Spider Roof &Window Logic

Folks... For a while, I've been wondering what the relationship between the spider roof controller and the spider window controller is on my '98 car. No one appears to have any wiring diagrams for the spider window controller interface with the car. I found the answer yesterday after a several days of wiring checks and much headscratching. I was expecting some elaborate databus between the two controllers for sharing information about windows and doors and such. There is none. However...

Both controllers share some position microswitch position signals and, contrary to the workshop manual's roof controller diagram, the earth return path for some of these microswitches is located inside the window controller. This means that if you disconnect the window controller's smaller (upper) 8-pin plug, the roof won't work (even with the windows down). However, the window controller is completely independent of the roof controller. If you disconnect the three plugs on the roof controller, the windows will still drop 5cm when you crack the roof open. Unfortunately, you won't regain window control until the microswitch "Sx" at the bottom of left hand piston slider plate is actuated or if you relatch the roof.

Here's a basic diagram I threw together... I'm still working on a full diagram.

Roof wiring amendments

Three of the position microswitches are shared by the two controllers. A fourth switch is dedicated to the window controller ("Sx").

I'm still trying to figure out the door switch input. When I was doing wiring checks, I deliberately closed one door and left the other open, but both switches showed a closed switch state. The battery was disconnected, so perhaps something in the system needs power. Also, I'm not sure of the symbology in the Ferrari diagram with regards to window up/down control switches, so I'm not sure what to make of unexpected results from my wiring checks.

Here are a few other curiosities:

A faulty roof "close" (up) relay can affect the roof opening operation. Likewise, a faulty roof "open" (down) relay can affect the roof closing operation. This is because (as well as power from the energised relay) the motor needs an earth signal... which is provided by the other de-energised relay. This means that during faultfinding, it may be best to use at least one new relay (or at least check for continuity on relay pins 30 and 87a of the de-energised relay).

A faulty roof bypass switch can interfere with normal roof operation even if the microswitch operates the roof. If the bypass switch does not fully return to its normal (relaxed position) after being pushed, it can interrupt the signal from the roof controller to the power relays. You can easily test this with a multimeter. There is a 6 pin disconnect plug on the bypass switch harness. Pins (or rather sockets) 2 & 3 should show continuity with the roof "open" bypass microswitch relaxed (not pushed) and pins 5 & 6 should show continuity with the roof "close" bypass microswitch relaxed (not pushed).

The 30Amp fuse for the motor (and other things) is a small plastic 30 amp blade type fuse. The plastic on mine was showing signs of heat stress, so it may be a good idea to replace these periodically.

The microswitch for the buzzer "S12" which is activated when manually pushing back on the roof on my car looks like a normal microswitch with a perfectly straight lever arm. However, I've seen a couple of photos on the forum of some seriously bent ones. I don't know if it's possible to reposition this switch to stop it being damaged.

The forum has some excellent tips on roof stuff. It's just a matter of finding them. e.g...

Here's an excellent tutorial on how to replace roof microswitches:

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/how-to-repair-f355-spider-top-sensor-for-power-windows.522719/#post-144699530

I also found a reference to the use of a hypodermic needle for topping up the fluid reservoir.

Don't use the pump motor casing as an earth when doing wiring checks. It isn't grounded.

Cheers
Ian.

 

I've added extra wiring to the WSM diagram to show the shared microswitch inputs (into the Roof and Window Controllers):

Roof Wiring Schematic for F355 Spider ('98)

Still a work in progress, however.

I noticed that on my right hand drive car, the seat switch inputs into the roof controller were reversed (hence the earlier confusion). The resistance checks were still pretty strange though. The wiring checks for the doors were even stranger. Perhaps something to do with the time delay circuits on the interior lighting.

 

Diagram updated to make it compatible with Left and Right Hand Drive Cars:

Roof Control Wiring Diagram

 

Window Control Diagram also updated to show roof controller interface.

Fig. 10. Windows, Interior Lights & Windscreen Wiper/Washer Schematic Diagram (5.2 car)

 

Strange, I don't know why some people are having problems with the link. I don't know how to fix it. If I post the diagrams as images on FChat, the pictures shrink and become unreadable.

 

Are there any 2.7 Spiders? If so, I can modify the 2.7 window diagram also.

 

Thanks, John ...

Here's an updated Window Diagram for the 2.7, for whoever can download it... although I never did find out which passenger footpad window fuse (Left or Right) feeds which pins on the Window Controller.

Window, Windscreen Wipers/Washers (2.7)

The roof diagram should be the same as the 5.2.

 

Will do. I'll send you a full set of each (2.7 and 5.2). Just hope your mailbox can handle 3Mb.

Cheers
Ian.

 

For American FChatters, I'll try to put a few more red, white and blue wires in my diagrams

I've found the best way to look at the diagrams is to add them as "images" (photos) on an iPad or something similar and you can zoom and pan more easily.

 

Is it normal for the roof to slam down on the window frame during closing or are the microswitches in my secondary hydraulic actuators in need of repair/adjustment?

(Aside) I just discovered I have 1.3Gb of data on my website which has a 1Gb limit. I've cleared out some clutter. Just wondering if my links now work a little better?

Here's a theoretical flow chart for the windows (probably needs some tweaking)

Spider Window Flow Control Diagram