to the other 3 owners (example: he blows the engine and the $15k reserve is not enough to fix it and he cannot come up with the money).

    I'd run from the idea, sounds like a bad horror movie but if you have to do this consider what I said above.

    I own an aircraft, I have never had a partner in it but some friends have, I have heard good and bad stories about their experiences. Aircraft is completely different tho than a car.
     
  9. ClydeM

    ClydeM F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Nov 4, 2003
    11,938
    Wayne, NJ
    Full Name:
    Clyde E. McMurdy
    True. A Ferrari wont fall out of the sky at 20,000 feet and kill the operator due to lack of maintenance. Unless your in a Bond movie.


    And, if somebody brings back the car with the engine making nasty noises - parks it for the next guy - who's to say when it happened? Run away from this.
     
  10. kmadden

    kmadden Rookie

    Jun 10, 2011
    2
    Thank you for all of your responses. All of them have very valid points and I really appreciate you sharing them.

    I can definitely see why most people wouldn’t touch this with a 10ft barge pole. However I think with a sensible approach, and the right mix of people, it could work. There’s no doubt that conflict will ensue at some point but in any sort of partnership that’s inevitable. If it does work, I would probably look to leverage the same system with additional, perhaps even less attainable vehicles. If it doesn’t, then at least I gave it a go.

    ChipG. Despite your reservations about doing this yourself, your suggestions are actually pretty close to the way I was thinking of setting this up:

    4 people max. 25% equitable share each in the car. Charge more than the cost of the car for the initial investment to start a healthy reserve fund. Everyone gets the same mileage allowance but can purchase more by adding to the reserve fund.

    In addition, in order to simplify scheduling and minimize handovers I like the idea of everyone having the car for one month at a time (2 months total each per year between April and November). If weather permits, bonus usage during the winter months. Pickups would be the first weekend of the month, and drop offs the last weekend. This should give me time to inspect and prepare the car prior to the next usage.

    I’ve put some thought into the questions some of you raised:

    Maybe you’re better off joining one of the car sharing clubs
    I’ve definitely considered it. But take the Classic Car Club for example. To get 8 weeks of driving time in the 328 you’re looking at upwards of 13 thousand dollars of money you’ll never see again. What I’m trying to do is get around 8 weeks of usage each for around $5K in dues annually. That’s $20K a year that can go to toward the upkeep & improvement of the car, and anything that’s left over when the car is sold can be split four ways. The initial investment for an equitable quarter share in the car, let’s say is 10K (Not including 1st years dues), and hopefully you’ll see most of that back.

    I had actually looked into starting a “for profit” operation with just one car, but could not find a feasible way to get proper insurance, especially in New York. This led me to consider the “none profit” model which, from what I can tell, is not subject to the same insurance complications.

    Who is going to own/register/insure it?
    I’m planning on creating an LLC to register the car under. As for insurance, I would name all drivers on the same policy. I’ve found a company that will allow me to add up to five drivers to the same policy, even though it’s considered an exotic/collector car. Seems like most will only allow one or two drivers.

    Who is going to house it?
    I’m considering using part of the collective funds to join the Collectors Car Garage in Bedford, NY (www.collectorscargarage.com). This would be a great place to house the car during the winter months, allow for use of their facilities throughout the year (detailing bays, club lounge, events etc.) and be a neutral place to pick up and drop off the car. Whilst someone has the car in their possession, they would have the option of keeping it there if convenient, or at their home, providing they have a garage.

    If somebody brings back the car with the engine making nasty noises - parks it for the next guy - who's to say when it happened?
    Furthermore, who’s to say that it happened due to neglect rather than normal wear and tear. Yes, this is a tricky one. Firstly, I’m hoping that a reasonable security deposit along with a high level of due diligence with potential co-owners (MVR reports, Background checks, interview etc.) will help minimize the shenanigans that may occur whilst the car is being driven. Secondly, I would plan to have any handover of the car go through me first so I can record any damage/issues and hold the last driver responsible if there’s any obvious neglect, and/or address any apparent issues. Of course there will be times when fingers get pointed and I think a well thought out contract that makes provisions for those instances will help keep the grief to a minimum.

    Does it really need ALL the suspension bushings replaced for $2K?
    I think the contract needs to stipulate that all recommended service is performed, leaving no room for argument.

    Anyway, If anyone has any other suggestions or comments, I’d love to hear them. And of course if anyone is interested in getting involved in something like this let me know.
     
  11. dailyferraridriver

    dailyferraridriver Formula 3
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    Nov 12, 2010
    1,402
    New Jersey
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    Erik
    Check your PM

    Erik
     
  12. TimN88

    TimN88 F1 Veteran

    Jun 12, 2001
    5,054
    Northeast
    Full Name:
    Tim
    #12 TimN88, Jun 23, 2011
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2011
    You would probably be much better off buying a 308 on your own, even if you have to save up for a while, and learning how to work on it yourself to cut down on maintenance costs. I have never shared a car, or owned a Ferrari, but I have been a member of a club that shares 7 aircraft and the biggest problem I have had was people not washing the bugs off following a flight. That is probably because there is so much preventative maintenance on a plane that things dont break too often so your costs, while high, are fairly fixed. Sharing a car and a plane is not comparing apples to apples.
     
  13. PhilB

    PhilB Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 17, 2004
    2,320
    Southern New Jersey Shore
    Full Name:
    Phil
    Usually at most, once.

    ;)
     
  14. FerrariRFan

    FerrariRFan Karting

    Mar 1, 2010
    118
    Basking Ridge, NJ
    Full Name:
    Richard Fan
    I said COME BACK with a damaged plane. Zero :)
     
  15. AFASTA1

    AFASTA1 Rookie

    Jun 4, 2008
    37
    Montclair NJ
    Full Name:
    Jeff
    Many Ferrari owners compare their vehicles to a sexy woman. You might want to consider your proposal similarly.
     

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