Suspension Malfunction | FerrariChat

Suspension Malfunction

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by hogbreth, Nov 28, 2017.

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  1. hogbreth

    hogbreth Karting

    Oct 23, 2006
    115
    Florida
    Full Name:
    John Bennett
    1999 550. On the info panel I backed out of the garage and had a silhouette of the car with triangles under the 2 left wheels. Book says suspension system problem. Any thoughts on how to analyze the problem. Thanks
     
  2. ferraridriver

    ferraridriver F1 Rookie

    Aug 8, 2002
    4,134
    Bay Area Calif.
    Full Name:
    Dave
  3. G. Pepper

    G. Pepper Three Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Mar 15, 2012
    33,720
    Texas/Colorado
    Full Name:
    George Pepper
    I got that once after filling up in a lane with uneven surfaces. It was an "uneven lanes" situation, and the car thought one side of the suspension had sunk. I just went to a smooth surface, shut the car down, went in and bought a Gatorade, came out and started it up and it was fine. Sounds like you were on a perfectly flat surface though, so take Dave's advice and search the forum for suspension problems. Good news is that these are one of the simpler things to diagnose and fix.
     
    308 GTB likes this.
  4. 308 GTB

    308 GTB F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 7, 2002
    11,166
    New Jersey
    Full Name:
    Barry Wolinsky
    Me too. A couple of times at the same gas station.
     
    G. Pepper likes this.
  5. hogbreth

    hogbreth Karting

    Oct 23, 2006
    115
    Florida
    Full Name:
    John Bennett
    I don't want to seem dumb but my suspension warning light I understand is related to the shocks and I've researched on this forum a number of posts on the subject. A number of posts reference a broken plastic gear that at times has been a problem. I looked under the hood and realize I don't really understand what I'm looking for. I see a red cap on the top of the shock sticking in the engine compartment is the gear under that? I looked at the exploited view of the shock and still don't see that. Do I need to remove the shock from the car? I'd love to get that warning light out. If someone could be more specific. Thanks
     
  6. cls

    cls Formula 3

    Jun 12, 2007
    1,663
    Los Angeles/Montreal
    Full Name:
    Chris
    Yes, you need to pull the red actuator off of the shock. There's a clip at the base that you pry out, then it lifts off. There's a gear inside the actuator and one on top of each shock body. You do not need to remove the shock from the car (at least on a 456.)
     
  7. ///Mink

    ///Mink Formula Junior

    Sep 5, 2006
    808
    Fair Oaks, CA
    Full Name:
    Tom Mink
    Yup, you have to remove the actuator to see the gear (it's metal, not plastic BTW). To replace the gear you will need to remove the shock from the car, at least in the rear. You may be able to swap the front gear without removing the shock, never tried.
     
  8. AVIMAX

    AVIMAX Formula Junior

    Aug 5, 2014
    686
    Toronto
    Full Name:
    Ryan
    Check out captainzcnc.com. Some explanations and photos there to help you understand and if you have a broken actuator, they can fix it. They did one of mine, it had an electrical fault.
     
  9. Il Tifoso

    Il Tifoso Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 22, 2013
    1,546
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Full Name:
    Ruben
    A follow up question (hopefully not a silly question): when assembling the actuator back onto the shock, is there only one way that the actuator goes back in? Does the gear need to be synchronized to the shock in any particular way?

    Cheers,

    Ruben
     
  10. cls

    cls Formula 3

    Jun 12, 2007
    1,663
    Los Angeles/Montreal
    Full Name:
    Chris
    No, the actuator finds it's stops with a POST (power on self test in computer terms.)
     
  11. Il Tifoso

    Il Tifoso Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 22, 2013
    1,546
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Full Name:
    Ruben
    Thanks Chris, good to know!

    Ruben
     
  12. hogbreth

    hogbreth Karting

    Oct 23, 2006
    115
    Florida
    Full Name:
    John Bennett
    Thanks for all the help. I went under the hood and removed the air cleaners and was able to access the The red actuator. Inside the red actuator there was a small white nylon gear and the top of the shock there was a metal gear both looked fine teeth were all in tact . The nylon gear appears to float in the actuator. Could find nothing wrong. Put all back together still have suspension malfunction light. How do I access the actuator on the rear shocks to check them? tried captainzcnc.com not valid.
     
  13. hogbreth

    hogbreth Karting

    Oct 23, 2006
    115
    Florida
    Full Name:
    John Bennett
    Found captain Z cnc by google thanks again
     
  14. ferraridriver

    ferraridriver F1 Rookie

    Aug 8, 2002
    4,134
    Bay Area Calif.
    Full Name:
    Dave
    If you read my link there are three more and each can set that light for various reasons, some of which CaptZ can not fix.

    If you want to stop guessing go to someone with an SD diagnostic unit. None of the others can diagnosis this system even though they say they can. Just looking at them in not going to help.
     
    f355spider likes this.
  15. hogbreth

    hogbreth Karting

    Oct 23, 2006
    115
    Florida
    Full Name:
    John Bennett
    I live in a small town in Florida i will check but I doubt anyone even knows what that is. thanks
     
  16. ferraridriver

    ferraridriver F1 Rookie

    Aug 8, 2002
    4,134
    Bay Area Calif.
    Full Name:
    Dave
    OK,
    The first (easiest) thing to check is the shock ECU connection. Is it plugged in and getting power? It has two connectors, yellow and green. The ECU is located behind the kick panel on the passenger side.

    Now this will take two people. have someone sit in the car and turn the key on while you hold each actuator. You should be able to feel the electric motor go through it's learning procedure turning all the way one way then back all the way in the other direction then going to a mid point. This only takes a moment or so. If you remove the actuator you can see the gear turning.

    The problem is that when you cycle the key three or more times without driving some distance the light will set on. Just driving a short distance will turn it off so you will have to move the car after every three key cycles.

    If you do this to all four actuators you might get lucky and find the one that either does not run at all (no power due to a broken wire inside actuator or the connector) or just continues to turn (broken gear on shock rod or broken internal gears in actuator. (Once again refer to my link, it explains some of the possible internal failures ).

    CaptZ can fix the white plastic gear you can see but they can not fix the internal gears inside the case, what I call the transmission gears. These are planetary gears and if they're broken you need a new actuator.

    Alternatively you can get a known good actuator and replace each actuator in turn until you find the bad one, just remember three key cycles sets the light.

    The plus with this procedure is you can inspect the small gear on the top of the shock rod which is a known failure point.

    Good luck
     
    JayEff likes this.
  17. cls

    cls Formula 3

    Jun 12, 2007
    1,663
    Los Angeles/Montreal
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    Chris
    4 actuators, three cycles. Some engineer had a sense of humor.
     
  18. Konadog06

    Konadog06 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 22, 2007
    959
    Daytona Beach, Florida
    Full Name:
    Bill
    John post in the Florida section of this forum and ask for an independent recommendation listing your area. Most good techs even in smaller towns have the necessary equipment to get the answers you may need.
    Bill
    FL
     
  19. hogbreth

    hogbreth Karting

    Oct 23, 2006
    115
    Florida
    Full Name:
    John Bennett
    Ferraridriver I wanted to mention that this is a 1999 550 European car and there is no OBD port can it still be scanned? how to access actuator on rear shock
     
  20. cls

    cls Formula 3

    Jun 12, 2007
    1,663
    Los Angeles/Montreal
    Full Name:
    Chris
    It can be scanned through the Ferrari diagnostic ports.
     
  21. ferraridriver

    ferraridriver F1 Rookie

    Aug 8, 2002
    4,134
    Bay Area Calif.
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    Dave
    Remove rear wheel, remove inner fender top cover, it ain't easy and it ain't fun
     
  22. hogbreth

    hogbreth Karting

    Oct 23, 2006
    115
    Florida
    Full Name:
    John Bennett
    thank you for the help got it
     
  23. ferraridriver

    ferraridriver F1 Rookie

    Aug 8, 2002
    4,134
    Bay Area Calif.
    Full Name:
    Dave
    The suspension warning light system can not be accessed via the OBD port, only through the Ferrari connections behind the fuse panel.

    The main reason for getting a SD scan is it will tell you which actuator has malfunctioned, it won't tell you what failed.

    Considering how difficult getting to the rear actuators is it may be worth it to locate someone who has an SD diagnostic tool.

    I know I have done so on several occasions. After I know which corner to work on I tackle it myself.

    The suggestion to look in your local forum for help locating a SD tool was a good one.
     
  24. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    17,913
    USA
    Note also, that you should use a magnifying glass when examining the gear on the top of each shock. I had the suspension light illuminated on my 355, and checked all the gears, they looked fine. Then I took a "known good" actuator and moved it through each corner of the car, turning on the ignition, and could not get the light to go out. Took it to the dealer and they immediately diagnosed with the SD unit the problem was the left rear. Sure enough, upon closer examination, the gear on top had some damage down low. From the top it looked perfectly fine, all teeth in place, but when you looked down lower, they were missing...and apparently the actuator was slipping off the gear since there wasn't enough of it to grab onto. New gear Hill Engineering gear from Ricambi America and I was back in business.
     
  25. ross

    ross Three Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Mar 25, 2002
    36,210
    houston/geneva
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    Ross
    this may sound simplistic, but whenever i have had that particular symbol come up, i have just turned the battery switch to off, waited a few minutes, and then turned it all back on again, and it went away.
     

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