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Stratos induction system on 246GT

Discussion in '206/246' started by Pantdino, Aug 28, 2005.

  1. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    Chris
    Absolutely. Happy to help.
     
  2. DinoLasse

    DinoLasse Formula Junior
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    Freeman,

    I am doing exactly that. A spare, modified engine lid just happened to be available. It is shaped like a standard lid, but only about 10 mm higher than the stock lid. I believe that the untrained eye will not even notice. We'll see, once it gets painted and fitted to the car, but I think it will look acceptable. But of course, I will also be interested in any solution that fits under the stock lid - as long as it does not compromise performance. What you and Alberto are discussing sounds very promising.

    I agree that 40 IDFs are more than adequate, but I am going all out for performance on this engine, particularly at top end of the rpm range. And that is where bigger carburetors really help, in my experience. Besides, I really love what oversize carburetors do to an engine! Personal preferences, as always.

    Lars
     
  3. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
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    Alberto
    Freeman, you have a pm.

    Regards, Alberto
     
  4. Pantdino4

    Pantdino4 Karting

    Sep 17, 2015
    143
    Freeman,

    Do you mean adding the stacks made it sound more sporty, or the change to the Stratos induction system made it sound more sporty? At this point you have no air box so you will hear the intake roar more.

    I would never consider going back to the stock arrangement, as the engine sounds so beautiful with just a layer of paper filter between my ear and the stacks.. Without stacks I suspect you would hear more hissing as the air goes around the sharp edge of the carb throat.

    I will be interested to see how putting a closed air box on it changes the sound.

    Scientifically my understanding is that an engine running too rich will run fine but just not make optimal power. And that will depend on which jets are too rich. Your idle jets could be too rich but the main jets could be fine or even too lean. Then there are the aerator units, which also come in different sizes. IDFs are actually pretty complex carbs and there lots of things to adjust.
     
  5. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    Jim,

    The open velocity stacks create an amazing sound behind my head!! Just changing to the Stratos induction has made the car sportier and more responsive. The jetting and overall setup is standard Stratos Stradale. We didn't change anything. Ran perfect out of the box. All we did was lean the mixture a bit. It runs really happy.

    The reason I want an enclosed airbox is to feed it cold air and to protect against backfires. The design I'm working on allows for the complete top to come off and display the open velocity stacks.

    Freeman
     
  6. Pantdino4

    Pantdino4 Karting

    Sep 17, 2015
    143
    My fear is that when you put a lid on the box you will lose most of that intake roar you love. The sound waves will then have to go out thru the long intake system and air filter box and get lost / cancelled out in the process.
     
  7. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    I won't know until we test it. An advantage of the concept is it's possible to take the top off which leaves the baseplate with the exposed trumpets.

    Freeman
     
  8. Telaio

    Telaio Karting

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    Hi Fellow Dino'istas, may please I share my own experiences with you ........ whilst it may be wonderful to chase down a cake n coffee morning enriched by an open inlet tract orchestra and we've all done it, long time touring and living with such a racket is quite a different affair ........ after my 1st European tour four years ago I couldn't walk straight for two weeks such was the noise related stress !!!! I'm convinced that you are on the right track Freeman, air induction noise is a much ignored subject, it's all about balance ......... We needs to experience life to the full to appreciate true bliss; ............ cheers all, Kev. ps I have no allegiance or connections to sound and heat insulation suppliers but fully appreciate their wares.
     
  9. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    #159 4CamGT, Sep 6, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2016
    Kevin,

    You hit the nail on the head! It's really about balance! To have balance, it's not just about one thing. The Dino trip you spontaneously took to the alps and back from the UK demonstrates you have a well balanced machine. That is my dream!

    Freeman
     
  10. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    #160 cnpapa24, Sep 10, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Freeman,

    I hope this is the shot you asked for. It would take a bit more work to remove the entire air box.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  11. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    Fantastic Chris! Any way to get a measurement from the carb top to the inside of the lid?

    Freeman
     
  12. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    #162 4CamGT, Sep 11, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2016
    Chris,

    This image really helped. We're well on our way with the design of the air box. We're using the know how of the Stratos air box. I'm certain Lancia spent a lot of time testing different configurations for the best performance. This validates the way the Stratos Stradale used these super low air horn plates to smooth out the air flow. Simon Leach pointed out the air box top has a concave dimple above each of the carb throats. Our theory is, this combined with the short air horn plates "fools" the carb into thinking there's a velocity stack. Our design is integrating it. Simon Leach will be fabricating it. Simon has his all aluminum Dino and after experiencing my car, he wants to do the same to his.

    To do this right is a journey and takes time. The design intent is to look like a period correct OEM part including spot welds etc and not modifying anything on the Dino including the deck lid. True "plug and play"! We'll share images once we're far enough. Hopefully for many, instead of saying, why? It'll be, why not?

    Freeman

    P.S. If anyone knows where I can find the air horn plates, it would be appreciated.
     
  13. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie
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    Sure. May be another week before I get there again.
     
  14. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    Chris,

    I appreciate it. Whenever it's convenient. I appreciate the help!

    Freeman
     
  15. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    #165 4CamGT, Sep 11, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  16. DinoLasse

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    I understand it is crankcase ventilation. Seems unusually elaborate, but makes sense to distribute the oil fumes equally and not just to one or two of the intakes.
     
  17. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    That makes sense. Thanks!

    Freeman
     
  18. Telaio

    Telaio Karting

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    Hey 4 Cam, what's the news with your Dino ......... airbox progress ????? your's in anticipation, Kev.
     
  19. 4CamGT

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    #169 4CamGT, Oct 13, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Kevin,

    It's coming along! We've got the assembly together. We're doing some final fettling. Fits under the deck lid and works really well! Looking good! Image is of Simon Leach hand fabricating the aluminum housing. More Images coming soon!!

    Freeman
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  20. Telaio

    Telaio Karting

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    Excellent progress Freemen, and a very "Pro" approach as we would expect, looking forward to more photos, cheers as ever, Kev.
     
  21. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    Simon is amazing! He is a great visual and functional artist and problem solver. Digital and mock-up was really helpful and got us 95% there. The last bit was by fitting, slight mods here and there, refitting etc etc. Simon, because he is such a huge talent, has built his Dino out of aluminum and understands every nuance, has been incredible. He is soooo patient and willing to try again and again. The success of the result is true teamwork. Simon now wants to put the Stratos/Weber IDF induction on his Dino. I think this is the best solution for all round drivability short of Kevin's programmable TBI.

    Freeman
     
  22. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
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    OK, I am back to 3rd world. Do you still wish to pursue a fiberglass velocity stack?
    With the two holes of course...

    If so please give me your max height, from bottom of flange to top of bell.

    Great airbox Freeman / Simon!

    Regards, Alberto
     
  23. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    Alberto,

    It's getting exciting!! I have a special, very short velocity stack that we developed and created in rapid prototype that I'd love for you to do in fiberglass. Can you PM me your email and I'll shoot you some photos. Thanks for the offer!

    Freeman
     
  24. 4CamGT

    4CamGT Formula 3
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    #174 4CamGT, Oct 16, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  25. ///Mike

    ///Mike F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2003
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    Picturing it in wrinkle black it looks fantastic. In my book this is a perfect mod-- it increases performance, looks period-appropriate, and can be reversed without leaving any evidence. Beautiful!
     

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