Shocking Truth About McLaren Depreciation: Bargain Supercars or Money Pit? | FerrariChat

Shocking Truth About McLaren Depreciation: Bargain Supercars or Money Pit?

Discussion in 'McLarenChat.com' started by rob lay, Sep 9, 2023.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Miami 2018 Owner

    Dec 1, 2000
    60,193
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    Great video by Fourwheel Trader. Also notice the plug for our Sotheby's Motorsport about 30 seconds in.

     
    greg328 and JL350 like this.
  2. Sunshine1

    Sunshine1 F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 22, 2011
    10,037
    Miami
    Congratulations on sponsoring his channel. I like watching his videos, he does a lot of work bringing serious content with facts and trends.
     
    rob lay likes this.
  3. F456 V12

    F456 V12 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 13, 2004
    4,791
    Coto de Caza
    Full Name:
    Christian
    I admit I took a six figure haircut on my 12C Spider, the mistake I made was buying it instead of leasing. BTW, I had no problems for the 2.5 years of ownership.

    For the GT we just picked up, I have a 3 year lease, 3 year unlimited miles warranty and 3 years of service, so I know exactly what I am into this car. I can terminate the lease at any time, sure there might be some costs, but certainly far less than taking the car to term.

    MB
     
  4. 95spiderman

    95spiderman F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2003
    15,357
    ny
    Here's My Brilliant and Weird Exotic Car Pricing Theory - YouTube

    doug demuro has interesting take on collector car values. he made up a 'market cap' for exotics same as market cap for corporations. multiply # cars (shares) by their recent sale (stock) prices and get a total value for cars. mclaren was way below value of its competitors. a laferrari has a total market cap of 3 billion while a p1 is not even billion.
     
    rob lay likes this.
  5. JoeZaff

    JoeZaff F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Aug 5, 2007
    5,459
    Philly suburbs
    Full Name:
    Joe
    I have watched lots of his videos and while his actual presentations are informative, his titles are almost always clickbait. I think it undermines his credibility.

    I took a nice haircut on my 12c too. It didn't stop me from buying another.

    FWIW, in real dollars, I am much better off having bought my Mclaren Gt than the Ferrari Roma I almost bought. While the Roma may have depreciated less on a percentage basis, that does not translate into real dollars.

    Not that it matters. If was concerned about depreciation, I would have bought a GT3... but then I would have a Porsche...


    and I wanted a Mclaren.
     
    chas-3, SoCal to az, Denny413 and 4 others like this.
  6. f4udriver

    f4udriver Formula Junior

    Feb 1, 2012
    290
    Central Illinois
    Full Name:
    Mike G
    Just bought my second McLaren a red 720s spider.
    Keeping the MP4-12c as well, bought it new in 2012.
    I think the real reason for the rapid depreciation is all the rumors of expensive maintenance. Of course there are some real actual lemons out there.
    Although it can get pricey, I have found a very qualified independent and the cost is usually less than half.
    Kevin just did an inspection on the 720s today, and about 2 month ago he did quite a bit of maintenance on the 12c. All done in about 6 hours.

    Some examples of the savings;
    Main battery, dealer wanted $4,200. Kevin sold me a battery emulator for around $1,000 and I can use any battery I want. I bought a Zero Gravity for 950.00. So every time I need a new battery I will save $3,250.00. I could use an $85.00 battery if I wanted to.

    4 accumulators for the suspension dealer wanted over $4,000 Kevin was $1,900, and it took him less than an hour.

    So the crazy cost of replacing a transmission due to a leak. I have a lot of airplanes and cars that leak. When they do leak I don't replace the engine or transmission, I add oil and I keep an eye on it. Kevin said he could source used transmissions for under 10,000.

    Of course the car doesn't have quite the pedigree of one always serviced by an authorized service center. But at half the cost or less for maintenance it seems a lot more reasonable.

    I do think a lot of people like to spend the big bucks so they can feel safer with the car, or they can tell their friends about what they have to spend for bragging rights.

    Then you add in the haters. I like all cars but there are a lot of people who only like one brand and when a new competitor comes out they may feel threatened and there was a lot of hate towards Mclaren's. This didn't help.
     
    SoIllFerrari and greg328 like this.
  7. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Miami 2018 Owner

    Dec 1, 2000
    60,193
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    fair on ways to smartly save money on McLarens, but you never hear this type of reasoning from Ferrari or Porsche owners. If there is a problem, you fix it right. You use OEM parts unless the part isn’t available anymore. The dealer these days isn’t always more expensive than independents. I’m talking about Ferraris like my 355 that is 25 years old, you are already working short cuts on a 10 year old McLaren.

    There is a legit difference, but yes probably not bad as the myth. I will remind everyone I still want a McLaren bad, test driving a 12C was one of my best car experiences. In a way Ferrari should be more like McLaren with the aggressiveness.
     
    Bullfighter, greg328 and ryalex like this.
  8. JOEA2

    JOEA2 Formula 3

    Feb 2, 2006
    1,181
    Staten Island, N.Y./ Sea Girt,N.J.
    Full Name:
    Joe A
    If you liked the 12C. You won't believe the 720 S!

    Joe
     
    greg328, rob lay and ryalex like this.
  9. ryalex

    ryalex Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 6, 2003
    25,062
    Las Vegas, NV
    Full Name:
    Ryan Alexander
    I've said for a long time I wouldn't get one until they have a dealership here, and now O'Gara has opened a showroom at the Wynn and is building out a dealership. For now, the cars are displayed but the sales are technically from their CA locations (they are McLaren LA/BH and SD). I've met some of the new group, and they're courting me to finally get one. One of my best friends wants a 720S, so we're going to go drive one soon...
     
    rob lay likes this.
  10. JoeZaff

    JoeZaff F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Aug 5, 2007
    5,459
    Philly suburbs
    Full Name:
    Joe
    #10 JoeZaff, Oct 14, 2023
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2023
    FWIW, I will extend the warranty for as long as I own my GT and will be sticking with my dealers for service. Unlike Porsche and Ferrari that have been in business for 60 plus years, Mclaren is only 10 years old and independent repair shops are few and far between, so those who want to skip the dealer are very resourceful and creative. Regardless, I am lucky to have Mclaren Philly next door and they are superb so it hasn't been an issue for me. As for cost of ownership, McLaren repair/maintenance is expensive because they don't get the benefit of sharing parts with Fiat and Jeep or Volkswagen and Audi and design almost everything in house. Mclaren is a super small manufacturer, which people tend to forget. They are currently barely making more than 2K cars a year. It translates to a very special driving experience, but also to super expensive parts unless you can break the code and find a way to cross reference the parts to their supplier, which some have had a lot of success doing.
     
    ryalex and rob lay like this.
  11. f4udriver

    f4udriver Formula Junior

    Feb 1, 2012
    290
    Central Illinois
    Full Name:
    Mike G

    I don't see how any shortcuts were taken.
    ALL of the parts used were purchased from McLaren
    I also own a Ferrari and a Porsche and I have a man who works for me and does all of the work on both of them as well as my other cars.
    When I called Kevin to do the PPI on the 720s he was in Uruguay rebuilding a blown engine with a new short block.
    I would much rather have a very experienced owner of a company work on my cars rather than just one of the new kids the dealership hired.
    I don't see any shortcuts taken other than not trailering the car 200 miles to be overcharged by a dealer for no extra value.
    I have 200% more confidence in the independent rather than a dealer.
    He has the McLaren scanner and all the connections to be more reasonable.

    As far as the battery goes I think I paid $2,300 for the battery in my Mustang, (same as the Corsair and P-40). These batteries start a 2800 cubic inch, 2,000 HP motor, are subjected to 5 G's and they cost around half of what McLaren wanted. AND McLaren had no delivery date for the battery at the time. They had no idea when it would arrive.

    So what wasn't fixed right ?
     
    Denny413, ryalex and greg328 like this.
  12. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Miami 2018 Owner

    Dec 1, 2000
    60,193
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    It's not a 100 point car anymore, but I don't think you care and that is fine. The Ferrari crowd is more about keeping it as close as possible.
     
    greg328 likes this.
  13. JoeZaff

    JoeZaff F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Aug 5, 2007
    5,459
    Philly suburbs
    Full Name:
    Joe
    #13 JoeZaff, Oct 20, 2023
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2023
    Rob, there is certainly a portion of the Ferrari crowd that is like that, just as there is with almost any marque. But I have represented numerous exotic car dealers and repair facilities, and I can assure you, a solid percentage of Ferrari owners skimp on maintenance and insist on the cheapest repair work arounds, and then boast on places like this that their car is "flawless" and always maintained "With an open checkbook."

    As an FYI, the folks that he is referring to are the "McMedics" If I am not mistaken. They are VERY well known Mclaren mechanics with a reputation that rivals most dealerships. Nobody who knows Mclaren would think twice buying a car serviced by them. As for the battery, Mclaren does this crazy thing where "essentially" they have a microprocessor attached to the battery that communicates with the cars' ECU. If I am not mistaken, the battery emulator simply allows you to use a non-Mclaren battery with Mclaren. Considering the absolutely insane cost of a mclaren battery, an emulator certainly makes sense.

    As I've said before, I stick strictly with the dealer and pay accordingly because I want to take advantage of the warranty and eventually the extended warranty. But what he is doing isn't cutting corners, it's just working around some of the proprietary frustrations that come with Mclaren ownership. No different from my perspective, than people cross referencing the Fiat part number when servicing their Ferrari.
     
    Denny413 and greg328 like this.
  14. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    May 27, 2004
    18,970
    FL
    Full Name:
    Sean

    When the 12c first came out the dealer gave me a whole spiel that unlike ferrari Mclaren really wanted owners to use their cars. At the time he quoted me what seemed like quite reasonable prices for things like rotors etc.

    Apparently Maclaren changed tack on this.

    When you have a 100k 12c needing a 4k battery further depreciation is sure to ensue ultimately eroding the brand.
     
    Bullfighter likes this.
  15. f4udriver

    f4udriver Formula Junior

    Feb 1, 2012
    290
    Central Illinois
    Full Name:
    Mike G
    Image Unavailable, Please Login So last week I bought the 720s for my wife's birthday, she is a Mclaren nut and she absolutely loves the car. Now I get the 12c that was her birthday present 10 years ago.
    Who maintains the car doesn't really matter to us as long as they are competent, as we rarely ever sell a car. I still have my high school car from 1978. We love all of the manufacturers even including KIA.

    My plan for operating several airplanes and close to 30 cars is to have my own people do the work at roughly 1/5th the hourly rate of the dealerships. This allows me to afford more cars, which is my only bad habit. I am also one on one with the mechanics several time per day. I have been doing this since 1989. As someone stated above as long as you aren't concerned about who signs the books I am saving quite a lot especially with no transportation costs. If you search supercar garage Atlanta on YouTube Kevin made a video of his visit under "million dollar collection". That isn't me that picked them up, as my cross country airplane was in for it's annual.

    Cars are a big part of our family fun and we drive all of them with little concern for the miles.

    I can't recall the last time we had an unscheduled breakdown.

    I do think the 12c will be a classic in decades to come and I think the 720 is one of those cars that will keep more of its value compared to other Exotics.
     
    SoCal to az, NbyNW, NGooding and 3 others like this.
  16. blkdiablo33

    blkdiablo33 F1 Rookie

    Jul 12, 2004
    4,384
    720 s lately 2020 are under 275 k now
     
    rob lay and ryalex like this.
  17. Shark01

    Shark01 F1 Veteran

    Jun 25, 2005
    5,852
    Plenty in and around $250k…..or what you would pay for a 2022 GT3, which is rediculous. Best value around IMO.
     
    blkdiablo33 likes this.
  18. blkdiablo33

    blkdiablo33 F1 Rookie

    Jul 12, 2004
    4,384
    agree 2023 i seen them for 303 nice spec too ,for the performance and looks and for the asking prices you cant beat that,they just have a bad rep of reliabilty that may deter buyers
     
  19. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 25, 2012
    14,327
    Arizona
    The bad rap thing is unfortunate. The vast majority (not all by any means) of the cars that have had issues were modified or tuned heavily. Now I know someone is going to come and say their brothers uncles cousins wife’s son had a McLaren that broke down but that is the exception not the rule.

    I have my 4th McLaren coming at the end of the year and I have had zero issues with all my cars. A few minor issues here and there but nothing major.

    the driving experience is spectacular and those of you kicking the tires- please go test drive one. Buy from a. Reputable dealer- make sure it was tuned or had aftermarket exhaust or anything. These are the cars that have issues. Keep em stock and they perform well. Get one with a few miles. These cars are not garage queens. They are meant to be driven.
     
  20. boxerman

    boxerman F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    May 27, 2004
    18,970
    FL
    Full Name:
    Sean
    Saw a 12c again the other day. As with the original nsx the clean lines and purity of purpose will render it a classic, the dawning of a new era etc.
    While I’m no lover of their current styling esp the front ends they are certainly dramatic and performers. I doubt ably McLaren has “areived” as a player.
    Its interesting that Maclaren and Aston are really the two independent manufacturers left(ferrari is its own orbit) there is both good and bad in that.

    it feels liner headed towards carmageddon, between mandatory auto braking in USA by 2028 and draconian emissions rules is there goi g to be space left for any of these great machines
     
  21. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Dec 11, 2001
    6,364
    On the Limit
    Full Name:
    Dino
    #21 Ingenere, May 30, 2024
    Last edited: May 30, 2024
    If you are worried about depreciation on anything...... don't buy it. News Flash! These aren't appreciating assets.

    I've had more Ferraris than I can count and McLarens just seem to do everything better... especially from a driving perspective. The carbon fiber tub is an amazing foundation from which to build on. If all you are interested in is impressing strangers and valets, you'll probably buy a Ferrari or Lambo. It's about brand recognition. Younger people seem to know McLarens, but EVERYONE loves them. I ran the Ferrari club for several decades.... I know these characters. In my area, Ferraris are usually driving 5 under, blocking traffic, sipping their late and spending their time checking who is looking at them. McLarens seem to attract people that have been around the block with exotics, know the company, love to drive and in my case missed out on an F1.

    Service wise, I've been working on my own cars since my teens. I did the work on all my Ferraris (including engine outs), major and minor and always by the book. I keep meticulous records and it has never made a difference to a buyer when I sold. In fact, I have always gotten top of the market. I do the same with the McLaren, and actually they are easier to work on than the Ferraris. I have a factory MDS (in fact I got Kevin his), so I believe that my services are as good, if not better than the Mac store. I have probably spent 10% of what the average owner spends at the service departments at these dealers. btw: The McLaren has been dead on reliable.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
     

Share This Page