Supercharged Mondial 8 | FerrariChat

Supercharged Mondial 8

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by smg2, Aug 22, 2006.

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  1. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ
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    #1 smg2, Aug 22, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Well, it's was a great weekend and the drive back was a torture test of epic stds. somehow the nav in my wifes car decided to take us up the 101 instead of cutting over to the 5 so i ended up in walnut creek on a monday afternoon around 5pm. the stop and go traffic was brutal on the cooling system but she held on for awhile then i decided to let her cool off and took a break. found out the rad fan crapped out so that was not helping at all.

    once under way the temps held below 195F for water and 200F for oil. i have the timing retarted a bit for now until i can get to the dyno. but a 5hr drive in hot traffic and cruising speeds of 80 were no trouble and ran great.

    i'm still in need of a few carbon fiber parts to replace the makeshift intake stuff that i threw together to get to the show. with that done and some gauges hooked up the dyno testing will get under way. for now there is a noticable bump in power, more torque really. i can go up the hill to the house in 5th with no issue where as before 3rd was as far as i could go. 4th would bog and 5th was out of the question.

    below 3k the car is pretty much stock in power possibly a hair better but i don't think it's anything too noticable. from 4k it pulls ALOT harder.

    i'm excited to get her on the dyno and see whats she's doing.

    Nick followed me home on his way to Tahoe, and got some highway footage and pics. when he gets back hopefully he can post them up. the supercharger can barely be heard over the exhaust. the only time you realy hear it is when you shut off the motor. and it's not even the SQ gearing!

    for those who were able to stop by nicks booth and check out the car, thanks for coming by it was great talking to you all.
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  2. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    Wow!!
    She looks great!
    If possible would love to see the Air/Fuel ratios plotted on the dyno.

    Congrats on a clean installation!
     
  3. Chiaro_Slag

    Chiaro_Slag F1 Veteran

    Oct 31, 2003
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    Hey neighbor!

    Was great to see you again at the show. Thanks for stopping by & saying hello.
     
  4. mk e

    mk e F1 World Champ

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    Well done Scott! It already looks great.

    Have you been able to determine how much boost it's making yet or are you still in shake-down mode and waiting for the dyno? I can't wait to see the dyno numbers once you get it all dailed in.
     
  5. smg2

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    mark, still in the shake down mode. i need a BOV as i ran up 3rd and let off, the funny looking welded transition popped off the CIS. so i for now i drive like grandma and will only run up the gears provided i have no traffic and the distance.

    it does add heat to the engine but nothing major. in traffic i'd say around 30*~50* but once moving the temps stayed at the 1/4 mark. and that's without a working rad fan! the oil temps are also slightly higher as the supercharger uses engine oil to lube the gear set. even in the worst of the heat the oil hit about 215, cold really for the redline 10-30 i'm running.

    i'm not going to dyno test/tune until i have the carbon parts done. that way i have an accurate base to work from.
     
  6. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
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    Were any changes required to the CIS, or is this a straight bolt-on?
     
  7. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ
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    straight bolt on, the overall plan i decided on was to make a simple bolt on power adder without the need to replace the stock EFI or MFI in this case. the WUR ferrari used for the CIS is the same one the 911 turbo uses, it has the functionality of adjusting for boost/vacuum. hence the $$$$ cost.

    now ovecourse you'll need to tee into the oil and drain. and re-route a few lines but nothing major. it suprised me how it came together, i was really expecting some big road blocks. the biggest change will be the dampner and pulley setup but all of it can be returned to stock in an afternoon or weekend depending on how many beers you drink.

    i have had the unit itself in and out of the car 6 times one afternoon for various test fittings and mock ups.
     
  8. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Sweetness. You just cannot beat the bang for the buck of boost. Nice project. I'm curious to see what it puts down on the dyno once you have all the bugs worked out.
     
  9. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
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    May 5, 2001
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    Scott,
    It looks great, can't wait to see the dyno curves & find out how well the K-Jet manages the A/F ratio.

    Which pieces will be carbon fiber?

    Being on a budget, how much more will carbon fiber add to the cost vs less exotic materials? Know that cf has come down a lot tho, especially the non-structural cf that probably would be more than adequate for this project.
     
  10. Valence

    Valence Formula Junior

    Jan 20, 2004
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    Maybe relative to 1988, but we're paying a lot more than two years ago, and material acquisition is now almost a job unto itself. Supply is very tight. We are not currently changing most of our pricing, though, as material cost constitutes a fairly small percentage of total cost.
     
  11. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

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    Good job Scott . . . looks great!!!!

    Sean
     
  12. mk e

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    Scott, I tried to PM you, but you box is full, so you get it as a post.

    I think 25 degrees is about right for a 2v...it may even want a little more once it's tuned. The 4v doesn't like quite as much.

    I think once you get your BOV installed you will be able to let it run to all you want.....now your boost gage is installed in the plunum right, after the throttle plate? Any place before the throttle plate will read boost that isn't really because the dropped across the throttle except at WOT. The boost should come and go as you open and close the throttle at any rpm, if that is not happening, soming is not quite right. The BOV just stop excess press between the blower and the throttle plate.

    The pressure in the crankcase sounds odd. You don't have the crankcase breather still conected in anyway to the intake system do you...originally is would have been connected over there somewhere. I never had any hint of a blow-down problem, but my engine was fresh when I added boost to, that might be the difference too.

    It is addicting. I give it 2 months and you'll be changing pulleys....adding an intercooler....changing pulleys.....retiming cams....changing pulleys....porting heats.....:)
     
  13. smg2

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    the gauge is accutually a vacuum gauge attached to the EGR port before the TB plate. i have it there for idle adjustment and ran short of plugs so it stays for now. it'll read boost right about 2k when parked no load, but ofcourse this is not what the plenum is registering. curouis now i'll go read off one of the plenum ports.

    the need of the BOV is becouse the CIS uses a 'flapper' door that will slam shut in sync with the TB. as such it'll 'stack' against the charger and run the risk of surging. i've been driving around playing with revs and so far have not encountered another 'POP' although i haven't dropped the revs from 6k eithier.

    the pressure build up in the crankcase has been an issue since day 1 long before the FI. and only at 5th gear cruising speeds. i have a morose vented catch can that has a welded in 'crank vent' the 2v motors seem to have an issue with crank case buildup. the motor is a re-build by the PO from t-rutlands and has about 12k on it now. so i can't imagine it just a milage problem.

    i'll clear the PM box.
     
  14. smg2

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    #14 smg2, Aug 25, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  15. Harmonyautosport

    Harmonyautosport Formula Junior

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    Nice clean installation.
     
  16. pad

    pad Formula 3

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    Scott,

    Was wondering where you have the air filter?
     
  17. smg2

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    the air cleaner is tucked into the opening behind the side louvers. it's a K&N cone filter. i had to remove the stock fiberglass duct work to fit it in. the mondial has a very large opening compared to the 308. the mondial also has another vented duct that runs cool air over the headers and firewall to attempt to keep the heat from getting to high. not sure how the 308 manages that.
     
  18. smg2

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    #18 smg2, Sep 8, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    i have dyno time booked for saturday providing i can get some more stuff done in time. i'll be doing alot of runs over a week or two period.

    for those interested, here is some renderings of the 3d models i made for testing space and brackets. this was done in acad and done in full scale, i has to plot points off the engine and bay to make sure it all fit. from there it went into the cad program and was built virtually first.

    alot of engineering and effort went into making right the first time and look factory as well. hope i managed it. not the best renderings but you get the picture.
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  19. maurice70

    maurice70 F1 Rookie

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    Excellent work Scott and the install is very tidy.Thumbs up :)
     
  20. DavidDriver

    DavidDriver F1 Rookie

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    Wow! What an impressive job.

    Maybe next (with all that talent, you have) you should try to make one that runs on H2.
     
  21. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

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    Terrific. Very clean.
    Very impressive engineering - looking forward to the numbers.
     
  22. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ
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    thanks guys,
    sad day though, no dyno numbers tommorow. freak thing, front shock sheared the rod and i lost the suspension. no damage to the car thankfully but i'll be down until i get new parts and sort why it happened.

    i'll get pics as soon as i start the job.
     
  23. 82MondialQV

    82MondialQV Karting

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    How's the car now 6 years on?
     
  24. smg2

    smg2 F1 World Champ
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    well.. currently the engine is sitting waiting to be torn down and 'overbuilt' for another wild idea. The engine ran great for 30k miles on boost and then I wanted more, been busy with other builds and projects so it's always one step out. otherwise nary a problem, not to shabby with CIS as the fuel management, EFI would be leaps and bounds above it though.

    The current blowers I use for the builds are Rotrex head units, I liken them to belt driven turbos. Rotrex recently just redesigned the impeller and picked up 20% across the map. looking forward to testing the new design in the next month or two.
     
  25. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Did you ever get any dyno numbers?
     

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