Straight into the radar detector, intentionally! | FerrariChat

Straight into the radar detector, intentionally!

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by Steve R, May 20, 2005.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. Steve R

    Steve R F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Sep 15, 2004
    3,018
    MeSoNeedy, CA
    Full Name:
    TorQ Master
    Spooky. That's the word for it. Not every day do you experience the opportunity to stand next to law enforcement and look down the barrel of their radar technology for catching speeders...but we did, and I'm here to talk about it!

    This morning Mike picked me up and we went out towards Westlake to meet a CHP office that Mike had befriended. The plan was to test Mike's K40 radar detection AND DIFFUSION system and see what the reality was. The officer was as curious as we were, and so it was set: we get to speed right at a uniformed law man and not get a ticket....right into the spiders web, the lions lair, the woman's hair-salon.......muahahahaha!!!!!!

    As we exited the offramp the officer pulled up next to us on his motorcycle...already we felt the nervous anticipation set it. Cruising along next to the cop must have been an interesting sight for onlookers...prey & predator along side eachother. Mike's grip tightened on the steering wheel, sweat poured down my forehead.....

    We pulled over near a driveway and chatted for a while. We looked over his system while he examed ours. Mike has radar sensors in front & back AND diffusers front & back as well. The officer had the series 3 unit that was a couple years old, that and a shotgun, billy-club and a few other tricks. Technology vs technology...which would emerge the victor? The time for talking was over...negotiations broke down...time to hit the street:

    Mike took his 355 up the street and turned around to make his first approach. I stood next to the officer and watched him take position. The new guns are interesting....they have to hold them upto their eye and just like looking through a scope they put a laser on your car to "lock-in" and get your speed.

    Mike came charging down the hill, the officer pulled his trigger and engaged his Weapon of Massive Detection.....I heard a grunt and some verbal mumbling, the officer said "hmmm....I can't get a lock on him". Excitement rushed through my mind....could we actually have the upper hand on The Man?

    In no time Mike drove past with that nutty look on his face "Look, I'm speeding past a cop and getting away with it!!!"......Mike would later report that his unit did go off and detect radar pinging him.

    Quick side-not: Mike explained that the unit was supposed to send-out a signal that would make the cop's gun read 20mph. This did not happen, the officer couldn't get a lock on him, that's all. Back to the story...

    As Mike drove past, the officer turned his gun to the 355's backside: BANG, the gun came back with a speed and continued to track his speed for nearly 400 feet with no problems at all. Uh-oh....not good.

    Mike did another u-turn and began his charge again, coming back for another round. This time the officer took a steady stance and pulled the trigger. BAM!! From over 400 feet away the gun locked on Mike's front-end and tracked him all the way until he passed us AND continued to track for hundreds of feet as Mike passed him.

    CONCLUSIONS:

    Do the Diffusers work: HELL NO, IT'S ALL BULL**** and the cop mentioned that it was illegal and he'd nail anyone projecting such signals if he could catch them....

    Did the radar detector work: Yes, it detected his radar gun and Mike knew exactly when the cop pulled the trigger. Problem is, the cop explained that usually the gun will lock almost immediately...so once your detector goes off, he probably already has you....but not exactly: sometimes and hopefully your detector will go off as he is using his gun on another car...so YES, the detectors can save your bacon at times.

    Okay, okay...so why did the cop fail to get a lock on Mike when he made his first pass? He explained: the gun has to hit a good surface. He doesn't shoot at windshields or hoods...he aims for a flat surface. The profile of the 355 does not offer much surface on the front, but the rear-end is a cinch! On the first pass the officer didn't hold the gun steady enough and on the same spot long enough for the gun to lock....but we know from the other runs it can and does. If an officer has the gun resting on his handlebars or window sill...then he's lethal, but free-standing...depends on how much sleep he got the night before (and what he drank for breakfast)!

    I picked the officers brain a bit more. It is wise to hit the brakes as soon as you can, two reasons. 1) If the gun has not gotten a lock, it may give you some reduced speed and 2) he says he is doing his job to slow you down and so you express knowledge that you are speeding. He said that many people just keep speeding and that pisses him off. So yes, slow down even if it's obvious you are on the brakes!

    So what does it come down to? Well...much like the stealth bomber & fighter, it's all about profile and how much surface area you have to send back info to the gun. The cop says they often shoot at headlights or bumpers. My thought is to hit the brakes AND move abruptly to the edge of the lane...thus creating a slowing AND moving target! Don't move too much or they'll think your drunk...but moving within the lane challenges them a bit....maybe enough to prevent a lock form the gun!

    I'm sure I'll think of more to add to this report, but my only thought at this point is that diffusers are all hype, slow & jibe when getting scoped and DON'T GET CAUGHT. Course, none of us law-abiding drivers speed, that would be those clowns on the other forum! ;)
     
  2. Steve King

    Steve King F1 Rookie

    Feb 15, 2001
    4,367
    NY
    Now you know why they want a flat front serfice (licence plate) so they can lock on. Also if you follow a rabbit you will catch the stray signal and be able to slow down.
     
  3. Ike

    Ike F1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2003
    3,543
    Is this a radar or lidar(laser) jammer that is supposed to make the gun read 20? I am assuming it is a radar jammer. The radar jammers are illegal and usually do not work. The Lidar jammers are very effective and are legal b/c they only use ir light and not radio waves. CA may have made them illegal but in most places they are legal. They do not make the gun display a certain speed though that is why I am assuming the one that was tested was a radar jammer.

    The lidatek units are very good and also work on most laser guns in europe too. They were used a lot in the Gumball Europe with very good results.

    Thanks for the write up it was interesting.
     
  4. tvu

    tvu Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 13, 2004
    1,364
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Trieu
    Thanks for the great report. I wonder what about all those guarantee where they will pay for your ticket if you have their products installed? They probably will end up saying you didn't have it correctly installed, or by a certified installer, etc....

    Thanks again
     
  5. SrfCity

    SrfCity F1 World Champ

    Thanks that's very helpful stuff. I doubt a license plate is a big enough object to lock onto. Sounds like if you're blasting along in the wide open that's when you're really taking your chances.
     
  6. Ike

    Ike F1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2003
    3,543
    I think those are the Rocky Mountain Radar products which are total garbage Someone on F chat a while back had some post about his not working.

    Radar Jammers do not work and they are illegal. Lidar jammers send pulses of IR light that disrupt the laser signal and cause the gun to not give a reading.

    I will get some links up in a few minutes
     
  7. MalcQV

    MalcQV F1 Rookie

    Oct 11, 2004
    3,292
    Manchester, UK
    Full Name:
    Malc Holden
    In the UK they generally use the Registration (licence) plate to lock onto.
     
  8. Ike

    Ike F1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2003
    3,543
  9. Steve R

    Steve R F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Sep 15, 2004
    3,018
    MeSoNeedy, CA
    Full Name:
    TorQ Master
    Gentlemen....

    Mike and the officer were discussing the lack of front license plate. YES, the license plate is the primary target of the radar guns!!!!!!!!! The officer was pointing out that it may make it tougher on him to gun the car because of the lack of front plate.

    The unit Mike has is a K40, the rear license plate frame has an integrated sensor and "jammer/diffuser". I am not entirely familiar with the exact model or technology....I'm only here to disclose the results ;)
     
  10. Ike

    Ike F1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2003
    3,543
    I just found this. It looks like the Lidatek doesnt do anything either, at least for these guys. I've talked to a couple of guys that used in in the Gumball and they had nothing but praise for it. Maybe they thought it was working and it wasn't.

    I don't know anymore. Guess I will just slow down LOL. I've been meaning to order one but everytime I go to something comes up that needs money. Maybe its for the best.

    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54977

    One thing I can say though is that My escort passport is sensitive enough to pick up laser being shot at the 3-4 cars in front of me. It will go off in little burst and then one big alert when he hits me. So that helps some.
     
  11. whart

    whart F1 Veteran
    Honorary Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 5, 2001
    6,570
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    William Maxwell Hart
    I suspect, given that he has a K-40 and you've described the rear diffuser as part of a license plate frame, that he is running K-40 diffusers as well. I believe those are "passive," not active, and frankly, i don't bother with them. The best protection is the stray signals that are aimed at someone up ahead, and trip your detector in advance of a sight line by the officer. After that, it really is up to the discretion of the cop. I've also heard good things about the Lidatek, but have not used them. I am hooked on the Valentine as a detector, it gives an awful lot of false readings but it's a blessing. PS: thanks for the test results!
     
  12. caseykimma

    caseykimma Formula 3

    Jun 5, 2004
    1,345
    Reading, PA
    Full Name:
    Casey
    interesting read...disappointing that it doesnt work, however.
     
  13. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    6,124
    USA
    WH - you think the false alarms are worth it? I have an Escort and am thinking of "upgrading" but I get almost no false alarms with teh Escort and am worried the V1 is going to become really annoying.
     
  14. Ike

    Ike F1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2003
    3,543

    I have the Passport. I have it in Expert mode so I can get up to 6 or 8 signals at once. I forgot exactly how many.

    I have X turned off and leave it on highway and hardly ever get a false except when I am in shopping centers.
     
  15. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 30, 2003
    18,077
    Savannah


    me. ROCKY MOUTNTAIN RADAR SUCKS, i returned their newest , best detector to them with delivery confirmation, and i had to get my credit card company involved as they would not credit the account. also the crappy voice feature that sounds like a bad commercial every time it turns on, cannot be completely turned off.

    they suck balls and i DONT RECOMMEND THEM :mad:
     
  16. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 30, 2003
    18,077
    Savannah


    my next one is an Escort 8500.
     
  17. Steve R

    Steve R F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Sep 15, 2004
    3,018
    MeSoNeedy, CA
    Full Name:
    TorQ Master
    Oh....just remembered something else, I did say more would like come to mind:

    The cop said having the detector up front near the plate is optimal: that's where he targets the radar gun, but at the same Whart is correct in that you want to detect the gun being used ahead of you....so having it higher can see past the cars in front of you: tough call...
     
  18. whart

    whart F1 Veteran
    Honorary Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 5, 2001
    6,570
    Austin, TX
    Full Name:
    William Maxwell Hart
    You can turn off X or filter out other bands, i think, on the Valentine- i don't bother- i set the mute to a comfortable level, and get accustomed to tapping it whenever i get a read- a "false" will fade away, whereas a real one will keep on going and/or additional signals may come up. I guess what i'm saying is that i'd rather have it ultra-sensitive, and get the garbage too, than miss an important telltale. For example, last night, i was cranking around this huge 320 degree sweeper that starts at the exit off the Tappan Zee bridge, and keeps going around, and going around until it comes almost full circle on a different plane about a 1/2 mile away. I got a tickle as soon as i got on the ramp; another one when i finally swung off the sweeper down onto the streets;a local cop was lurking under the ramp.
    I've had K-40 "stealth" installs in 4 or 5 cars, and Valentines, either stealth or just hangin (hardwired, of course) in that many cars as well. I guess i like the directional arrows, and the overall user friendliness of the Valentine.
     
  19. nocturne1

    nocturne1 Formula 3

    Sep 8, 2004
    2,095
    Foothill Ranch, CA
    Full Name:
    Jay
    I have the same here as well. I turn off K also, since AFAIK it's not used here in southern CA, and it eliminates all falses..... Seems to all be only KA and laser here (someone please correct me if I'm wrong!).
     
  20. Gershwin

    Gershwin F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2005
    6,415
    Kentucky
    huh?......
    "I'd recommend anyone that "ball-sucks"

    kidding aside,

    That's why my philosophy is find a good front door and back door and stay in the rocking chair, good buddy.

    10-4
     
  21. JaguarXJ6

    JaguarXJ6 F1 Veteran

    Feb 12, 2003
    5,533
    Black Hawk, CO
    Full Name:
    Sunny
    CHP use K band as well as Ka so turn that band back on ASAP!

    I have the last revision V1 which is superior to the newest revision detection wise but lacks POP capability. I don't get falses, period, that aren't something, such as a nearby mall, security system, highway monitoring device. Its never gone off when I'm in the middle of no mans land.

    I come across 3-4 radar "traps" per week and 1/2 of those are on K band and I always get a 15 second or more warning if I'm going 40-50mph. I work in Simi Valley and live in Burbank and make the 170 to 5 to 118 Mon-Fri.

    Sunny
     
  22. RacerX_GTO

    RacerX_GTO F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 2, 2003
    14,764
    Oregon
    Full Name:
    Gabe V.
    The Stalker Dual will kick down to K band, so yes, it is a good idea to keep those bands open. However, from what I've been told by "CHP know-it-alls" is that the Stalker's advanced features will only work in Ka mode, which is a very strong signal in which your V1's and Belltronics should be sniffing that band miles away.

    Anyone have a copy of the Stalker Dual manual to verify that?
     
  23. Ike

    Ike F1 Rookie

    Nov 4, 2003
    3,543
    I wonder if that is what the local police are using here. I will get a 1 K signal then it will switch to 1 KA as I get closer. I guess it could be that k and ka are close to the same frequency.
     
  24. Steve King

    Steve King F1 Rookie

    Feb 15, 2001
    4,367
    NY
    I doubt a license plate is a big enough object to lock onto.

    Sorry Sfrcity but the PRIMARY target for laser radar is the front or rear licence plate. The systems used in NY are rifle stock mounted and are easy for the troups to aim . So the first flat and biggest surface is the plate. And the lock is usually in 1-2 seconds depending on distance. So unless you get a stray signal you are zapped. The unwritten rule around here is 9 mph over the limit and you are OK unless you are in a city school zone or a construction zone. The latest here is the 45mph construction zone where they tag you for 46-48mph and the fine is double. Enjoy the ride
     
  25. Mike C

    Mike C F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Aug 3, 2002
    6,081
    Southeast USA
    Full Name:
    Mike Charness
    I beg to differ on the first point, at least. While passive jammers (white noise) don't work any better than a box of Kleenex on your dashboard, active radar jammers DO work on X -and K-band.

    See the real-life tests I did some years ago which were published in the FCA NewsBulletin. The articles are reprinted here:

    www.ferrariclub.com/faq/jammers.html

    Unfortunately, though, Ka-band has gotten much cheaper and is now commonly in use by police officers these days. I've not seen a Ka-band jammer that works.
     

Share This Page