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Slightly Loved 2015 California-T: Buyer Advice

Discussion in 'California/Portofino/Roma' started by DJP, Jan 23, 2018.

  1. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    Hello all!

    I'm about to put in an offer on a slightly loved 2015 California T with just under 2k miles on it. The car has a clean car history report, one previous owner, a few months left on factory warranty, needed a replacement side marker when it was traded-in, and just wrapped up it's yearly maintenance at the local Ferrari dealership.

    It has a number of upgrades (I'm only personally missing the diamond seats) and according to the dealership an original MSRP of $259k, although for some reason the car report shows $199k The ask is around $165k.

    This year there was a factory recall:
    Report Receipt Date: 07-07-2015
    NHTSA Campaign: 15V433000
    Manufacture: Ferrari North America, Inc.
    Ferrari North America, Inc. (fna) Is Recalling Certain Model Year 2015 Ferrari 458 Italia, 458 Spider, 458 Speciale, 458 Speciale A, California T, Ff, F12 Berlinetta, And Laferrari Vehicles Manufactured December 19, 2014, To April 29, 2015. The Affected Vehicles May Be Equipped With A Driver Side Air Bag Module That Was Improperly Assembled. This Can Cause The Air Bag To Deploy In A Rotated Orientation.


    Suggestions?
    1. I think the ask price is somewhat fair, but will look to negotiate slightly.
    2. I will check on the status of the factory recall.
    3. Any idea why a car report would show a lower MSRP versus what the dealer reports? I used a free car report tool. Maybe that's the issue ;)
    4. What questions should I ask the dealer that I don't have outlined here?
    Thank you in advance for taking the time to read this and for your input.
     
  2. Raydog9379

    Raydog9379 Karting

    Jan 10, 2018
    127
    Full Name:
    Ray
    Base before options was prob. $199k. What sort of options does it have?
     
  3. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    Hi Ray - thanks for the response!

    Here is a list:
    • AFS
    • Apple car play
    • Headrest horse stitch
    • Contrast stitching
    • Yellow calipers
    • Factory sport exhaust
    • Carb steering wheel
    • Scuderia shields
    • Magnaride dual mode suspension
    • Front/Rear cameras
    • 20' forged painted wheels
     
  4. Raydog9379

    Raydog9379 Karting

    Jan 10, 2018
    127
    Full Name:
    Ray
    Here's a rundown of a sticker I found for a 2015 Cali T, hard to read some of the numbers but this is close:

    Base: 198,973
    Delivery: 3,750
    Carbon Fiber Driver Zone and LEDs: 7,761
    Carbon Fiber Central Bridge: 3,206
    Carbon Fiber Dash Inserts: 6,580
    Yellow Calipers: 1,517
    Shields: 1,855
    Stitched Headrests: 1,265
    Daytona Seats Front: 4,219
    Daytona Rear: 1,349
    Magnaride Susp: 5,568
    20" Forged Painted Wheels: 6,242
    White Rev Counter: 977
    Alum Dr and Pax Footrest: 843
    Elec Seats: 6,242 hence the response I had on another thread about them using nylon gears in the motors... for 6 grand on top of 200k+ they could spring for some metal gears.

    God knows what "Other Options" at roughly 23k is.

    Total: 273k and change.
     
  5. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    I saw your post! I agree, call me old fashioned when it comes down to cost v. value, but I expect a bit more value when we are paying these rates...

    Great find w/ the detailed breakdown. I'm doing a back of the napkin calculation, but it does look like the dealer's MSRP might be close.

    I was able to find an identical make/model photo of the MSRP sticker (would post here but don't own image rights and don't want to invite problems) and I can add to the list the following:
    Apple Carplay: 4,219
    Colored Safety Belts: 974 (which I forgot to add to my initial list of upgrades)
    Carbon fiber steering wheel + LED: 5,145
    And this one's "Other options" is just over $37k.

    Hopefully this thread's options breakdown might assist others interested in a 2015 Cali T.

    Ray, thanks again for all your help. Much appreciated!
     
  6. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    760
    Kansas
    Full Name:
    Shawn Hicks
    For what it's worth 165k for a 2015 T ain't that bad considering 2014 models a are running around 140k and up and the T is quite a bit different/newer. There may be room for some play though since the bottom is fixing to fall out of these cars somewhat once the Portofino's start hitting the streets.
     
    good2go likes this.
  7. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    I agree @azlin75 with both points: 1.) It's priced appropriately when reviewing cars available in the U.S., and 2.) with the Portofinos street release we'll see how low the California floor will go. Perhaps it would be beneficial to be a bit more patient & wait, but I've found there's always a reason to postpone buying anything, and sometimes it's just worth it to pull the trigger. Thank you for your insight!
     
  8. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    760
    Kansas
    Full Name:
    Shawn Hicks
    To be completely fair I honestly don't see a lot of fluctuation in price until the portofino hits in around August. So that being said if it's a car that has the color and options you want it's priced pretty fair go get it. If you want to wait a year you could save quite a bit depending on how generous your crystal ball says the californias will deprishiate after the Porofino releases. Honestly since my wife is the penny pincher that's the camp I'm in, I have to wait and see for up to another year.

    The T's are dang nice and what we generally rent on vacation. But I like the NA cars just a bit more and hope to get a Cali 30 for a real good price.

    Oh and I'm pretty sure just about every car on the planet was affected by the airbag recall. I still can't get mine replaced yet on my 2012 ram truck yet.
     
    DJP likes this.
  9. good2go

    good2go Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 9, 2016
    939
    Sounds like a great price. If it has what you need buy it.
     
    DJP likes this.
  10. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    Thank you G2G - I'm working on it now ;)
     
  11. good2go

    good2go Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 9, 2016
    939
    Here is the closest I see I car guru. https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inventorylisting/viewDetailsFilterViewInventoryListing.action?sourceContext=carGurusHomePage_false_0&newSearchFromOverviewPage=true&inventorySearchWidgetType=AUTO&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity=d2572&entitySelectingHelper.selectedEntity2=&zip=55439&distance=50000&searchChanged=true&modelChanged=false&filtersModified=true#listing=196602502

    Really seems like a great price.
     
  12. arizonaitalian

    arizonaitalian F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Oct 29, 2010
    10,677
    Wyoming
    Exactly. Most states only charge registration on the base MSRP (if not the actual purchase price). And its easy of the car reporting services (like autocheck and carfax etc) to know the base MSRP but they certainly don't know if for each and every car sold. So they only know and show the base MSRP.
     
  13. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    760
    Kansas
    Full Name:
    Shawn Hicks
    Seems like the 2015 up cars are the ones I'm seeing more movement on the last few months. I'm also not seeing a lot of 2012 down cars popping up for sale lately either. But it seems like these cars are running in the 160k up area with room to move a little I'm sure. More miles and options seem to be a bit more but overall prices seem down and still coming down. 2014 Cali 30's around 5k miles are running 140-145k so 160ish for. 2015 cali t makes perfect sense. But no one knows what another 12 months will do to the price. Could soften some or stay strong. We will see. But for right now if it's got the options you want and you don't mind taking a little bit of a hit buy away. The enjoyment you'll get far overlooks the deprishiation ride you'll take.
     
  14. good2go

    good2go Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 9, 2016
    939
    It will always be less 12 months down the road, but that's 12 months not driving a Ferrari. I don't measure the happiness from my Ferrari by it's value, I measure it by how many times I fill the tank. I drive it every day, rain or shine.
     
  15. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    760
    Kansas
    Full Name:
    Shawn Hicks
    That's why I added the last sentence on my last post. Unfortunately, or fortunately depending on how you look at it. I have to wait to make my purchase ( well no I don't have to wait but it wouldn't make good financial sense) until I pay off my truck. So with the portofino release timed around the time I'm thinking of buying it almost makes more sense for me to kinda wait and see if things favor waiting.

    But I'm watching now to see what cars are being offered and the offering prices. Surprisingly a lot of the sub 100k and nearly all sub 90k cars have moved on to new owners and several of the ones that remain have issues. Not a lot of cars being added in this price point. Most of the cars added are 2012 and up and start at 120k and up. I figure most of the folks that jumped right away moved their cars already and the next batch to move cars will be towards the end of summer.

    Now all indications point at waiting 2 years or more for optimal price point but unless something changes I highly doubt I'll wait that long. Maybe December or January for me.
     
  16. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    Interesting...I never received an email notification of these new posts. Checked SPAM filters and nada...Odd.

    @good2go that's actually the exact car. I didn't reference here as I didn't want competition from any lurkers. ;) And I can't agree enough with "It will always be less 12 months down the road, but that's 12 months not driving a Ferrari. I don't measure the happiness from my Ferrari by it's value, I measure it by how many times I fill the tank."

    @azlin75 Well said. I believe I could possibly get a significantly better deal in a bit of time, but given the enjoyment I'll receive from the car I'm happy to take the plunge now.

    Well my friends, I'm happy to report the car is officially off the market. I made the down payment and now waiting for Jason @ Silicon Valley to finish his annual inspection. Thank you both for chiming in and sharing your insights. I sincerely appreciate it.

    Next time I post hopefully I'll be the newest member of the F family ;)
     
  17. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    760
    Kansas
    Full Name:
    Shawn Hicks
    Congrats, you won't regret it it is a good deal. Hope you enjoy enjoy it ( but come on we already know you will). I'm a bit jealous, but happy for ya.
     
    DJP likes this.
  18. good2go

    good2go Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 9, 2016
    939
    congratulations! Also my California T is TDF also. Awesome color. I have a little more carbon, charcoal interior., contrast blue stitching, Does yours have leather headliner?

    You will love the car, the more you drive it the more exciting it is.
     
  19. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    Right? The moment I saw this exterior color I fell in love. Your charcoal interior is absolutely beautiful!

    This car does have the contrast blue stitching, although perhaps like yourself, I couldn't tell by the photos and had to see in person. Re: leather headliner...this is embarrassing to admit, but I've no idea. I suppose I'll find out tomorrow? The original MSRP sticker is in the car, but it's one of those items I completely overlooked.

    Personal note: The only item this car was missing that I wanted (and a previous car that I was close to purchasing, but missed the opportunity at SV Ferrari back in October) doesn't have, are the diamond seats. But then I took a moment, said to myself, "DJP, this is your first F car....do you really need every single desired add-on possible?" And I heard a little voice answering this question "No, enjoy." :)

    "You will love the car, the more you drive it the more exciting it is."
    Again, I completely agree. I'm truly looking forward to bonding with this car and learning all the 'ins and outs' and little nuances. I will admit, I have miles and miles of knowledge to learn about the absolute beauty of the internal workings of this machine. To be honest, I'm sure that there are many others who would enjoy and frankly appreciate all the details that make this car, much more than me. I'm thankful that it looks like I'll have the privilege of adding this beauty to my family.
     
  20. Raydog9379

    Raydog9379 Karting

    Jan 10, 2018
    127
    Full Name:
    Ray
    Gorgeous... I really like the way the blue seat belts pop. One of those things on paper I'd have not optioned out, but when looking at in pics... I love it.
     
  21. arizonaitalian

    arizonaitalian F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Oct 29, 2010
    10,677
    Wyoming
    Wow, that is one beautiful Cali. Congrats and post your impressions after you receive and drive the car.

    PS - make sure to get the "build sheet" from them so you have a detailed list of all options, etc (often the window sticker groups a number of options into one line called "other options").
     
  22. DJP

    DJP Karting

    Jun 9, 2013
    66
    Silicon Valley
    Full Name:
    Daniel
    Thank you ArizonaItalian! I just picked up the car today and have spent slightly over an hour driving it around forming a relationship :) I've got a bunch of 'homework' and learning to do about this car and will be sure to look for the "build sheet". I'll definitely share my impressions once I've got more time behind the wheel.

    Now to update my profile... ;)
     

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