Starter issue | FerrariChat

Starter issue

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by deanhalter, Jul 29, 2016.

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  1. deanhalter

    deanhalter Formula Junior

    Dec 27, 2008
    357
    Norco, CA
    Full Name:
    Dean Halter
    Anyone have a cross reference to a starter solenoid for the Bosch starter on a 1995 456GT? The engine number is 37770, and they want quite a princely sum for the whole unit.

    The car will turn over if you go directly to the motor terminal and the solenoid terminal which tells me the solenoid coil is good, but the contact for the motor current in side the solenoid is bad. Took the starter apart and the brushes and commutator look good so the solenoid should do it.

    The starter is a 110 series, part number 0 001 110 108 and the solenoid is a 0 331 303 032-532.

    I have done a fair bit of poking, but am getting nowhere. Short of just buying a 110 series solenoid and winging it, wanted to see if anyone has run into this before.
     
  2. fastradio

    fastradio F1 Rookie
    BANNED Professional Ferrari Technician

    Apr 26, 2006
    3,664
    New England
    Full Name:
    David Feinberg
    Not sure why you'd even consider replacing the starter. We get them rebuilt on a regular basis. If you bypass the solenoid and the starter engages, then the problem is with the solenoid. This presumes, of courser, that you have power to the solenoid...
     
  3. Gizzi

    Gizzi F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 3, 2011
    5,217
    Brisbane, Australia
    Full Name:
    Gezim


    Yes, it's a standard solenoid.
     
  4. deanhalter

    deanhalter Formula Junior

    Dec 27, 2008
    357
    Norco, CA
    Full Name:
    Dean Halter
    I considered buying a new one after the rebuild shop I was going to use said they couldn't get the parts. I don't think they realized that the parts in-series are all the same.

    The nice thing is the brush box is $22 and the solenoid is $34 on Amazon.

    Also, this dude does a great tutorial on the rebuild of these starters:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJM2veUNBc0
     
  5. 166&456

    166&456 Formula 3

    Jul 13, 2010
    1,723
    Amsterdam
    #5 166&456, Apr 7, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2017
    Well today I went for the annual inspection with the 456 after the winter storage. It had slight trouble starting which I blamed on the immobiliser. The second try it started right up and ran absolutely beautifully. Once at the garage it wouldn't start again however...
    Thinking it could be a heat soak issue we left it for an hour with the hood open which changed absolutely nothing. Eventually we resorted to an indignifying push start which enabled it to pass inspection as well as to drive it home. Not a promising way to start the season!
    I thought it was starting a tad slow as if the battery is weak before but its been doing that basically since I got it. Now i am not sure whether it deteriorated without me realizing.

    Anyway on to my question - is it particularly difficult to remove the starter and does that take special tools?
     
  6. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    28,999
    socal
    What is battery voltage?
     
  7. Gizzi

    Gizzi F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 3, 2011
    5,217
    Brisbane, Australia
    Full Name:
    Gezim


    You're problem is a voltage drop to the activator terminal on the solenoid, caused by heat soak. You can fit an aux start relay to overcome the problem, but you have to use a dropping resistor on the original activator wire, to ground, because an ECU uses this wire as a ground reference. It'll cure your problem.
     
  8. Gizzi

    Gizzi F1 Veteran
    Owner

    Dec 3, 2011
    5,217
    Brisbane, Australia
    Full Name:
    Gezim


    As for removal of the starter, it's not very hard. You have to have it on a hoist, and have to remove the alternator to assist with access. No special tools are required.
     
  9. 166&456

    166&456 Formula 3

    Jul 13, 2010
    1,723
    Amsterdam
    Thanks for the responses, the starter is absolutely dead, the relay will click but not even the slightest turn of the engine, not even now it is cold and with known perfectly charged battery. This was a sudden and unexpected failure, this never happened to me before in a million km of motoring.
    Thanks for the tips, not looking forward to removing the alternator as well. A chance to rebuild them simultaneously I guess. Other tips while in down there? Lets combine with fluid flush and belts as they are due. Time to spend some €€.
     
  10. 166&456

    166&456 Formula 3

    Jul 13, 2010
    1,723
    Amsterdam
    Okay so as it turns out it is possible to take the back off the starter motor while in the car. This provided easy access to the brush holder. The starter has 2x2 brushes for power distribution, it was obvious one of the two sets wasn't working because the other set had signs of overheating. The commutator had oxidised a bit too but it was smooth with no grooves.
    Cleaning the commutator, a new brush holder and regrease of the bearing made it 100% again. A good hour later and it now starts faster than ever.

    So if you experience slower starting than usual and its not the battery it is a sign to be taken seriously. Replace this part before it stops altogether.
     

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