Status update on GCK install

If ketel doesn't want them, have him send me the old cat TCU. I'd like to see if I can repair them. If I can I'll send them back to ketel. Even just one would do.

 

I suggest you PM Ketel.

 

When you say TCU John, do you mean the ECU's for the CAT's?

If so, those are just shy of $400 from Ricambi (I bought a spare a few months ago)

 

That is right. TCU = thermocouple control unit.

 

Nice job Mitch, you are a good man.

 

Yes. I'd like to open one up. I can not imagine that the circuit is very complex. I'd bet $10 worth of parts inside.

 

$10 is a lot of electronics. My guess is it has a 5V Motorola Microcontroller inside, 8 bit processor that has a built in ADC and a built in DAC, some thermocouple amps, and some power components.

The controller uses the ADC to take the analog small signal from the thermocouple / amp, linearizes it, converts it to 1,5V -- 4.75V on the output side using the DAC.

The issue you will find is the inside is totally filled with some epoxy material so getting to the actual electronics is a destructive process.

OK, I will stop guessing now.

 

Same as I was thinking...

 

I was talking retail prices.


First I would like to see it it is just the solder joints to the pins. Doesn't anyone read the DIY sticky? http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/141666495-post41.html

Failing that I would like to tear one apart and map the circuit. It will be destructive, but I think the parts would still be identifiable.

 

Done. I really hope you get the car sorted. My car is also Swaters Blu/Tan. It's the most beautiful combination on a F355. I'm sure you agree.

 

Hang in there! Once you get it sorted, you'll be the local expert.
Not only that, you'll own a sorted vehicle and be able to drive it to Maine and back, no problems.
Clearly the vehicle had some deferred maintenance when you got it. Now you're bonding with your car!
See you next weekend!

 

Ketel,

Don't get discouraged. You are making progress. The TCUs signals are telling your car to run in limp home mode. It will run like crap with no lower RPM torque at all. Get all the TCUs in place, clear the codes, do another hard reset, and let the ECU relearn.

There is something you can ascertain. Make sure that the front O2 sensors are plugged into the connector with the Blue ribbon around them. And the rear sensors are plugged into the other connector without the blue ribbon. Make sure the front sensors are truly front sensors. They are not interchangeable with the rear sensors.

Also make sure that the pins are located in the connector housings where they should be and not pushed back to the point where no contacts are made. You are having two no-activity codes which likely mean there is a bad connection somewhere.

When you install your O2 sensors, did you take care not to twist the wires too much? You do this by

1) Install the sensors with the wires hang free, then connect the connectors together, OR
2) if the connectors are already in place, you twist the sensors wires 4 turns in the other direction, and screw them into the bung and unwinding the wires in the process.

When you are playing around in that area, there are many vacuum lines that can get dislodged so make sure they are all plugged back in. Also, when you get the new TCUs, make sure the two on the right hand side are connected to the right connectors. Cat TCU and BP Valve TCU are easy to mix up.

Good luck and let me know if I can help.

 

Ketel. You are going to be a case study for 355 owners going forward.

Hang in there. You've got a great group of guys helping you out here and I'm confident you will get it sorted out.

 

Ketel,

First, you are still throwing parts at the car. Understandable since Mitch looked at it. You were/are getting heater circuit shorted to ground. That is unusual, and doesn't make sense with new O2 sensors. Also, if the heater circuit fails in the sensor it typical give a code for heater circuit OPEN, which would be P1116 and P 1120 if the 355 codes are the same as the 360 code (can someone verify that?). Also, the 134 and 154 are different than what you reported before (132, 152). 134 and 154 are "No activity". That is the ECU is not seeing any signal from the front O2 sensors.

I presume you cleared the codes and reset the ECU before starting the car with the new O2 sensors. Assuming you did that try this. Disconnect the upstream O2 sensors. Clear the codes and reset the ECU. Now start the car. The P1115 and P1119 codes should not appear. You should get P1116 and P1120 (heater open) because there is no heather connected, and some other codes which you can ignore for now. However, if you still get P1115 and P1119 codes with the O2 sensors disconnected you probably have shorts somewhere in the wiring harness.

Also, when you disconnect the sensors look at the pins in the connector. If they were not plugged in straight the pins can bend and not make a connection.

You have to start looking at this in a more pragmatic and thoughtful way. Your O2 codes are saying that 1) the ECU is not seeing a signal and 2) there is a short somewhere in the heater circuits. Assuming the new O2 sensors are the correct ones, and you didn't mix up the front and rear, this would indicate the possibility of bad connections, broken wires and possible shorts in the wiring harness.

[edit]

Car running poorly could well be because of the p0341 code (bad cam plsition sensor) as this would totally screw up injection timing.

 

In addition, if the codes have all been cleared....AND....this is a fresh start up, THEN the car is in open loop mode (this means that it should not care about the O2 sensor input yet)

So, on start up, does the car seem to run OK? Later start to run poorly?

Or does the car run poorly at initial start up too?

 

Another thought is the thermocouple ECU is telling the real ECU that something is wrong even at start up. (No clear info as to what the thermocouple ECU does on cold start up...ie, what effect does it have on the ECu and does it have any affect while in open loop mode)

Anyone hear know the answer?

 

The TCU for the bypass valve does not seem to affect engine tuning other than throwing a CEL code.

THe TCUs for the Cats, if voltage output is too high or if the TCU is not plugged into the harness, then the car runs fine in open loop but the slow down light comes on immediately. Continued driving after that for about ten minutes and the engine goes into Limp Home Mode.

 

Ketel

Before you do anything else on this car, check your wirings at all the connectors that were touched during the GCK installation.

Pull on the wires to see if they come out of the crimps
Check pin positions to see if they are where they are supposed to be
Look at the pins to see if they are not bent, or not in all the way.

 

Interesting developments. Did I read incorrectly or am I correct that Ketel said he bought the car recently and is trying to go through California Smog and that the car came with CEL codes? Is there a history of a PO or PO's mechanic trying to solve those? If yes is the PO's mechanic a noteworthy one who was unable to solve the problem? If yes that may clue us in on how difficult this job is going to get. Sounds to me that we must confirm that the GCK install was correct. Two places to mess up are at the final terminals and the Motronic ECU. If they pass then a hard look is going to be needed tracing back wires looking for faults. Ketel said he mangled the conenctor that supports the pins on his first connector retrofit. Are any other connector housings mangled? Pins can't work if they don't sit in the housing right.

 

I also had issues with quite a few CELs related to O2 sensors. Switching and replacing didn't seem to help. I also did the complete GCK. My mechanic (2NA) had the exhaust system off the car and noticed one of the secondary cats had the core twisted sideways. Removed both of the secondary cat cores and have not had a CEL in 2 seasons. Might be worth checking.

 

Please ketel, do what I said before you do anything else. Unplug the upstream O2 sensors, clear the codes and ECU. Start the car and let it run for a few minutes until the CEL come on. Check for O2 heater codes. They should be as I said, heater circuit open for bank 1 and 2, sensor 1. Please try this and see if the 1115 and 1119 codes go to 1116 and 1120. What do you have to loose? After that it becomes a matter of sitting down with an VOM and checking continuity of every wire between the O2 sensors and the ECU, 4 wires/O2 sensor = 16 tests. Should not take more than 1 hour. You need to start digging deep here.

FBB, Ketel appears to have bought the car about 1 year ago, Aug, 2012, delivered in Sept: http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/141724032-post10.html

He has been having codes since he bought it. As he posted in Nov 2012,

[edit] you are getting a lot of advice from people who are guessing about what might be wrong. Time to start diagnosing and stop guessing.

 

If he has the same codes now as before the kit install that would seem to tell us that he did the install correctly unless he had a bad connection and managed to keep it bad after the install.

It appears that he has other issues.

I hope you can put this behind you soon Ketel and I'm sure you will.