Sigh.....Gearbox light on, lost reverse and even # gears

Discussion in 'California/Portofino' started by Joshcruz713, Jan 28, 2018.

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  1. KMac

    KMac Rookie

    Dec 10, 2017
    13
    Full Name:
    Kevin McClure
    Here is an update on my DCT issue on my 2010 California. The dealership found a faulty relay and replaced it. They tested and drove it with no faults. I just picked up the car this afternoon and drove it the long way home. No issues, it ran perfectly. I will hold off on popping the champagne until I get several drives in without any hiccups. I don't know specifically which (or where) this relay is but the gearbox was never pulled out of the car and all of the testing and repair was done with the gearbox in place. I have attached a photo of the work order in case there is a code or any information that perhaps Motob could comment or elaborate on. Fingers crossed and maybe if this works, Josh could ask Boardwalk to inspect his as well.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Joshcruz713

    Joshcruz713 Rookie

    Jan 28, 2018
    41
    Wow Kevin. If this works out and you jave no more problems, I am so happy for you.

    Mine has way more errors than SAP, so not sure if my problem is just a relay, but who knows.
     
  3. KMac

    KMac Rookie

    Dec 10, 2017
    13
    Full Name:
    Kevin McClure
    Josh, I don't know which errors yours specifically had but mine started with several different error codes (P1902, P1905 and P1906). The first few times it felt like a hiccup and after shutting off the car (and resetting the error code), it ran fine for a while. After my last visit and they were convinced it was the SAP (when the gearbox refused to come out of neutral and warned of clutch overheating), the SAP passed their tests and that is when my tech found the damaged relay. Again, I have no technical expertise with Ferraris but IMHO, the more random errors, the more I feel that it is an electrical issue and not the gearbox itself. My dealership was just about ready to pull the gearbox and replace one of the packs before they found this. Definitely worth a look. Let me know what they say about your gearbox and I'll post updates as I get some miles on mine. Hang in there!
     
  4. Joshcruz713

    Joshcruz713 Rookie

    Jan 28, 2018
    41
    [​IMG]
    I don't know if these were the only errors found, but its at least those three, SAP, CCP and the Speed Sensor
     
  5. Joshcruz713

    Joshcruz713 Rookie

    Jan 28, 2018
    41
    Hey, that makes me wonder.

    Because mine is basically doing the same thing as yours, "clutch overheated" appears for a few moments, then I'll hit a bump in the road and it will suddenly disappear.

    Other times, the light will stay on, and sometimes long enough for the gearbox light to appear, and thats when I lose the even gears and reverse.

    BUT! And here's where I get hope that it's just some funky electrical issue, or faulty ground or a loose wire somewhere. If I shut the engine off, let the car sit dead for a few seconds, turn it back on, VOILA, all the gears are back and the car drives fine again.

    Now if the clutch was truly burnt up, or the tranny was blown, the problem wouldn't magically "disappear" when you turn the key off and then back on again.

    At least that's what I think, would yall agree with that?
     
  6. KMac

    KMac Rookie

    Dec 10, 2017
    13
    Full Name:
    Kevin McClure
    Your symptoms are nearly identical to mine. There were a handful of times that the gearbox light came on, but only for a few seconds and then went away. During those incidents, the gearbox worked fine. When mine freaked out, I would only get odd gears but it would magically resolve itself and all gears would either come back while I was driving or after pulling over and shutting off the car for a few minutes. I believe that (based on your service invoice) that they did the same diagnosis that Ferrari of Silicon Valley did with mine. I don't think the inspection of the wiring and relay was part of that flowchart and that might just be the difference between a junior tech following the standard operating procedures and a senior tech with 25 years under his belt, who was very thorough. Also the report says your gearbox and hydraulic oils didn't appear contaminated which, again, sounds like a healthy gearbox with an electrical gremlin.
     
  7. Joshcruz713

    Joshcruz713 Rookie

    Jan 28, 2018
    41
    Wow, so there may be hope just yet.

    Guys, is there any way to somehow "tag" Steve from Boardwalk Ferrari so he can read all of this? I don't know his username.
     
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  8. Jmci00

    Jmci00 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 2, 2016
    34
    His user name is SAFE4NOW - https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/members/safe4now.11545/

    He was incredibly helpful a while back when I was going to purchase a 599. He has an incredible amount of knowledge about these cars and seems more than willing to help those who he has never met.
     
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  9. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
    Sponsor

    Aug 25, 2004
    3,156
    Dallas Texas
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    Steve F
    New Power Warranty cost $4,500 per year ( before discounts ) assume a Ferrari meets the requirements.


    ( IMO )

    Ferrari Goodwill is for clients that meet certain pre-determined requirements, such as but not limited to:

    1. Purchased the Ferrari from an authorized Ferrari Dealership ( Initial "Buy In ")
    2. Services their Ferrari at a Ferrari Service Center and are currently up to date on all service or repairs ( Loyalty )
    3. Has an established positive working relationship with said Dealership ( Brand Advocate )


    It is not intended for

    1. Customers who purchase their Ferrari outside the network at a discount and then expect to have Ferrari recondition said discounted Ferrari on Ferrari's dime.
    2. Customers who defer service or repairs until there is a catastrophic failure ... and then expect Ferrari to stand behind their product
    3. Customers who abuse their Ferrari with the opinion that a Ferrari cost $ xyz so it "should be able to handle it.. "


    Different manufactures have different guidelines, but I can assure you the top 3 points above are the very first thing I am asked when I inquire about Goodwill assistance for any client.

    S
     
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  10. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    Aug 25, 2004
    3,156
    Dallas Texas
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    Steve F
    As noted above ... its an intensive process to R&R the rear subframe , even WITH the correct tools and equipment.

    THEN, you have to start taking it all apart.... ( photos below )

    S Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
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  11. Jmci00

    Jmci00 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 2, 2016
    34
    Jason, I just read your scan of your service record and saw that you also had a window smashed, the window regulator needed replacing, the drivers seat back wouldn’t work and the rear view mirror control was broken. What happened there to cause all these issues? How much bad luck can one have with a car? Something just seems off with all these problems.
     
  12. Joshcruz713

    Joshcruz713 Rookie

    Jan 28, 2018
    41
    Two days after I bought the car, some ******* broke into my buildings parking garage and broke into the car. Smashed the window out and tore up the leather with the broken glass.

    The seatback and the mirror controls were broken apparently when I bought the car.

    I guess, at the time, I didnt think to toggle these switches to see if they worked. Again, my fault, but at the time I had no reason not to trust this dealer.

    And yes, this has been the worst start of a year in my life, I don't know what I did to deserve all this, but so far I've lost my girl, went through all this with the car, had a few incidents at work that weren't my fault but made me look really bad and probably put me on thin ice.

    The only thing I have left right now is my health, and knock on wood, I don't want to jinx that.
     
  13. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    486
    Kansas
    Full Name:
    Shawn Hicks
    You can fix the car, can be a rockstar at work, and find a new lady that half your last ones age and twice as hot. You'll come out of this stronger.
     
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  14. Joshcruz713

    Joshcruz713 Rookie

    Jan 28, 2018
    41
    So far, the one benefit I have gotten out of this God forsaken car is all of you great guys I have met in the Ferrari community.

    What a group, like minded, successful, positive thinkers who only want the greatest that life has to offer. I am lucky to have met yall.

    Hopefully whenever any of yall are in the Houston area we can get together, it would be nice to meet some of you guys.
     
  15. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    486
    Kansas
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    Shawn Hicks
    About as close as I'll be anytime soon is in Dallas in about a month. Though interestingly I'll be stopping off at boardwalk since I'll be in the area. My wife also wants to "test drive" the Maserati Granturismo again while we are there. I said sure but I ain't changing my mind and if she likes the Maserati then we have to buy 2 cars.

    There are a lot of great folks here, and pretty much everyone wants the same thing for everyone to get the most enjoyment from whatever Ferrari they choose. It's also really great that Ferrari mechanics try to help out here as well. But yeah there are some pretty great folks here.
     
  16. Jmci00

    Jmci00 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 2, 2016
    34
    Jason, yikes man, that’s some string of bad luck. Keep up your good attitude though. You’ll pull through all this and be stronger and wiser for all of it. I know it sounds like a cliche, but every time life kicks me in the nuts I figure out a way to turn it around. Positive attitude and taking responsibility for your mistakes is a great first step.
     
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  17. dstama

    dstama Karting

    Dec 24, 2017
    50
    Full Name:
    D
    For what it is worth, a few years back I had an issue with my (non ferrari) car.

    I went over a speed hump one day and then somehow my manual gearbox lost the plot.. when I engage the clutch to shift, the revs would spike between 500-1000rpm. The thing was, it was very intermittent. Would happen more so when taking off from a set of traffic lights but it was completely random, happened about 50% of gear shifts on average..

    I took it back to the dealer and 2 highly reputable independents and after a total of probably 6 weeks in the workshop of diagnosis no one could work out what was causing it. They all had suspicions but were honest that it may not actually fix the issue. Before taking the plunge to replace the gearbox/transmission etc, one of the independents suggested seeing an auto-electrician to see what they say.

    Booked it in with one, got a call within an hour and was told parts of the ECU was water logged and corroding away, a circa $500 fix to clean it up and seal it and I was on my way. No idea how it happened since the car was garaged at home day and night - but it had somehow.

    I am not suggesting it is the ECU but hopefully it is not as serious as first thought. I had this problem for about a year because no one had any ideas what it was, I could have thrown big $$ at it and in hindsight would have not done a thing, I hope it all works out and it turns out to be a relatively minor thing for you so you can enjoy your car like you should be able to and most importantly trouble free!

    Good luck mate!
     
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  18. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
    Professional Ferrari Technician

    Nov 11, 2003
    1,688
    Berkeley, CA
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    Brian Brown
    It just shows that even at the dealership level, some shops are not following proper DCT repair procedures. In the photos above the clutch pack is shown removed from its support on the CCP. It is Ferrari's policy to never ever remove the clutch pack from the CCP for any reason.

    In the repair procedure manual this is highlighted in a large bold print with a red box around it. Ferrari later came out with a bulletin specifying that the clutch pack is to be secured to CCP with a metal strap in order to prevent any accidental movement of the pack on the support.

    If the pack is removed from the CCP, the seals may be compromised, and they are not available as replacement parts.
     
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  19. SAFE4NOW

    SAFE4NOW F1 Rookie
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    #169 SAFE4NOW, Mar 12, 2018
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2018
    Pretty strong statement there.... So I assume you are aware of the details outlined in the RoL ( What was that SE# again? ) and off line discussions with the factory where they instructed the components to be disassembled in this manner?

    Or that this was a DCT that was taken apart so that various parts could be used as year end trophies for the Ferrari Club of America?

    Point being, while you appear to be well informed, I do not feel that there is any need to attempt and discredit a fellow Ferrari partner online, when you do NOT know the backstory of photographs. ( Edited , as I realized you may not actually be in the Dealer network )

    The pictures were simply offered to the community to demonstrate the complexity of the internals of the DCT itself , not to offer a DIY for a specific repair.

    S
     
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  20. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    486
    Kansas
    Full Name:
    Shawn Hicks
    I wouldn't want to DIY one of these gearboxes, I'd probably have a whole box of parts and bolts left over.............
     
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  21. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2014
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    Nuno
    You and me both. And most human beings. That's why only very skilled and competent mechanics, after getting proper and extensive training from Ferrari/Getrag, may perform an adequate job on these. I deliberately put skilled mechanics before (and most important) than training, because while everyone gets the same training, some excel in DCT work and others don't, so training isn't the main differentiator here. It's the basis of the job, but then you'll need something extra to be considered a trusted professional. There are good and bad trained professionals everywhere. Being a mechanic at an official Ferrari dealer doesn't make you immune to errors (standards may also change from one dealer to another, which it shouldn't happen in principle but in practice... it may be a different story), nor independent mechanics are blatantly ignorant just because they work out of the official dealer network. My 2 cents anyway.

    Back on topic, I always pay very close attention to what Mr. Brian Brown says. I haven't had the privilege of knowing him in person nor ever contracted a service from him either directly or indirectly and I assume he is not God, but I'm yet to see an instance in which he isn't right. Again: just my humble 2 cents. I believe everything is made best by debating and explaining, that's why we're all here: to learn with one another.

    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     
  22. tomc

    tomc F1 World Champ

    Apr 13, 2014
    13,140
    DFW, Texas
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    Tom C
    Mario, user MDEL, posted extensively about the DCT repair - including pics - when his Cali had issues. It's pretty scary that with all those parts and sensors that these things work at all...T
     
  23. KMac

    KMac Rookie

    Dec 10, 2017
    13
    Full Name:
    Kevin McClure
    Hey Josh, here is an update from my repair. I've put 240 miles on my California since I picked it up from the dealership last Monday. So far, so good. I'm certainly not saying this is the problem with your DCT, but I'm cautiously optimistic about this faulty relay being the culprit in my DCT issues. Hopefully, whoever you take yours to can inspect that DCT relay to rule it out. Good luck!
     
    azlin75 likes this.
  24. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    486
    Kansas
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    Shawn Hicks
    Yeah I think I've probably read that thread. As much as I give Getrag a hard time about the early gearboxes they are very remarkable. The example in the Cali t was my first experience with it and honestly I really liked it. Only thing I thought might be nice is some sort of hold on an incline. But since I already was aware that the California didn't do that I managed to safely operate the Cali t every time i rented one and in earlier California cars I have driven.

    Back to Josh's situation I'm hoping he has gotten the car to Boardwalk at this point and Steve and the fine folks there can get his ride ironed out. I also hope that the repair kits become a bit less expensive but considering the cars and clientele that purchase and drive those cars I have my doubts. My hat is sure off to the folks that do work on them because they sure are quite complicated.
     
  25. Cml2116

    Cml2116 Rookie

    Nov 14, 2015
    28
    Tri state area
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    Chris
    SAFE4NOW is an excellent source of knowledge and Steve is one of the most respected mechanical folks on this forum. Not saying others don't know there stuff but you would be hard pressed to find a better person who takes the time out to post pics and take an interest in issues with these automobiles. If you can get the vehicle in his hands it is a benefit.
     
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